Author Topic: why am I not suprised.  (Read 9055 times)

Cramulus

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Re: why am I not suprised.
« Reply #45 on: September 22, 2009, 11:50:35 pm »
PALIN 2012
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Cainad (dec.)

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Re: why am I not suprised.
« Reply #46 on: September 22, 2009, 11:57:19 pm »
PALIN 2012
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PALIN 2012


FUCK YES


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Iason Ouabache

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Re: why am I not suprised.
« Reply #47 on: September 23, 2009, 12:08:35 am »
BTW, Santorum has been talking about running in 2012 also. Can you imagine a Santorum/Palin ticket?   :horrormirth:
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Kai

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Re: why am I not suprised.
« Reply #48 on: September 23, 2009, 12:13:03 am »
BTW, Santorum has been talking about running in 2012 also. Can you imagine a Santorum/Palin ticket?   :horrormirth:

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Re: why am I not suprised.
« Reply #49 on: September 23, 2009, 12:59:54 am »
5% of Americans?

COMMUNISM!  DEATH PANELS!  OBAMA WANTS TO KILL YOUR GRANDMA!

Well, at least you guys know one thing for sure, now.  Obama does not have the balls to stand up against the wingnuts, either based on principle or even wounded ego (even if he is in the pocket of pharamceuticals and insurance companies, in his position I'd be tempted to make the bill include more clauses orientated towards the public option - just to show the bastards I couldn't be intimidated by them).

So next time the rich and powerful and not especially caring for the democratic process want something out of Obama, guess what is going to happen?  That's right, crazies out of the closet, talking about incipient tyranny and socialism, with pre-made signs, bused in to protest by astro-turfing faux grass roots organisations.

The Republic and liberal democracy = pwned, 169%

I don't think Obama had any intention of ever standing up to the wingnuts.  This was never anything other than a direct transfer of wealth into the pockets of industry buddies.  Even if we had a public option, it'd *still* just be a way to give certain corporations more money.

He covered his bets too, on the off chance congress includes some kind of regulation meant to help bring the cost of health care down, the woman he appointed to Health and Human Services, the department reponsible for enforcing any new regulation, is a medical supply industry executive.  Enforcement will be gravely lacking.

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The Good Reverend Roger

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Re: why am I not suprised.
« Reply #50 on: September 23, 2009, 02:35:35 am »
BTW, Santorum has been talking about running in 2012 also. Can you imagine a Santorum/Palin ticket?   :horrormirth:

Dirty Ricky?  For real?   :lulz:
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Iason Ouabache

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Re: why am I not suprised.
« Reply #51 on: September 23, 2009, 06:29:31 am »
http://www.philly.com/philly/blogs/harrisburg_politics/Santorum_considers_presidential_run_in_2012.html

Quote
Former Pennsylvania Sen. Rick Santorum says he is considering seeking the Republican nomination for president in 2012, calling President Obama vulnerable to a challenge from the right and his policies “injurious to America.”

“The dynamic has changed,” Santorum said Tuesday on a RNC conference call with reporters to discuss Obama’s fundraiser for Sen. Arlen Specter (D.,Pa.). “A lot of folks who wouldn’t have thought about running against an incumbent president” are thinking about it. “If you’d asked the question a couple of months ago…”

Santorum cited Obama’s declining poll numbers and the furor over his plans to overhaul health care and the huge federal spending on the stimulus package and bank and auto-industry bailouts.  Most of all, Santorum said that Obama has “failed to deliver on what he promised, to be a transformative president” who would unify the country.

A lot of people are going to take a look and see what they can do to confront this presidency, which many of us –as you are seeing from the tea parties and the like – which many of us believe is injurious to America,” Santorum said. He said a 2012 race is “something that I think I would consider.”

Santorum was responding to Commonwealth Confidential’s question about his recent statement to a national group of Catholic leaders that he was thinking about running and asking for prayers. He was answering a question from a member of the audience at the group’s convention when he said he had thought about a presidential run. Santorum said Tuesday that he was trying to make the point that the political climate had turned more favorable to any conservative challenge to Obama.

“I went from not considering it at all to saying I would consider it – and that’s as far as I’m willing to go 3 ½ years out,” Santorum said.
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Golden Applesauce

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Re: why am I not suprised.
« Reply #52 on: September 23, 2009, 06:51:00 am »
America - We've had a good run.
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Re: why am I not suprised.
« Reply #53 on: September 23, 2009, 01:51:49 pm »
BTW, Santorum has been talking about running in 2012 also. Can you imagine a Santorum/Palin ticket?   :horrormirth:

What I am envisioning now is Palin covered with Santorum.


:fap:

AFK

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Re: why am I not suprised.
« Reply #54 on: September 23, 2009, 02:04:59 pm »
Let me start by saying the bill that "bought and paid for" Baucus came out with is pretty awful.  The absence of a public option being a big issue.  Now, let me also say, that I do happen to agree with the notion of every American being required to have health insurance.  Now, before you blow up, hear me out. 

When an uninsured person gets sick, where do they go?  The only place they can go, the Emergency Room.  These people potentially get in the way of insured people who need emergency care as well.  Not only that, when they are treated, the cost gets foisted on the rest of us in the form of higher premiums, co-pays, etc.,  Now, of course, there need to be provisions for people who are unemployed, part-time employees making chicken scratch for wages, homeless, etc.  Basically people in poverty.  A good bill would have some kind of hardship waiver and I actually recall Obama mentioning something about a hardship waiver related to the mandated insurance idea.  In other words, those who can pay should pay. 

There was never any way we were going to get "free" health care.  There's no such thing.  Even if we went to a single payer system, we would still be paying a premium, but it would be something that comes out of our paychecks.   But for some reason most Americans can't stomach that kind of system, so if we are going to do reform, we're going to have to use a half-ass approach.  And even the Public Option wasn't going to be free.  It would've been run like a non-profit which would be beneficial because they don't have the overhead of advertising costs, high executive salaries, etc.  So the premium would've been very very low. 

Anyway, those are just some of my thoughts.  I do agree the proposal from Baucus' group is pretty bad.  I think there were good ideas, but they, so far, are being drawn up very poorly. 
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The Good Reverend Roger

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Re: why am I not suprised.
« Reply #55 on: September 23, 2009, 05:14:37 pm »
Let me start by saying the bill that "bought and paid for" Baucus came out with is pretty awful.  The absence of a public option being a big issue.  Now, let me also say, that I do happen to agree with the notion of every American being required to have health insurance.  Now, before you blow up, hear me out. 

When an uninsured person gets sick, where do they go?  The only place they can go, the Emergency Room.  These people potentially get in the way of insured people who need emergency care as well.  Not only that, when they are treated, the cost gets foisted on the rest of us in the form of higher premiums, co-pays, etc.,  Now, of course, there need to be provisions for people who are unemployed, part-time employees making chicken scratch for wages, homeless, etc.  Basically people in poverty.  A good bill would have some kind of hardship waiver and I actually recall Obama mentioning something about a hardship waiver related to the mandated insurance idea.  In other words, those who can pay should pay. 

There was never any way we were going to get "free" health care.  There's no such thing.  Even if we went to a single payer system, we would still be paying a premium, but it would be something that comes out of our paychecks.   But for some reason most Americans can't stomach that kind of system, so if we are going to do reform, we're going to have to use a half-ass approach.  And even the Public Option wasn't going to be free.  It would've been run like a non-profit which would be beneficial because they don't have the overhead of advertising costs, high executive salaries, etc.  So the premium would've been very very low. 

Anyway, those are just some of my thoughts.  I do agree the proposal from Baucus' group is pretty bad.  I think there were good ideas, but they, so far, are being drawn up very poorly. 

Mode income in the USA is $19,900/year.  Yeah, they can afford health care.
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Idem

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Re: why am I not suprised.
« Reply #56 on: September 23, 2009, 05:31:02 pm »
Next they just need to make it illegal to sue health insurance companies.

The Good Reverend Roger

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Re: why am I not suprised.
« Reply #57 on: September 23, 2009, 05:44:27 pm »
Next they just need to make it illegal to sue health insurance companies.

And then totally deregulate them.  The Free Market™ will sort all this shit out.
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- TGRR, shaming himself forever, 7/8/2017

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- TGRR, raising the bar at work.

AFK

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Re: why am I not suprised.
« Reply #58 on: September 23, 2009, 06:06:26 pm »
Mode income in the USA is $19,900/year.  Yeah, they can afford health care.

No, they couldn't afford it the way the GOP wants them to afford it.  And that's where I think a hardship waiver should come into play.  Or a public option with a sliding fee scale.  Someone making 19,900 a year certainly can't afford the premium I pay for my insurance.  But they could contribute something to a public option where the premium was based upon your earnings.  So someone who is making a pittance pays a pittance of a premium but still gets the same kind of coverage.  Of course this would have to be subsidized in some way so that it doesn't constantly run in the red. 
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Re: why am I not suprised.
« Reply #59 on: September 23, 2009, 06:14:29 pm »
Mode income in the USA is $19,900/year.  Yeah, they can afford health care.

No, they couldn't afford it the way the GOP wants them to afford it.  And that's where I think a hardship waiver should come into play.  Or a public option with a sliding fee scale.  Someone making 19,900 a year certainly can't afford the premium I pay for my insurance.  But they could contribute something to a public option where the premium was based upon your earnings.  So someone who is making a pittance pays a pittance of a premium but still gets the same kind of coverage.  Of course this would have to be subsidized in some way so that it doesn't constantly run in the red. 

I think you may have missed a hint of sarcasm.
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