Author Topic: Some simple facts about the future people would rather not face  (Read 13224 times)

East Coast Hustle

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Re: Some simple facts about the future people would rather not face
« Reply #15 on: July 18, 2011, 12:20:14 am »
Name one agricultural byproduct (i.e. something that is NOT in and of itself a food product) that can be used to make ethanol on a large enough scale for it to matter.
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Re: Some simple facts about the future people would rather not face
« Reply #16 on: July 18, 2011, 12:29:59 am »
Yeah.  And it may only take 6 degrees to put us on that path.  That's when an ocean anoxic event should take place, killing everything in the ocean which relies on oxygen, building up hydrogen sulphide in the depths...which will of course eventually get into the atmosphere via rain.  That's it, then.  Assuming humanity survives what comes before, with Europe and North America turning into deserts reaching up to the arctic circle, and Holland, Bangladesh and parts of the Chinese coast being wiped off the map completely.

The worst that can happen is a cataclysm on the scale of the Permian extinction. 4 million years of worms and cockroaches, baby. But Earth will bounce back. Humans...ah well. Should get some interesting life forms out of it though.

This planet will thankfully never reach the level of Venus, one, because it's not close enough to the Sun, two, because there are organisms here which feed on just about anything that can be provided; any spike in levels will cause a spike in those, and gradually the levels will decrease. Again, the Permian was the worst extinction event the planet has ever seen, it's called the Great Dying for a reason. And it ended some of the most successful lineages in history (e.g. trilobites), 96% of all marine species and 3/4ths all terrestrial vertebrates. And if you read up on it, this is /exactly/ the same sort of path we are headed for right now. I don't see any primates surviving it.

Yeah, I wouldn't see us going all the way, but it'll be close enough for us to make no difference.

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Re: Some simple facts about the future people would rather not face
« Reply #17 on: July 18, 2011, 01:08:20 am »
Yeah.  And it may only take 6 degrees to put us on that path.  That's when an ocean anoxic event should take place, killing everything in the ocean which relies on oxygen, building up hydrogen sulphide in the depths...which will of course eventually get into the atmosphere via rain.  That's it, then.  Assuming humanity survives what comes before, with Europe and North America turning into deserts reaching up to the arctic circle, and Holland, Bangladesh and parts of the Chinese coast being wiped off the map completely.

The worst that can happen is a cataclysm on the scale of the Permian extinction. 4 million years of worms and cockroaches, baby. But Earth will bounce back. Humans...ah well. Should get some interesting life forms out of it though.

This planet will thankfully never reach the level of Venus, one, because it's not close enough to the Sun, two, because there are organisms here which feed on just about anything that can be provided; any spike in levels will cause a spike in those, and gradually the levels will decrease. Again, the Permian was the worst extinction event the planet has ever seen, it's called the Great Dying for a reason. And it ended some of the most successful lineages in history (e.g. trilobites), 96% of all marine species and 3/4ths all terrestrial vertebrates. And if you read up on it, this is /exactly/ the same sort of path we are headed for right now. I don't see any primates surviving it.

Yeah, I wouldn't see us going all the way, but it'll be close enough for us to make no difference.

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Re: Some simple facts about the future people would rather not face
« Reply #18 on: July 18, 2011, 01:10:16 am »
Name one agricultural byproduct (i.e. something that is NOT in and of itself a food product) that can be used to make ethanol on a large enough scale for it to matter.

Cornstalks.
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Re: Some simple facts about the future people would rather not face
« Reply #19 on: July 18, 2011, 09:55:37 am »
You know, if I really sat down and thought about the above for a while, I think it would make me pants shitting terrified and suicidal.

Yup :(

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Re: Some simple facts about the future people would rather not face
« Reply #20 on: July 18, 2011, 02:00:47 pm »
Name one agricultural byproduct (i.e. something that is NOT in and of itself a food product) that can be used to make ethanol on a large enough scale for it to matter.

Agricultural waste (including cornstalks, like BH suggested) and maybe algae, but the best species of algae for fuel are high fat producers, but even those usually produce some carbohydrates. Then again, all of these are/could be be used as feed for animals (silage), so, none really. Not personally a fan of ethanol for fuel except as an emergency substitute.

My current pet alternative fuel is silicon.


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Re: Some simple facts about the future people would rather not face
« Reply #21 on: July 18, 2011, 03:01:28 pm »
at what point would you prognosticate that these facts will become overwhelmingly obvious to the masses? (or at least to all the decision makers)

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Re: Some simple facts about the future people would rather not face
« Reply #22 on: July 18, 2011, 04:14:52 pm »
Name one agricultural byproduct (i.e. something that is NOT in and of itself a food product) that can be used to make ethanol on a large enough scale for it to matter.

Cornstalks.

You understand that it takes more than a gallon of ethanol's worth of energy to get a gallon of ethanol from corn, right?

Nevermind what the phosphate-laden runoff from growing corn does to rivers and the Gulf.
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Re: Some simple facts about the future people would rather not face
« Reply #23 on: July 18, 2011, 04:17:47 pm »
Name one agricultural byproduct (i.e. something that is NOT in and of itself a food product) that can be used to make ethanol on a large enough scale for it to matter.

Cornstalks.

You understand that it takes more than a gallon of ethanol's worth of energy to get a gallon of ethanol from corn, right?

Nevermind what the phosphate-laden runoff from growing corn does to rivers and the Gulf.

AND the following two facts:

1.  Creating one gallon of ethanol creates 120+ gallons of high alkaline water, and

2.  You would have to use every single acre of arable land in the USA just to meet CURRENT energy requirements.


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Re: Some simple facts about the future people would rather not face
« Reply #24 on: July 18, 2011, 04:21:48 pm »
My current pet alternative fuel is silicon.

Isn't silicon kind of getting rarer on earth though? Also, I've read something about dwindling mineral resources around the world that left me worried. I'll search for the link later.

at what point would you prognosticate that these facts will become overwhelmingly obvious to the masses? (or at least to all the decision makers)

Probably not until two major catastrophes affecting millions of people in the most developed countries happen within a decade of each other, so some 30-40 years from now?
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Re: Some simple facts about the future people would rather not face
« Reply #25 on: July 18, 2011, 05:16:07 pm »
Two major catastrophes affecting millions of people just happened within months of each other, and a few months later it's business as usual and nobody gives a fuck.

I admire your optimism, though. :lulz:
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Re: Some simple facts about the future people would rather not face
« Reply #26 on: July 18, 2011, 05:19:23 pm »
Do never underestimate humanity's ability to bury their heads in the sand. the only way they'll ever accept the truth is if you removed all the sand. our race will be long extinct before the penny even begins to drop  :lulz:
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Re: Some simple facts about the future people would rather not face
« Reply #27 on: July 18, 2011, 05:28:16 pm »
My current pet alternative fuel is silicon.

Isn't silicon kind of getting rarer on earth though? Also, I've read something about dwindling mineral resources around the world that left me worried. I'll search for the link later.



http://hyperphysics.phy-astr.gsu.edu/hbase/tables/elabund.html

Sand is 1/3 silicon (by mole).

Also, Saudi Arabia is the Saudi Arabia of sand.
« Last Edit: July 18, 2011, 05:31:20 pm by Jerry_Frankster »

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Re: Some simple facts about the future people would rather not face
« Reply #28 on: July 18, 2011, 05:36:58 pm »
i guess i'm more interested in when the decision makers will come to a consensus that things aren't going to change in time to avert disaster.  i would expect a massive culling to be orchestrated.
« Last Edit: July 18, 2011, 06:05:37 pm by Iptuous »

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Re: Some simple facts about the future people would rather not face
« Reply #29 on: July 18, 2011, 05:58:19 pm »
Isn't silicon kind of getting rarer on earth though?

Yeah, the desert out here in Arizona is now just bedrock.

 :lulz: