Author Topic: I don't know where the random links thread is  (Read 41223 times)

Cain

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Re: I don't know where the random links thread is
« Reply #270 on: February 19, 2015, 07:31:22 pm »
You realise this means someone is going to have to explain CHIM.  And the Heart of Lorkhan.  And the 36 Lessons of Vivec.  And, well, Vivec.

Not to mention the clusterfuck that is Numidian (though at least I have a fairly convincing explanation for that).

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Re: I don't know where the random links thread is
« Reply #271 on: February 19, 2015, 07:47:48 pm »
You realise this means someone is going to have to explain CHIM.  And the Heart of Lorkhan.  And the 36 Lessons of Vivec.  And, well, Vivec.

Not to mention the clusterfuck that is Numidian (though at least I have a fairly convincing explanation for that).

I'm not gonna lie, I get a headache every time I think about Kirkbride's fluff.
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Re: I don't know where the random links thread is
« Reply #272 on: February 19, 2015, 07:57:28 pm »
What's complicated about a dead, dreaming God using the Heart of a Trickster-God responsible for the creation of reality to power up a fascimile of the principle of negation in order to overthrow three false gods, one of whom has realised the nature of reality through love, in order to break time and allow him to mantle said dead trickster god in order to defeat and break the Empire, who has a metaphysical bodyguard in the form of Talos, the God-Emperor of Mankind, who is the three-in-one Enantionmorph of Tiber Septim, Zurin Arcturus and Wulfharth.

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Re: I don't know where the random links thread is
« Reply #273 on: February 19, 2015, 08:00:53 pm »
What's complicated about a dead, dreaming God using the Heart of a Trickster-God responsible for the creation of reality to power up a fascimile of the principle of negation in order to overthrow three false gods, one of whom has realised the nature of reality through love, in order to break time and allow him to mantle said dead trickster god in order to defeat and break the Empire, who has a metaphysical bodyguard in the form of Talos, the God-Emperor of Mankind, who is the three-in-one Enantionmorph of Tiber Septim, Zurin Arcturus and Wulfharth.

You forgot the part where Talos himself is probably mantling said trickster god to begin with. At least, if there's anything to the Aldmeri Dominion's plot in Skyrim he is.
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Re: I don't know where the random links thread is
« Reply #274 on: February 19, 2015, 08:15:31 pm »
Yup.  That's why Dagoth Ur has to mantle him.  Hence why Dagoth Ur is keen on getting the Neverarine to Red Mountain, to replicate the Enantionmorph with the Sharmat, Hortator and Witness.  By mantling Lorkhan, he breaks the Dragon and the Serpent and, in theory, removes the upstart Talos' influence over the world.  Of course, in practice, Talos has achieved CHIM, which kinda screws up all plans of that kind.  Dagoth Ur may have succeeded, since he had achieved a kind of anti-CHIM, if you believe his mad ravings, but the Thalmor certainly wont.

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Re: I don't know where the random links thread is
« Reply #275 on: February 19, 2015, 08:21:58 pm »
Yup.  That's why Dagoth Ur has to mantle him.  Hence why Dagoth Ur is keen on getting the Neverarine to Red Mountain, to replicate the Enantionmorph with the Sharmat, Hortator and Witness.  By mantling Lorkhan, he breaks the Dragon and the Serpent and, in theory, removes the upstart Talos' influence over the world.  Of course, in practice, Talos has achieved CHIM, which kinda screws up all plans of that kind.  Dagoth Ur may have succeeded, since he had achieved a kind of anti-CHIM, if you believe his mad ravings, but the Thalmor certainly wont.

That's the part that got me about Skyrim. I know their plan is to weaken Talos by depriving him of worshipers, but where in the lore is it ever implied that the gods need worship? The Thalmor are pretty quick to jump the gun on their assumptions about reality. Which actually makes a lot of sense, given that they're Nazi analogues.
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Re: I don't know where the random links thread is
« Reply #276 on: February 19, 2015, 08:28:28 pm »
It is mentioned in Gods and Worship.  Aedra, having spent their power in the creation of Mundus, do require worship to maintain influence over events in Mundus.  But Talos isn't an Aedra, probably has CHIM and may even function as a metaphysical Tower.

Which isn't to say it isn't impossible to undo him, only that the current Thalmor effort at banning Talos worship wont do it alone.  It may just be that banning Talos worship is a tactical move designed to divide the Empire, while working on other methods (Eye of Magnus, perhaps the Dragon Cult) to undo him.

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Re: I don't know where the random links thread is
« Reply #277 on: February 19, 2015, 08:31:37 pm »
I used to follow Elder Scrolls lore like you, until I took an arrow to the knee.  :sad:
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Re: I don't know where the random links thread is
« Reply #278 on: February 19, 2015, 08:51:23 pm »
DAGOTH UR DAGOTH UR DAGOTH UR DAGOTH UR DAGOTH UR DAGOTH UR DAGOTH UR DAGOTH UR DAGOTH UR DAGOTH UR DAGOTH UR DAGOTH UR DAGOTH UR DAGOTH UR DAGOTH UR DAGOTH UR

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NVO3lrbyS9w

 :eek:

 :lol: WTF

That's Dagoth Ur, the primary antagonist of The Elder Scrolls III: Morrowind. He's kinda an undead god-king thing... Except he isn't, because the metaphysics of the in-game setting are kinda screwy like that. Technically, he isn't undead so much as he's anti-alive. Even that's a sloppy explanation.
Anyway, he was the player character's bro in a past life and it's the player's job to "kill" him, whatever that even means.

Anti-alive in a similar manner to D&D undead?
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Re: I don't know where the random links thread is
« Reply #279 on: February 20, 2015, 02:46:35 am »
DAGOTH UR DAGOTH UR DAGOTH UR DAGOTH UR DAGOTH UR DAGOTH UR DAGOTH UR DAGOTH UR DAGOTH UR DAGOTH UR DAGOTH UR DAGOTH UR DAGOTH UR DAGOTH UR DAGOTH UR DAGOTH UR

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NVO3lrbyS9w

 :eek:

 :lol: WTF

That's Dagoth Ur, the primary antagonist of The Elder Scrolls III: Morrowind. He's kinda an undead god-king thing... Except he isn't, because the metaphysics of the in-game setting are kinda screwy like that. Technically, he isn't undead so much as he's anti-alive. Even that's a sloppy explanation.
Anyway, he was the player character's bro in a past life and it's the player's job to "kill" him, whatever that even means.

Anti-alive in a similar manner to D&D undead?

Nope. That'd be regular undead. Dagoth-Ur is an entirely different thing altogether.
In The Elder Scrolls, when you die you go to a plane called the Dreamsleeve, where you experience whatever afterlife you believed in until you reincarnate. This is also where you go when you sleep, which is why you dream. When you're awake, you're in the material plane, or Mundus. So if you're alive, you can occupy one of two states:
Alive, Awake in Mundus(AlAwMu), or Alive, Dreaming in the Dreamsleeve(AlDrDS)

Now, undead do exist, but the way necromancy works in The Elder Scrolls is that the dead are awakened from their rest in the Dreamsleeve, bringing them back to Mundus in the service of the caster. This means the dead can occupy two possible states:
Dead, Dreaming in the Dreamsleeve(DeDrDS), or Dead, Awake in Mundus(DeAwMu)

Dagoth Ur occupies none of these states. He was killed millennia ago, quite thoroughly, but due to shenanigans involving the heart of a dead trickster god, Dagoth Ur is actually solipsistically dreaming his own presence in Mundus.
As such, he is Dead, Dreaming in Mundus(DeDrMu). This is impossible.
My shit list: Stephen Harper, anarchists that complain about taxes instead of institutionalized torture, those people walking, anyone who lets a single aspect of themselves define their entire personality, salesmen that don't smoke pipes, Fredericton New Brunswick, bigots, philosophy majors, my nemesis, pirates that don't do anything, criminals without class, sociopaths, narcissists, furries, juggalos, foes.

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Re: I don't know where the random links thread is
« Reply #280 on: February 20, 2015, 03:06:06 am »
DAGOTH UR DAGOTH UR DAGOTH UR DAGOTH UR DAGOTH UR DAGOTH UR DAGOTH UR DAGOTH UR DAGOTH UR DAGOTH UR DAGOTH UR DAGOTH UR DAGOTH UR DAGOTH UR DAGOTH UR DAGOTH UR

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NVO3lrbyS9w

 :eek:

 :lol: WTF

That's Dagoth Ur, the primary antagonist of The Elder Scrolls III: Morrowind. He's kinda an undead god-king thing... Except he isn't, because the metaphysics of the in-game setting are kinda screwy like that. Technically, he isn't undead so much as he's anti-alive. Even that's a sloppy explanation.
Anyway, he was the player character's bro in a past life and it's the player's job to "kill" him, whatever that even means.

That link keeps throwing "403 Forbidden" errors
Praise NHGH! For the tribulation of all sentient beings.

a plague on both your houses -Mercutio

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zrTGgpWmdZQ
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rVWd7nPjJH8

It is an unfortunate fact that every man who seeks to disseminate knowledge must contend not only against ignorance itself, but against false instruction as well. No sooner do we deem ourselves free from a particularly gross superstition, than we are confronted by some enemy to learning who would plunge us back into the darkness -H.P.Lovecraft

He who fights with monsters must take care lest he thereby become a monster -Nietzsche

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SHhrZgojY1Q

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Cain

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Re: I don't know where the random links thread is
« Reply #281 on: February 20, 2015, 12:12:52 pm »
The Heart of Lorkhan: not even once.

Quote from: When Dead Gods Dream
"But Dagoth Ur was not at the outside of the Wheel observing the ‘I’ from there. No, he was at the center looking out; and what would you see if you were at the very center of a wheel and looked toward the rim, something resembling an ‘I’ extending forever – a false symbolism for the false dreamer, from the center he would have his viewpoint and his “world of reference” for seeing his false symbolism. And what did Dagoth Ur do before his fall, he attempted to create all his servants “in his flesh, and of his flesh” and controlled their minds as one – so perhaps he was molding the world around him to suite his own ‘I’, making them all ‘A whole World of Him’. As the Cultists said “He is All Things”, or at least he strove to be."

An interesting end to Morrowind would've been convincing Dagoth Ur he was wrong about being at the centre of the Wheel, because, if I'm not mistaken, he then would've zero-summed.

Possibly a bit esoteric, but it wouldn't have been any worse than, say, convincing Saren to kill himself in Mass Effect 1.  Only with a more convoluted reasoning.

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Re: I don't know where the random links thread is
« Reply #282 on: February 20, 2015, 10:02:41 pm »
It would have been a nice planescape-style way to finish up rather than "hit win object in telegraphed sequence". Surely there's a mod for it.

Incidentally, I love that it's 2015 and there's a conversation about CHIM. Morrowind was fucking awesome.
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Cain

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Re: I don't know where the random links thread is
« Reply #283 on: February 21, 2015, 12:47:24 am »
Skywind is still being worked on.  I mean, its in Alpha, and probably will be until 2016 at earliest.   But it's still being worked on, and it looks pretty amazing.

The minute that shit is public released, I will be all over it.  There are only two things I don't like about Morrowind: the combat system, and the outdated graphics.  Skywind solves both of those problems.

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Re: I don't know where the random links thread is
« Reply #284 on: February 21, 2015, 02:05:51 am »
Skywind is still being worked on.  I mean, its in Alpha, and probably will be until 2016 at earliest.   But it's still being worked on, and it looks pretty amazing.

The minute that shit is public released, I will be all over it.  There are only two things I don't like about Morrowind: the combat system, and the outdated graphics.  Skywind solves both of those problems.

What I love about Morrowind is that even though the graphics are garbage, you can still tell that what you're looking at is really cool and original. It's the difference between good graphics and good art direction.
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