So a buddy of mine wants to run an all-magic campaign in Pathfinder...

[The Good Reverend Roger]

Anytime there's a radical departure from the established game mechanic, what it's really saying is "I can't think of a plot for my game."

Same thing happens when some dumbass says "roll in at 20th level".

[Uncle Wallified]

Anytime there's a radical departure from the established game mechanic, what it's really saying is "I can't think of a plot for my game."

Same thing happens when some dumbass says "roll in at 20th level".

To be fair, I have the same problem.
But when I have it, I don't run a game.

EDIT: By the way, how do you start your games? It's something I've been having a lot of trouble with. Do you find that the old "you all meet in a tavern" does the job, or do you try to be more original about it? I have the kinds of players that are inclined to wander off and split the party at every opportunity, so I have to go out of my way to justify the party sticking together, and I always find there's no way to guarantee it without railroading. The end result, of course, is that I scrap every first session I plan.

[The Wizard Joseph]

Anytime there's a radical departure from the established game mechanic, what it's really saying is "I can't think of a plot for my game."

Same thing happens when some dumbass says "roll in at 20th level".

To be fair, I have the same problem.
But when I have it, I don't run a game.

EDIT: By the way, how do you start your games? It's something I've been having a lot of trouble with. Do you find that the old "you all meet in a tavern" does the job, or do you try to be more original about it? I have the kinds of players that are inclined to wander off and split the party at every opportunity, so I have to go out of my way to justify the party sticking together, and I always find there's no way to guarantee it without railroading. The end result, of course, is that I scrap every first session I plan.

The trick to getting a good game going involves first finding excellent players and second ensuring that they NEVER really know what the plot will be and that they can trust you to bring the awesome when things get scattered. Assume that scatter will happen and possibly consider starting each player separately or in very small groups before you begin to meet regularly. Note that the burden of both of these is almost entirely on you.
Being an ST is the most exhausting activity one can engage in, next to soccer. 

I prefer to improvise in broad strokes toward a set of key events and allow the players to think that they've got me on the ropes. They're in it for the thrill too. Never, ever forget this. 

Don't be afraid to "cheat" but use it extremely sparingly. You are god of the game, but it has to be "reasonably" fair or the thrill and opportunity for the players to advance THEIR plots is lost in your ego-trip. Whenever possible use plot devices and such, rather than mechanics, for this purpose.  If you're going to be blatant about it you better have a GODDAMN good plot hook built into it.

[The Good Reverend Roger]

EDIT: By the way, how do you start your games? It's something I've been having a lot of trouble with. Do you find that the old "you all meet in a tavern" does the job, or do you try to be more original about it? I have the kinds of players that are inclined to wander off and split the party at every opportunity, so I have to go out of my way to justify the party sticking together, and I always find there's no way to guarantee it without railroading. The end result, of course, is that I scrap every first session I plan.

20 pt buy, book races/classes, and I let the plot of the adventure determine where they start and how/if they know each other.

And I mercilessly crush party-splitters merely by using the wandering monster chart, or a mugging, etc.

Party-splitters are universally attention whores who can't cooperate on SHIT, and deserve everything that happens to them.

Players who see the plot hook and deliberately avoid it (and they always have excuses, like "What's my motivation, here", as if they were a bad B movie actor, or "I'm only playing my alignment"...WHO CHOSE THAT ALIGNMENT?) should be immediately dumped in favor of either a smaller group or another player.

I am known as The Table Nazi, but amazingly enough, I have 2 campaigns running, and a waiting list on either one.  Because I don't tolerate that sort of shit...It ruins the game for everyone except the useless attention-whore.

[The Good Reverend Roger]

I had a new player (to my table) stab the OBVIOUS plot hook NPC, once, about 5 minutes into the session once.  No reason.

So I told him to get the fuck out, and then rewound the encounter for the rest of the party.

 

[Bebek Sincap Ratatosk]

Wow in a Magic only world with infinite spells per day (and some weapons), I'd be rolling up a warmage/chaos mage. Not only is it nice to cast fireballs in fully armor, but fireballs in full armor while hitting a dude with a sword in the same round... YUMMEH... Or just casting Truestrike and hitting someone every round.

One of my favorite campaigns ever, we rolled up 5th level characters. The story, however, started with all of us being enslaved in a gladiator type prison. So we had no gear, no weapons etc. We had to break free and earn everything from the ground up. Another story that I liked involved us creating a 1st level, 5th level, 10th level, 15th level and 20th level version of the same character. The story began with us all waking up in the afterlife under the protection of a God. We would then be sent 'back' to the earthly realm on various jobs for this god and we'd incarnate with the level that he felt was necessary for us to complete our mission.

I thought the second one was a bit gimmicky, but the ST actually had a cohesive plot that made it work really well.

[The Wizard Joseph]

I had a new player (to my table) stab the OBVIOUS plot hook NPC, once, about 5 minutes into the session once.  No reason.

So I told him to get the fuck out, and then rewound the encounter for the rest of the party.

These methods work damn well too. Let them hate as long as they respect the damn game and there will be fun. It's also much less work.

[Freeky Queen of DERP]

Uncle Wally, it sounds like you have a set of atrocious players. Scrap them and find a new group if you can, or put in place a series of increasingly serious in game punishments that will teach them to stick together, cooperate, and solve the problem at hand (the plot). 

[Luna]

Bump for "how'd this turn out, anyway?"

[Uncle Wallified]

It didn't happen. I ended up running a game instead, but it turned out horribly and there wasn't a second session.
So in other words, it worked out exactly the same way it always does when I GM.

It appears I'm one of those people who has no trouble at all pointing out other people's mistakes, but never. Fucking. Learns.