Discordian Grin: Old School Discordians.

[Pæs]

Assuming a closed universe, we have done and will do the same sequence of actions for basicly, eternity.

Why assume a closed universe?

I thought that the universe was massive enough to be closed.  Hasn't that been settled?  Why do we PAY physicists, may I ask?

The Universe is closed between the hours of 5pm and 9am, as well as on weekends and public holidays. Sometimes it wraps up early on a Friday to go THE GAY BAR.

[The Good Reverend Roger]

Objectively the fact that all our actions and choices are determined by the complex interactions of molecules. Every action or choice we ever make is utterly dictated by the motion of small things in accordance with the laws of physics.

Maybe for you.  I am a person, and I am fueled by CONCENTRATED DUMBASS, which defies physics and THE TERROR OF THE GODS THEMSELVES.

[The Good Reverend Roger]

Assuming a closed universe, we have done and will do the same sequence of actions for basicly, eternity.

Why assume a closed universe?

I thought that the universe was massive enough to be closed.  Hasn't that been settled?  Why do we PAY physicists, may I ask?

The Universe is closed between the hours of 5pm and 9am, as well as on weekends and public holidays. Sometimes it wraps up early on a Friday to go THE GAY BAR.

 

TOTAL VICTORY.

[Idem]

All of these pages seemed to consist of people trying to show each other how jaded they were, how every ounce of human free will is "a story", among other spastic fits of solopsism.

This kind of behavior, I think, is in large part responsible for the suppression of new ideas. In their view, they will never achieve anything and the world will remain stagnant & terrible. Because of this cynicism, people can profess to be open-minded and liberal while at the same time eschewing any new ideas. It's worse than countercultures fueled by candyfloss and good feelings.

[The Johnny]

Assuming a closed universe, we have done and will do the same sequence of actions for basicly, eternity.

Why assume a closed universe?

I too thought that a closed universe was a given, but if you are more up to date you could explain?

Pent speaks of how we are physically bound and determined but also that our consciousness automatically negates that... but that very well could be the illussion of free will.

Anyhow, for those that missed it, i act AS IF we had free will and accountability for our actions.

[President Television]

It's them's that's missing the point.

He used "afraid of life" as an argument about "miserable bastards".

Oh, okay.  I was worried that I was missing something obvious.

Also, no mention of "illegitimate" prior to his own post, so that's a clear misuse of language on his side.

I dismissed that as incomprehensible jargon.  I THINK it means "not accepted by this group".

I think he took "bastard" literally. I think he thought you were calling them miserable illegitimate offspring. That is exactly how thoroughly he missed the point.

[Hoopla!]

It's them's that's missing the point.

He used "afraid of life" as an argument about "miserable bastards".

Oh, okay.  I was worried that I was missing something obvious.

Also, no mention of "illegitimate" prior to his own post, so that's a clear misuse of language on his side.

I dismissed that as incomprehensible jargon.  I THINK it means "not accepted by this group".

I think he took "bastard" literally. I think he thought you were calling them miserable illegitimate offspring. That is exactly how thoroughly he missed the point.

Yeah, that's what I gathered from it too.  There's a word for trolling be deliberately pretending you misunderstand something basic, but I can't recall it at the moment.  But, I suspect that is what is going on here.

[Mesozoic Mister Nigel]

I like the OP, inasmuch as my brain is capable of really absorbing anything right now.

[Sano]

I just don't grok the dichotomy. Free will and determinism are two different perspectives. A phenomenon appraised from two points of view. Objectively the fact that all our actions and choices are determined by the complex interactions of molecules. Every action or choice we ever make is utterly dictated by the motion of small things in accordance with the laws of physics.

Subjectively, free will is obvious. Because now we're not looking at consciousness from the point of view of molecules. We're looking at molecules from the point of view of consciousness.

The whole argument strikes me a philosophical wankery at it's most ridiculous. I've a tendency to side with the free will believers tho, just because they exercise their own free will to believe in free will, whereas determinists exercise their own free will to not believe in free will.

Philosophy can be retarded sometimes

Hey, philosophy isn't stupid, (some) philosophers are.

Also, lots of people have come up with kind of the same answer you gave to the problem, except in a more refined way, which is of course to be expected since some of these people are getting paid to think about stuff like this: http://plato.stanford.edu/entries/compatibilism/

[The Good Reverend Roger]

Apparently, this rant irritated Adam Gorightly, on FB.   

[LMNO]

Did it look like this?

 

[The Good Reverend Roger]

Did it look like this?

 

Very quietly, but I think that was what he was getting at.  I peed on his intellectual territory or something.

[P3nT4gR4m]

Hey, philosophy isn't stupid, (some) philosophers are.

Also, lots of people have come up with kind of the same answer you gave to the problem, except in a more refined way, which is of course to be expected since some of these people are getting paid to think about stuff like this: http://plato.stanford.edu/entries/compatibilism/

 

[Mesozoic Mister Nigel]

I just don't grok the dichotomy. Free will and determinism are two different perspectives. A phenomenon appraised from two points of view. Objectively the fact that all our actions and choices are determined by the complex interactions of molecules. Every action or choice we ever make is utterly dictated by the motion of small things in accordance with the laws of physics.

Subjectively, free will is obvious. Because now we're not looking at consciousness from the point of view of molecules. We're looking at molecules from the point of view of consciousness.

The whole argument strikes me a philosophical wankery at it's most ridiculous. I've a tendency to side with the free will believers tho, just because they exercise their own free will to believe in free will, whereas determinists exercise their own free will to not believe in free will.

Philosophy can be retarded sometimes

Hey, philosophy isn't stupid, (some) philosophers are.

Also, lots of people have come up with kind of the same answer you gave to the problem, except in a more refined way, which is of course to be expected since some of these people are getting paid to think about stuff like this: http://plato.stanford.edu/entries/compatibilism/

  Since when do philosophy grad students get paid?

[Sano]

Not grad students, the professors themselves... And well, some places do pay people a bit while they're writing their PhD thesis, don't they?