Author Topic: Does the VW fiasco qualify as a conspiracy?  (Read 3492 times)

Faust

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Re: Does the VW fiasco qualify as a conspiracy?
« Reply #15 on: September 25, 2015, 10:39:09 am »
It would be absolutely stunning if other companies were doing it, but not entirely out of the realm of possibility.

It's been floated that they thought they could get away with it because the software that does this is considered intellectual property, and therefore secret (the source code is not available).  This was only discovered because someone did a real world test.

Later that week, in the same industry:

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/business/news/new-ttip-scandal-car-industry-buried-report-revealing-us-car-safety-flaws-10514716.html

Mesozoic Mister Nigel

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Re: Does the VW fiasco qualify as a conspiracy?
« Reply #16 on: September 25, 2015, 07:26:14 pm »
It would be absolutely stunning if other companies were doing it, but not entirely out of the realm of possibility.

It's been floated that they thought they could get away with it because the software that does this is considered intellectual property, and therefore secret (the source code is not available).  This was only discovered because someone did a real world test.

Later that week, in the same industry:

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/business/news/new-ttip-scandal-car-industry-buried-report-revealing-us-car-safety-flaws-10514716.html

Yeah, see, in nature if you see one occurrence of something, it's a flag telling you that this is something that actually happens a lot, but you haven't known to look for it.

I can't help thinking it's much the same in industry.
Im guessing it was January 2007, a meeting in Bethesda, we got a bag of bees and just started smashing them on the desk, Charles Wick said. It was very complicated.


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Re: Does the VW fiasco qualify as a conspiracy?
« Reply #17 on: September 25, 2015, 07:28:05 pm »
I saw some rough estimates of how many people would have to be involved, at minimum, for this to work.

It makes the CIA look like amateurs.

Thanks to you, that's one of the first things that crossed my mind. How did they do it? Engineers aren't usually known for their allegiance to the corporate hierarchy.

Engineers are, however, known for their allegiance to making a lot of money.
Im guessing it was January 2007, a meeting in Bethesda, we got a bag of bees and just started smashing them on the desk, Charles Wick said. It was very complicated.


The Good Reverend Roger

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Re: Does the VW fiasco qualify as a conspiracy?
« Reply #18 on: September 25, 2015, 07:30:26 pm »
I saw some rough estimates of how many people would have to be involved, at minimum, for this to work.

It makes the CIA look like amateurs.

Thanks to you, that's one of the first things that crossed my mind. How did they do it? Engineers aren't usually known for their allegiance to the corporate hierarchy.

Engineers are, however, known for their allegiance to making a lot of money.

And lifetime job security.
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Cain

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Re: Does the VW fiasco qualify as a conspiracy?
« Reply #19 on: September 25, 2015, 11:52:05 pm »
That would be my guess.

I also wouldn't be entirely surprised if the major car manufacturers also kept a blacklist of some kind.  Sure, it would be illegal, but...

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Re: Does the VW fiasco qualify as a conspiracy?
« Reply #20 on: September 25, 2015, 11:57:31 pm »
That would be my guess.

I also wouldn't be entirely surprised if the major car manufacturers also kept a blacklist of some kind.  Sure, it would be illegal, but...

Yeah, that doesn't seem to really be a problem for them.
Im guessing it was January 2007, a meeting in Bethesda, we got a bag of bees and just started smashing them on the desk, Charles Wick said. It was very complicated.


Meunster

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Re: Does the VW fiasco qualify as a conspiracy?
« Reply #21 on: September 26, 2015, 01:41:19 am »
I heard about this on npr. Complete dick move what they did, especially that their getting off relatively free from it.
Everyone who bought the car has a right to sue.
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Re: Does the VW fiasco qualify as a conspiracy?
« Reply #22 on: September 26, 2015, 08:28:20 am »
I saw some rough estimates of how many people would have to be involved, at minimum, for this to work.

It makes the CIA look like amateurs.

Thanks to you, that's one of the first things that crossed my mind. How did they do it? Engineers aren't usually known for their allegiance to the corporate hierarchy.

Engineers are, however, known for their allegiance to making a lot of money.

And lifetime job security.

And a greatly lower chance of suffering a tragic life event or two, possibly just one REALLY final one. Just saying.

It would seem to me that the likelihood of a conspiracy staying quiet beyond the "5 people" LMNO mentioned grows exponentially in proportion to the parties' certainty of prosecution, humiliation, torture, or death for themselves and/or their families. Not saying all that was the case here, but prosecution and humiliation are on the table for sure. Wouldn't rule out a real or perceived threat of the others either. I imagine that billions of dollars in "clean" money can lead to justifying some mighty dirty deeds if it's threatened.
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Re: Does the VW fiasco qualify as a conspiracy?
« Reply #23 on: September 26, 2015, 01:54:02 pm »
i'm curious - since the engine can switch to "i'm being tested for emissions" mode and still run - and pass emissions testing . . . then, how well (or poorly) would the engine run if it simply stayed in this mode?  that seems like it would be an easy mod
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Re: Does the VW fiasco qualify as a conspiracy?
« Reply #24 on: September 26, 2015, 02:02:15 pm »
Essentially, that's what will happen.  However, that also means the car will lose either horsepower or fuel efficiency, making it a substandard product.

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Re: Does the VW fiasco qualify as a conspiracy?
« Reply #25 on: September 26, 2015, 06:41:48 pm »
They should be forced to buy them back. Full sticker price refunds.
Im guessing it was January 2007, a meeting in Bethesda, we got a bag of bees and just started smashing them on the desk, Charles Wick said. It was very complicated.


Cain

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Re: Does the VW fiasco qualify as a conspiracy?
« Reply #26 on: September 26, 2015, 08:37:51 pm »
Switzerland has temporarily halted the sale of Volkswagen cars while they investigate.

The Good Reverend Roger

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Re: Does the VW fiasco qualify as a conspiracy?
« Reply #27 on: September 26, 2015, 09:53:26 pm »

And a greatly lower chance of suffering a tragic life event or two, possibly just one REALLY final one. Just saying.


Engineers don't think that way. 
" It's just that Depeche Mode were a bunch of optimistic loveburgers."
- TGRR, shaming himself forever, 7/8/2017

 "Billy, when I say that ethics is our number one priority and safety is also our number one priority, you should take that to mean exactly what I said. Also quality. That's our number one priority as well. Don't look at me that way, you're in the corporate world now and this is how it works."
- TGRR, raising the bar at work.

LuciferX

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Re: Does the VW fiasco qualify as a conspiracy?
« Reply #28 on: September 27, 2015, 09:40:41 am »
Switzerland has temporarily halted the sale of Volkswagen cars while they investigate.
The investigation reduced unemployment by 1 (One) standard deviation.
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The Wizard Joseph

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Re: Does the VW fiasco qualify as a conspiracy?
« Reply #29 on: September 27, 2015, 07:20:56 pm »

And a greatly lower chance of suffering a tragic life event or two, possibly just one REALLY final one. Just saying.


Engineers don't think that way.

Point taken. Apparently I do by default and projected. I gotta watch out for that tendency.
You can't get out backward.  You have to go forward to go back.. better press on! - Willie Wonka, PBUH

Life can be seen as a game with no reset button, no extra lives, and if the power goes out there is no restarting.  If that's all you see life as you are not long for this world, and never will get it.

"Ayn Rand never swung a hammer in her life and had serious dominance issues" - The Fountainhead

"World domination is such an ugly phrase. I prefer to call it world optimisation."
 - Harry Potter and the Methods of Rationality :lulz: