Author Topic: WHERE'S YOUR GODWIN, NOW?  (Read 8297 times)

Pope Pelvis Flirtini

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Re: WHERE'S YOUR GODWIN, NOW?
« Reply #225 on: August 15, 2017, 03:00:49 am »
You'd probably have to go back and re-read the entirety of several threads to understand.

This whole thing came about because Trump got elected and a bunch of people totally lost their minds and began to blame the people who voted for him for all of the evils they had (in many cases justifiably so) projected onto his campaign. I argued that if Trump is your enemy and you turn your hatred towards voters, you're a fucking tool and a fool.

This is especially true in my own state, where post election-night protestors vandalized city streets in a state that voted for Hillary Clinton. Talk about shitting where you eat.

I was counterargued that all my points were null and void because Nazis. Because Nazis voted for Trump, all the rage against all Trump voters was justified. The logic here is that if Nazis voted for Trump, anyone who voted for Trump is a Nazi. And if you aren't suggesting that logic intellectually, you're sure as hell suggesting it emotionally.

You'll even go so far as to claim that the very fact that I'm opposing that nonsense is proof that I'm a Trump supporter. I can't think of a more pathetic defense.

And now, months later, this thread is necro'd just so Salty can claim his shitty, stupid argument was right the whole time just because Godwin supports calling people who identify as Nazis "Nazis".

You guys have a little too much heart, and not quite enough brain.
"Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster. And if you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you." - Friedrich Nietzsche

The Good Reverend Roger

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Re: WHERE'S YOUR GODWIN, NOW?
« Reply #226 on: August 15, 2017, 04:17:51 am »
You'd probably have to go back and re-read the entirety of several threads to understand.

This whole thing came about because Trump got elected and a bunch of people totally lost their minds and began to blame the people who voted for him for all of the evils they had (in many cases justifiably so) projected onto his campaign. I argued that if Trump is your enemy and you turn your hatred towards voters, you're a fucking tool and a fool.

This is especially true in my own state, where post election-night protestors vandalized city streets in a state that voted for Hillary Clinton. Talk about shitting where you eat.

I was counterargued that all my points were null and void because Nazis. Because Nazis voted for Trump, all the rage against all Trump voters was justified. The logic here is that if Nazis voted for Trump, anyone who voted for Trump is a Nazi. And if you aren't suggesting that logic intellectually, you're sure as hell suggesting it emotionally.

You'll even go so far as to claim that the very fact that I'm opposing that nonsense is proof that I'm a Trump supporter. I can't think of a more pathetic defense.

And now, months later, this thread is necro'd just so Salty can claim his shitty, stupid argument was right the whole time just because Godwin supports calling people who identify as Nazis "Nazis".

You guys have a little too much heart, and not quite enough brain.

I fucking knew it.
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The Good Reverend Roger

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Re: WHERE'S YOUR GODWIN, NOW?
« Reply #227 on: August 15, 2017, 04:18:52 am »
Oh, right. China Green Elvis.   :lulz:
" It's just that Depeche Mode were a bunch of optimistic loveburgers."
- TGRR, shaming himself forever, 7/8/2017

 "Billy, when I say that ethics is our number one priority and safety is also our number one priority, you should take that to mean exactly what I said. Also quality. That's our number one priority as well. Don't look at me that way, you're in the corporate world now and this is how it works."
- TGRR, raising the bar at work.

Salty

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Re: WHERE'S YOUR GODWIN, NOW?
« Reply #228 on: August 16, 2017, 12:05:28 am »
The world is a car and you're the crash test dummy.

Pope Pelvis Flirtini

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Re: WHERE'S YOUR GODWIN, NOW?
« Reply #229 on: August 16, 2017, 03:12:03 am »
No way Trump is a NAZI, ludicrous to suggest it. He just plays one on TV.

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2017/aug/15/donald-trump-press-conference-far-right-defends-charlottesville?CMP=fb_gu

Only an extremist would see measure as the opposite extreme.

But, hey, the anarchists kind of have a win-win with this one. Start a fight with a Nazi, and everyone will blame the Nazi. Because Nazis.

It's like a magic word that turns everyone into hypocrites.

Also, you guys have a really strange fixation on Nazis here. I'm starting to think you all really just want to get a hotel room with them.
"Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster. And if you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you." - Friedrich Nietzsche

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Re: WHERE'S YOUR GODWIN, NOW?
« Reply #230 on: August 16, 2017, 03:21:30 am »
No way Trump is a NAZI, ludicrous to suggest it. He just plays one on TV.

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2017/aug/15/donald-trump-press-conference-far-right-defends-charlottesville?CMP=fb_gu

Only an extremist would see measure as the opposite extreme.

But, hey, the anarchists kind of have a win-win with this one. Start a fight with a Nazi, and everyone will blame the Nazi. Because Nazis.

It's like a magic word that turns everyone into hypocrites.

Also, you guys have a really strange fixation on Nazis here. I'm starting to think you all really just want to get a hotel room with them.

What;s the cuttoff for jerkoff getting an unlimited thread?

Pope Pelvis Flirtini

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Re: WHERE'S YOUR GODWIN, NOW?
« Reply #231 on: August 16, 2017, 03:58:27 am »
"Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster. And if you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you." - Friedrich Nietzsche

Hoopla

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Re: WHERE'S YOUR GODWIN, NOW?
« Reply #232 on: August 16, 2017, 04:35:38 am »
No way Trump is a NAZI, ludicrous to suggest it. He just plays one on TV.

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2017/aug/15/donald-trump-press-conference-far-right-defends-charlottesville?CMP=fb_gu

Only an extremist would see measure as the opposite extreme.

But, hey, the anarchists kind of have a win-win with this one. Start a fight with a Nazi, and everyone will blame the Nazi. Because Nazis.

It's like a magic word that turns everyone into hypocrites.

Also, you guys have a really strange fixation on Nazis here. I'm starting to think you all really just want to get a hotel room with them.

Most people don't like nazis. Just saying.

They're like cold sores or earwigs.
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Pope Pelvis Flirtini

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Re: WHERE'S YOUR GODWIN, NOW?
« Reply #233 on: August 16, 2017, 04:44:52 am »
When you can use guilt-by-association to equate your opposition with objective evil, you can put all critics in a no-win situation.
"Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster. And if you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you." - Friedrich Nietzsche

Hoopla

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Re: WHERE'S YOUR GODWIN, NOW?
« Reply #234 on: August 16, 2017, 05:00:29 am »
When you can use guilt-by-association to equate your opposition with objective evil, you can put all critics in a no-win situation.

So what exactly IS your point? That everyone should be embracing nazis? Do you have a point?
"Soon, all of us will have special names." -Professor Brian O'Blivion

"Now's not the time to get silly, so wear your big boots and jump on the garbage clowns." -Bob Dylan?

"I contradict myself?  Very well then, I contradict myself; I am large - I contain multitudes."  -Walt Whitman

Pope Pelvis Flirtini

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Re: WHERE'S YOUR GODWIN, NOW?
« Reply #235 on: August 16, 2017, 05:17:21 am »
When you can use guilt-by-association to equate your opposition with objective evil, you can put all critics in a no-win situation.

So what exactly IS your point? That everyone should be embracing nazis? Do you have a point?

My point is that you guys need a villain so much that you're willing to imagine yourselves as Indiana Jones, leaping onto tanks and saving the day with nothing but your knuckles.

The people who marched in Charlottesville are merely an echo of what the actual Nazis were. At best, they're neckbeard Nazi cosplayers who think that waving a Swaztika around makes them a force to be reckoned with.

Attacking them is like punching a misbehaving retarded child. Fearing them is absurd.
"Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster. And if you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you." - Friedrich Nietzsche

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Re: WHERE'S YOUR GODWIN, NOW?
« Reply #236 on: August 16, 2017, 12:53:55 pm »
Tell that to Deandre Harris.

Or Heather Heyer.

Hoopla

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Re: WHERE'S YOUR GODWIN, NOW?
« Reply #237 on: August 16, 2017, 01:11:00 pm »
When you can use guilt-by-association to equate your opposition with objective evil, you can put all critics in a no-win situation.

So what exactly IS your point? That everyone should be embracing nazis? Do you have a point?

My point is that you guys need a villain so much that you're willing to imagine yourselves as Indiana Jones, leaping onto tanks and saving the day with nothing but your knuckles.

The people who marched in Charlottesville are merely an echo of what the actual Nazis were. At best, they're neckbeard Nazi cosplayers who think that waving a Swaztika around makes them a force to be reckoned with.

Attacking them is like punching a misbehaving retarded child. Fearing them is absurd.

I don't fear them, I fear what they could become, and there is genuinely as much chance of that here as there was in Germany in the 30s. Which, in case you are somehow not aware, was not a good time. And quite honestly, this is what a decent person does in the face of a possible reprising of genocidal fascism. Remember "never forget"? Remembering is pretty much the important part of never forgetting.

Do I know if this is going to turn into that? Of course not. Am I willing to take that chance? Shit no.

You stand a REALLY big chance of being on the wrong side of history here. At worst, I look foolish in retrospect. I can live with that, I frequently look foolish. It's pretty much my default state. But for you dude, at worst you are complicit with potential genocide. I know which side of that I would rather be on.

I hope that smug edgy grin is worth it.
« Last Edit: August 16, 2017, 01:12:58 pm by Hoopla »
"Soon, all of us will have special names." -Professor Brian O'Blivion

"Now's not the time to get silly, so wear your big boots and jump on the garbage clowns." -Bob Dylan?

"I contradict myself?  Very well then, I contradict myself; I am large - I contain multitudes."  -Walt Whitman

Pope Pelvis Flirtini

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Re: WHERE'S YOUR GODWIN, NOW?
« Reply #238 on: August 16, 2017, 06:16:03 pm »
Tell that to Deandre Harris.

Or Heather Heyer.

If you step on a snake and the snake bites you, you're as much at fault as the snake. People don't show up to these kinds of protests expecting nobody to get hurt.

If you show up to a Nazi rally with the intention to antagonize, attack, or otherwise elicit violence from them, then congratulations: you're part of a bigger problem. And if you didn't come with that intention, you should probably anticipate that someone else did. If it gets you killed, then it sucks for you that people on your side of the clash helped trigger the events that led to your death.

The bottom line is that trying to pin the responsibility on one side is disingenuous, and frankly, intellectually dishonest.

So far, the only counterargument I've seen is that none of this matters, because Nazis.
« Last Edit: August 16, 2017, 06:32:44 pm by Pope Pelvis Flirtini »
"Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster. And if you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you." - Friedrich Nietzsche

Pope Pelvis Flirtini

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Re: WHERE'S YOUR GODWIN, NOW?
« Reply #239 on: August 16, 2017, 06:22:55 pm »
I don't fear them, I fear what they could become, and there is genuinely as much chance of that here as there was in Germany in the 30s.

How do you quantify a genuine chance in this case?

If political action is to be predicated on the fear of what something might become, then we might as well just stop our entire country in its tracks. Stop the human race altogether. After all, think about what we might become.

Quote
Do I know if this is going to turn into that? Of course not. Am I willing to take that chance? Shit no.

Well, then, what do you prefer? Diplomacy? Or war?

Let's assume war. Your only option is to exterminate them. Stamp them out. And you aren't going to do that with socks full of ball bearings. You aren't going to do it sitting around here circle-jerking each other about how good it would feel to punch a Nazi in the face.

And while you're at it, just wipe them all out. Kill the entire alt-right. Kill anyone who doesn't vote Democrat. Kill anyone who votes at all.

If you choose to love only those who don't hate and hate those who do, you'll wind up hating yourself as well. Might as well add that one to the kill list, too.
"Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster. And if you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you." - Friedrich Nietzsche