Principia Discordia

Principia Discordia => Two vast and trunkless legs of stone => Topic started by: Mangrove on July 11, 2012, 08:54:53 PM

Title: Kai - Bug Questions!
Post by: Mangrove on July 11, 2012, 08:54:53 PM
This is something really stupid, but I had to ask.

So, outside one of our bedroom windows, some funnel web spiders have taken residence. Every now and then, I like to watch what they're up too. Often, nothing much but recently, I got to see something I've never seen up close before. Some flying beastie (that looked all the world like a very small wasp(?) got himself caught in the web.

Now, he was doing all his best to get the hell out because the resident spider was nearby. The spider ran out and actually circled his prey numerous times. Then it'd run back and then run out again, do a few victory laps and then return to his corner. There was a really dramatic scene whereby the spider stood over the wasp and had one leg poised very high above like he was about to  bitch slap his would-be meal from a great height.

Later on, when I revisited the scene, the wasp was dead and all of it's waspy goodness had been sucked out.

This got me thinking. Spiders have been making sticky webs for a gazillion years. Other creatures have been sticking to said webs for gazillions of years. Has our trusty friend, evolved insects that either are:

a) impervious to spider stickiness, in which case they can walk off? After all, spiders can, so it makes sense that some other creature could.

b) developed some other anti-spider web measure(s)?

I would have thought "not getting stuck in a web and dying" would qualify as suitable 'environmental pressure' to cheat the spiders out of a meal.

Many thanks,

Mang'
Title: Re: Kai - Bug Questions!
Post by: The Good Reverend Roger on July 11, 2012, 08:58:55 PM
Remember:  Evolution doesn't produce the best solution, just one that works.  If a particular brand of wasp, etc, can live long enough to breed, it has succeeded.

Then consider the sheer number of prey species that a spider eats, compared to the number of spiders.  Not enough gun, I'm thinking, to force any changes.
Title: Re: Kai - Bug Questions!
Post by: Nephew Twiddleton on July 11, 2012, 09:54:35 PM
Wasps also seem to have queens. The wasp you saw might not have any reproductive purpose. Though other species behave differently.
Title: Re: Kai - Bug Questions!
Post by: Golden Applesauce on July 11, 2012, 11:44:37 PM
Moths and butterflies' wing scales detach, letting them bounce off webs.
http://www.asknature.org/strategy/12de56f529b1c7c6bc7b818eabec31ed

I'm pretty sure there are some ants who know how to only walk on the non sticky parts of webs, and there are some insects who can cut their way free. I think there's at least one species of insect that flies into webs intentionally, then breaks free and eats the spider.

Edit: after a little more research, it turns out that most insects have some anti-web ability. Good eyesight & maneuverability to avoid or fly through webs, being strong enough to break free, playing dead, or just being poisonous. Webs are designed to fail gracefully in the event that a strong bug tries to break free - its better for one meal to get away than for the entire web to be torn apart. Spiders will even go out of their way to cut free poisonous or dangerous insects out of the web.
Title: Re: Kai - Bug Questions!
Post by: The Good Reverend Roger on July 12, 2012, 01:11:05 AM
Quote from: Golden Applesauce on July 11, 2012, 11:44:37 PM
I think there's at least one species of insect that flies into webs intentionally, then breaks free and eats the spider.


Jesus H Christ.   :eek:
Title: Re: Kai - Bug Questions!
Post by: Nephew Twiddleton on July 12, 2012, 02:07:49 AM
Quote from: The Dead Reverend Roger on July 12, 2012, 01:11:05 AM
Quote from: Golden Applesauce on July 11, 2012, 11:44:37 PM
I think there's at least one species of insect that flies into webs intentionally, then breaks free and eats the spider.


Jesus H Christ.   :eek:

God's not just keeping his fingers in the physics pie. Looks like he's crazying up biology too.
Title: Re: Kai - Bug Questions!
Post by: Luna on July 12, 2012, 02:29:23 AM
Quote from: The Dead Reverend Roger on July 12, 2012, 01:11:05 AM
Quote from: Golden Applesauce on July 11, 2012, 11:44:37 PM
I think there's at least one species of insect that flies into webs intentionally, then breaks free and eats the spider.


Jesus H Christ.   :eek:

This appeals to my sense of irony.
Title: Re: Kai - Bug Questions!
Post by: LMNO on July 12, 2012, 12:58:35 PM
It almost make you want to add new chapters to the Spider Project, doesn't it?
Title: Re: Kai - Bug Questions!
Post by: The Good Reverend Roger on July 12, 2012, 02:02:45 PM
Quote from: LMNO, PhD (life continues) on July 12, 2012, 12:58:35 PM
It almost make you want to add new chapters to the Spider Project, doesn't it?

*twitch*

Damn you!
Title: Re: Kai - Bug Questions!
Post by: LMNO on July 12, 2012, 05:15:41 PM
:regret:
Title: Re: Kai - Bug Questions!
Post by: Mangrove on July 12, 2012, 07:37:35 PM
Quote from: The Dead Reverend Roger on July 11, 2012, 08:58:55 PM
Remember:  Evolution doesn't produce the best solution, just one that works.  If a particular brand of wasp, etc, can live long enough to breed, it has succeeded.

Then consider the sheer number of prey species that a spider eats, compared to the number of spiders.  Not enough gun, I'm thinking, to force any changes.

Reproduction = Success.
True for wasps, not for people  :lol:
Title: Re: Kai - Bug Questions!
Post by: Mangrove on July 12, 2012, 07:38:16 PM
Quote from: The Dead Reverend Roger on July 12, 2012, 01:11:05 AM
Quote from: Golden Applesauce on July 11, 2012, 11:44:37 PM
I think there's at least one species of insect that flies into webs intentionally, then breaks free and eats the spider.


Jesus H Christ.   :eek:

Seconded!
Title: Re: Kai - Bug Questions!
Post by: Forsooth on July 12, 2012, 09:35:38 PM
http://www.fcps.edu/islandcreekes/ecology/organ-pipe_mud_dauber.htm
http://www.flickr.com/photos/gmazza/4220003664/