Question about BIP

[Sir Perineal]

I just read the actual BIP document all the way through for the first time, and I have a few questions about it, if some of you don't mind answering.

The gist of it seems to be "think for yourself," or, in other words, rediscover your lost freedom.  Is this a fairly correct summation?

If so, I'm not really sure what is meant by this.  I think the underlying assumption of the entire document is that freedom does actually exist.  Is this correct?

If so, what is the freedom that is being spoken of?

[hunter s.durden]

Look for LMNO's sig and click the bottom link.

Good things there.

This is how I think of it: Are you happy with your life?

If the answer is yes, then you are fine. Leave it alone and be happy. You won.

If you say "no, I feel I'm missing out on alot", then it's time to ask these questions.

To me freedom is about internal freedom. As far as "think for yourself",
if you like letting others think for you, then by all means, go with that.
If not, most of these BIP documents are to help you through that.

[Sir Perineal]

Look for LMNO's sig and click the bottom link.

Good things there.

This is how I think of it: Are you happy with your life?

If the answer is yes, then you are fine. Leave it alone and be happy. You won.

If you say "no, I feel I'm missing out on alot", then it's time to ask these questions.

To me freedom is about internal freedom. As far as "think for yourself",
if you like letting others think for you, then by all means, go with that.
If not, most of these BIP documents are to help you through that.

I guess I am just having trouble understanding this "think for yourself" stuff.

What do you mean by internal freedom?

[P3nT4gR4m]

Two kinds of prison

1) people build it, capture you and put you in it

2) one you build yourself, figuratively, fake limitations you place on your own state of being

Both can be escaped from, with effort. We concentrate on no2.

[hunter s.durden]

You might be suprised to know just how much people don't (sometimes can't) think for themselves. I consider myself pretty liberated, and I still have trouble with it.

Let's use the often used punk example. A person feels that popular society isn't doing them good, so they decide to embrace a counterculture. They pick the punk ethos, which is strongly rooted in "i'm not taking up the ass from the system just because everyone else is doing it." They buy a leather jacket and spikes and set off to be their own person. Unfortunatly punk comes with it's own set of rules and styles. Little Jack used to love Metallica, but to be punk you can only listen to the most underground music. Instead of saying "I like Metallica, and this fucking bracelet bugs me", they lose their personality and become a carbon copy of most every punk on the market.

Have you ever liked a song, but were afraid to say so because your metal buddies think Celine Dion sucks? Thats being a slave to fashion.

Plus you'd be totally gay if you liked Celine Dion.

Did you every say a movie was good because it was a "hit" even though it sucked?
Slavery to fashion.

Have you held back from getting a tattoos because someone said it would suck?

Thinking for yourself is forming your own opinions and living your own way.

Internal freedom is thinking for yourself, despite yourself.
I see people say "I want to quite smoking, but I can't."
Yes you can.
"I've always wanted to do karaoke, but i'd be embarressed."
Why?
These are instances of times you are the only thing that prevent you from making your life better.

[Sir Perineal]

Two kinds of prison

1) people build it, capture you and put you in it

2) one you build yourself, figuratively, fake limitations you place on your own state of being

Both can be escaped from, with effort. We concentrate on no2.

Why are there only two?  Doesn't it go beyond self-imprisonment and second-party imprisonment?

[Sir Perineal]

You might be suprised to know just how much people don't (sometimes can't) think for themselves. I consider myself pretty liberated, and I still have trouble with it.

Let's use the often used punk example. A person feels that popular society isn't doing them good, so they decide to embrace a counterculture. They pick the punk ethos, which is strongly rooted in "i'm not taking up the ass from the system just because everyone else is doing it." They buy a leather jacket and spikes and set off to be their own person. Unfortunatly punk comes with it's own set of rules and styles. Little Jack used to love Metallica, but to be punk you can only listen to the most underground music. Instead of saying "I like Metallica, and this fucking bracelet bugs me", they lose their personality and become a carbon copy of most every punk on the market.

Have you ever liked a song, but were afraid to say so because your metal buddies think Celine Dion sucks? Thats being a slave to fashion.

Plus you'd be totally gay if you liked Celine Dion.

Did you every say a movie was good because it was a "hit" even though it sucked?
Slavery to fashion.

Have you held back from getting a tattoos because someone said it would suck?

Thinking for yourself is forming your own opinions and living your own way.

Internal freedom is thinking for yourself, despite yourself.
I see people say "I want to quite smoking, but I can't."
Yes you can.
"I've always wanted to do karaoke, but i'd be embarressed."
Why?
These are instances of times you are the only thing that prevent you from making your life better.

But how do we know we can control ourselves?  Is it really possible for so-and-so to quit smoking or do karaoke?  How would we know?

[hunter s.durden]

I also think of natural imprisonment.

The concept that our frail ape bodies and minds are only capable of soaking in a very small percentage of our surroundings. This blinds us to many of the universes vast possibilities.

[hunter s.durden]

But how do we know we can control ourselves? Is it really possible for so-and-so to quit smoking or do karaoke? How would we know?

Because many of us use our understandings of our prison to rise up.
Not everyone does.
I can. I do.

Please remember I speak only for myself.

[Sir Perineal]

I also think of natural imprisonment.

The concept that our frail ape bodies and minds are only capable of soaking in a very small percentage of our surroundings. This blinds us to many of the universes vast possibilities.

Does natural imprisonment only have to do with "blindness," or does it also include the determined essence of thought and action themselves?

[Sir Perineal]

But how do we know we can control ourselves? Is it really possible for so-and-so to quit smoking or do karaoke? How would we know?

Because many of us use our understandings of our prison to rise up.
Not everyone does.
I can. I do.

Please remember I speak only for myself.

But how do you know your "rising up" is not simply another predetermined action?  You say your understandings are used to help you rise up.  In that case, aren't you still imprisoned by your paticular understandings?

[hunter s.durden]

The concept that our frail ape bodies and minds are only capable of soaking in a very small percentage of our surroundings. This blinds us to many of the universes vast possibilities.

Does natural imprisonment only have to do with "blindness," or does it also include the determined essence of thought and action themselves?

Yes.

My inability to fly prevents me from doing many things I wish to do.

My slow monkey brain often times cannot find the easiest solution. This holds me back.

But how do you know your "rising up" is not simply another predetermined action? You say your understandings are used to help you rise up. In that case, aren't you still imprisoned by your paticular understandings?

Dosen't matter. If I am happy, but still in prison, so be it.
Many of the things found here are for people who have found they are in prison, and are disturbed by it.
Most of the population is deep in it, but quite happy. Good for them.
State of mind is my end all.

[Sir Perineal]

The concept that our frail ape bodies and minds are only capable of soaking in a very small percentage of our surroundings. This blinds us to many of the universes vast possibilities.

Does natural imprisonment only have to do with "blindness," or does it also include the determined essence of thought and action themselves?

Yes.

My inability to fly prevents me from doing many things I wish to do.

My slow monkey brain often times cannot find the easiest solution. This holds me back.

But how do you know your "rising up" is not simply another predetermined action? You say your understandings are used to help you rise up. In that case, aren't you still imprisoned by your paticular understandings?

Dosen't matter. If I am happy, but still in prison, so be it.
Many of the things found here are for people who have found they are in prison, and are disturbed by it.
Most of the population is deep in it, but quite happy. Good for them.
State of mind is my end all.

So are we just accepting that we are inevitably imprisoned?

[hunter s.durden]

I am.

I'm just trying to fill my cell with drugs and pillows.

You... Well you do what you like.
I wouldn't want to impose on our friendship with orders.

[Sir Perineal]

I am.

I'm just trying to fill my cell with drugs and pillows.

You... Well you do what you like.
I wouldn't want to impose on our friendship with orders.

Then telling people about the BIP seems pointless, doesn't it?  If you and I think that everyone is inevitably imprisoned, why bother burdening them with such a realization?