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The World is a Verb (something approaching "scientific/mathematical" proof)

Started by Roaring Biscuit!, April 12, 2009, 11:26:36 PM

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Roaring Biscuit!

A phrase I picked straight out of the Illuminatus! Trilogy, but never understood until I actually sat down with a pen and paper and worked it out.  I'll be honest it required some minor alterations to "conventional" logic (which people here may or may not have a problem with)... well, here goes, do as thou wilst an all that:

"Leap of Faith" #1:  1/0 = infinity  thus  1/infinity = 0

"Leap of Faith" #2:  Any object can be represented as the sum of its parts involved in being aforementioned object e.g.  1 pentagon = 5 lines being a pentagon or 1 = 1/5 x 5 in equation form (and I'm sure those with a most basic undestanding of mathematics can see that is "true" at least in the sense that the majority of humanity would accept)

And now only one thing remains, to argue my point to absurdity:

When the above rules are taken to extremes, that is, we talk in terms of the very make-up of the universe then say that we wish to divide this vastness into its most fundamental particle (which is nothingness btw, that bit is coming :)).

The universe can be said to be a collection of galaxies being the universe, and each galaxy is made from solar systems being a galaxy and such forth...  as an important side note, as we continue to divide the universe in this way the denominator in our "Pentagon Equation" (you know the one i mean...) steadily becomes to increase in size, thus the whole expression 1/y becomes closer to 0 and the y value which equals the number of times the universe is divided but also the amount of being that a division of that size would have to undertake in order to equal the universe.  That bit was a little unclear I guess, but I hope you tried to understand, or not understand, depending on your persuasion.

Eventually we reach a case (theoretically) where the universe is divided into an infinite number of pieces, and this is where things start to matter.  In this event the "Pentagonal Equation" reaches its "logical" climax in that:

1 (universe) = 1/infinity x infinity

As earlier stated, 1/infinity = 0

Thus, when we arrive at the infinite division of the universe we are shown that the fundamental particle is nothing and that the universe is in this situation created entirely from being (as stated earlier, that the y value = the number of subdivisions and the amount of being necessary for a subdivision of size 1/y to recreate the universe.

If you read all that then well done, I'll be heading off back to my tower of mathematical and logical pretentiousness,

x

Amanda

EDIT:  I would like to add, that I don't really draw any conclusions from this, I don't know what it means if the world is a verb from a philosophical stand-point, so any helpful pointers will probably be appreciated (i make no promises), and thats kinda why I posted it, I hope that discussion of this theory will at least help me (and maybe others) to from meaninful from above ridiculousness.

OH and one thing I almost forgot:

Ⓚ All Rites Reversed. Reprint What You Like.

the other anonymous

Quote from: TSosBR! on April 12, 2009, 11:26:36 PM

"Leap of Faith" #1:  1/0 = infinity  thus  1/infinity = 0


Wrong. Faith or not, infinity is not a number. Infinity is the lack of a boundary.

"1/0 = no boundary" makes no sense

Mesozoic Mister Nigel

"I'm guessing it was January 2007, a meeting in Bethesda, we got a bag of bees and just started smashing them on the desk," Charles Wick said. "It was very complicated."


Rev. Thwack

Actually the whole thing is wrong. Remember, 0 is a mathematical representation for a lack of a value, either positive or negative, or nothing... depending on how you want to say it. In division, all you are trying to do is figure out how much of one value it takes to make up another value. Well, unless you were shot in the head with a nailgun, you can easily see that you can't keep adding together nothings and eventually get something. The answer of a/0 isn't something, it's fucking undefined since you're trying to do an operation that doesn't make sense. So, since 1/0 != infinity, you've still got nothing saying what 1/infinity is equal to. Now sure, if you were wanting to round things (even to the nearest trillionth place would do it), you could try to say that 1/infinity = 0, but that would still only be 1/infinity = 0, with a + or - .1*10^-infinity accuracy.

Since we're not really going to be able to do any real math with infinitesimally small numbers (or large for that matter), let's look at that last equation of yours again. We'll let a=infinity, and deal with another proper way for expressing your equation so we can easily see where it went wrong.


Quote from: TSosBR! on April 12, 2009, 11:26:36 PM
1 (universe) = 1/infinity x infinity

So, substituting a, we get this:
1 (universe) = 1/a x a

Now, lets look at that last part... the times a.  Since anything divided by itself is itself yet again, you can express any number or variable as it/1, or in this case, a/1. This would make your equation look like this...
1 (universe) = 1/a x a/1

Another trip down basic mathematics lane will remind us that any fraction, multiplied by its inverse, is equal to...





that's right, 1.

So, where are we now? well, since 1/a x a/1 = 1 (multiplying inverses), we can then reduce the first formula to 1 (universe) = 1.

So, since we've gone through and seen that the universe is actually still a whole and not imploding when someone decided to see what happens when you try to divide by zero using faulty math assumptions and a lack of reasoning, it's safe to return to your *chan image making without fear of existence suddenly ending in a big *slurp* sound.
I stay crunchy, even in milk.

Roaring Biscuit!

actually, it is perfectly logical to assume that 1/0 = infinity, as and infinite number of 0s will go into one, the 1/infinity = 0 is simple algebraic rearrangement, and for the record that part of the equation was not mine, it was explained to me by someone far better at maths than I (and probably the majority of you) can ever hope to be.

And yes I am aware that 1 = 1 i think if you have decided to pick that out from the thoery outlined above you may have missed the point somewhat, as I never sought to prove that 1 equals anything other than 1.

Lets look at a smaller scale:  A cat does not exist, it is a greater number of cells being a cat.  A cell does not exist, it is a collection of cytoplasm and cell membrane and various organelles being a cell, an organelle does not exists, it is a collection of molecules arranged in a specific way being an organelle.  A molecule does not exist, it is a collection of compounds bonded together being a molecule, like wise a compound does not exist, it is a collection of atoms being a compound.

Finally, an atom does not exist, it is electrons protons and neutrons (and a hell of a lot of empty space) being an atom.  Even these do not exist, eveything is made of quarks at our smallest and (currently) most fundamental denomination.

The point I had/have hoped to illustrate (and apparently failed) is that nothing exists, it is merely made of other, smaller things being.  The infinity equation was developed in order to illustrate the extreme of this theory, in that when anything is divided (by infinity as is only "theoretically" possible) into "nothings" we are left with the noun described being created from nothing x an infinite amount of being.

I hope that has clarified some points a little.

X

Edd

Honey

"There are certain things in which one is unable to believe for the simple reason that he never ceases to feel them. Things of this sort — things which are always inside of us and in fact are us and which consequently will not be pushed off or away where we can begin thinking about them — are no longer things; they, and the us which they are, equals A Verb; an IS."


also


"Listen: There's a hell of a good universe next door; lets go!

e.e. cummings (1894 - 1962) ^^
Fuck the status quo!

The trouble with the world is that the stupid are cocksure & the intelligent are full of doubt.
-Bertrand Russell


LMNO

First off,

:barstool:


Secondly,
QuoteThe universe can be said to be a collection of galaxies being the universe, and each galaxy is made from solar systems being a galaxy and such forth...  as an important side note, as we continue to divide the universe in this way the denominator in our "Pentagon Equation" (you know the one i mean...) steadily becomes to increase in size, thus the whole expression 1/y becomes closer to 0 and the y value which equals the number of times the universe is divided but also the amount of being that a division of that size would have to undertake in order to equal the universe.  That bit was a little unclear I guess, but I hope you tried to understand, or not understand, depending on your persuasion.

Eventually we reach a case (theoretically) where the universe is divided into an infinite number of pieces, and this is where things start to matter. 

Approaching zero is not zero.  Approaching infinity is not infinity.

Per the actual equations, the (current understood) fundmental particles, while very small, are not infinitely small.

Cain

Uh...is there some sort of fetish which means we now have to declare everything a verb, all of a sudden?  Even when it makes no sense?

For example:

Your mother is a verb
The President is a verb
Hangovers are a verb
Bankrupty is a verb
Hack philosophy is a verb

LMNO


Roaring Biscuit!

Quote from: LMNO on April 13, 2009, 02:46:16 PM
First off,

:barstool:

Approaching zero is not zero.  Approaching infinity is not infinity.

Per the actual equations, the (current understood) fundmental particles, while very small, are not infinitely small.

Aye but thats where my original pentagon example comes back in, that is a pentagon is made of 5 sides, but equally a pentagon could be divided into 8 bits of line or an infinite amount of infinitely small dots in the shape of a pentagon...  In theory the same dividing into a ridiculously small bits i possible of anything.

Also on the approaching zero point,

Approaching The Finish Line is Not The Finish Line, But is a Necessary Step in Crossing the Finish Line.

I wanted my reasoning to be as clear as I could make it (which still wasn't very clear) by providing ideas that build up to absurdity in little baby steps.

I'm not declaring nouns are verbs neither...  "proving" nouns are verbs is more fun.


Cain

Indeed.  Its like Derrida for Retards or something.  Actually analyzing language and discourse in the role of creating (mis)perceptions of reality is too much like hard work...just declare things verbs (and throw in some bad maths) and everyone can bask in your intellectual genius

Rev. Thwack

Quote from: TSosBR! on April 13, 2009, 11:06:57 AM
actually, it is perfectly logical to assume that 1/0 = infinity, as and infinite number of 0s will go into one

go into, but will still not add up to. Using your logic, anything/0 = infinity.... only problem, = is not the same as >. Hell, if we just went with your logic, we could easily say that if a/b = c, a/b actually is equal to everything less than c, since anything less than c will go into a. See the fault yet?

Let's try it this way. If you were to graph out either 1/0 = infinity or 1/infinity = 0, you would see that although you do approach the correct points, you never actually quite reach them. Understand? Yes, you get close to the correct value, but that value is never reached.

Or let's look at it like this... since a/b = c is really another way of saying a = b * c, we can shift the zero over in your equation and get 1 = 0 x infinity, and since anything times zero is actually zero, and since zero is not equal to one, we've once again seen that 1/0 is not infinity. Sure, dividing by zero is done under certain circumstances in higher mathematics, but they are not part of a basic algebraic function like you were using. There is also the fact that your x/0 = infinity assumption is at times used in formal calculations, but all mathematicians understand that this relationship can actually be used in a calculation in a way that actually makes it not true and leads to logic errors... such as in:
Quote from: TSosBR! on April 12, 2009, 11:26:36 PM
1 (universe) = 1/infinity x infinity
where it should have been realized that you can't just plug in 0 for 1/infinity and should have instead looked at the equation as a hole and realized that in this case, the proper thing to do would have been to realize that the two infinities cancel out (x / a, then * a, just equals x), leaving you still with 1 = 1.

I hadn't missed any of your points in your first post about what you were or were not trying to prove regarding the value of 1, I just noticed that your premise was based off of flawed mathematics.... you can't divide something into nothing. Your little attempt here, based off of flawed math, also ignores the fact that you're not dealing with a whole bunch of little nothings. Sure, you might be dealing with subatomic particles, but guess what... they're still somethings. Just because you get your pizza from the delivery man and start pulling everything apart doesn't mean that those pieces of it are not still there, and doesn't change the fact that as a whole, it's still a pizza (a very messy and strewn out one now, but still one). Need that again? How about this...

Sure, a car is made up of just a bunch of atoms... Just like a snowball. Now, if they were all traveling at 60mph relative to you, which would you rather have hit you?
1) a quark
2) a snowball
3) a 1980 Delta '88

Or if you need things in a less scientific and less concrete example way, how about this.

The reality of an object is not defined by the division of the whole by its parts, but instead by the sum of its parts and their interaction together to complete and make up the whole.
I stay crunchy, even in milk.

LMNO

Quote from: TSosBR! on April 13, 2009, 03:07:36 PM
Aye but thats where my original pentagon example comes back in, that is a pentagon is made of 5 sides, but equally a pentagon could be divided into 8 bits of line or an infinite amount of infinitely small dots in the shape of a pentagon...  In theory the same dividing into a ridiculously small bits i possible of anything.

Um.  Not really.  See, since we're talking about the Universe, we're talking about Experiential Reality.  So, that line that makes up the Pentagon is made out of stuff.  And that stuff, ultimately, is made up of fundamental particles.  Finite fundamental particles.

It appears you're trying to force a theoretical thought experiment of a pentagon (which does not exist) onto an actual physical representation of a pentagon (which does exist).


In a related note, I want to shoot Aristotle in the face.

Rev. Thwack

Quote from: LMNO on April 13, 2009, 03:15:05 PM
Quote from: TSosBR! on April 13, 2009, 03:07:36 PM
Aye but thats where my original pentagon example comes back in, that is a pentagon is made of 5 sides, but equally a pentagon could be divided into 8 bits of line or an infinite amount of infinitely small dots in the shape of a pentagon...  In theory the same dividing into a ridiculously small bits i possible of anything.

Um.  Not really.  See, since we're talking about the Universe, we're talking about Experiential Reality.  So, that line that makes up the Pentagon is made out of stuff.  And that stuff, ultimately, is made up of fundamental particles.  Finite fundamental particles.

It appears you're trying to force a theoretical thought experiment of a pentagon (which does not exist) onto an actual physical representation of a pentagon (which does exist).


In a related note, I want to shoot Aristotle in the face.

Seems more like he's trying to force a physical representation of division onto a theoretical idea. "Look people, I can cut the cake time and time again till there is nothing left (except fuckloads of crumbs), and if you did the same thing with the universe you'd see that it doesn't really exists at all any more." People need to remember that while dealing with your change at the gas pump remainders might not count for shit and it's cool to round, if you're working with high end mathematics, theoretical astrophysics, or space launches, your shit better account for every tiny ass bit of remainder, no matter how small or seemingly insignificant (and for fuck's sake, make sure you don't put the decimal point in the wrong place and have your planetary lander try to turn off it's thrusters at the wrong altitude.)
I stay crunchy, even in milk.