Proposal - Spring - Summer '07

[LHX]

in reviewing the recent events, here is a proposal:

abandon BIP evangelism in favor of a focus on the area where we all seem to merge at:

Law of Fives


Law of Fives is directly from PD
it merges the barstool with the abstract

everything becomes pertinent


as far as the audience goes:

i motion that we abandon the 'Think for Yourself' phrase/nonsense
- clearly it is seen as a phrase that suggests evengelicalism or evangelicism (evangelism?)



bring the Law of Fives to peoples attention, and our audience suddenly becomes very broad, and the writing becomes very pertinent

- we immediately become appealing to conspiracy theorists who are trying to 'piece everything together'
- there is appeal to occultists who are prakticing ckhaos mahdgjickque
- pragmatists have something tangible that they can put to use (mnemonics)
- esoterists have something they can experiment and play with


instead of preaching 'Think for Yourself' - we could provide examples of where this 'free thought' actually exists - where/how people get manipulated

and since we are from everywhere and are (collectively) involved in absolutely everything, exposing the law of fives could have some cross-over appeal


this is the only circumstance where 000's deconstruction of how 2+3=5 would make sense proceeding or following a Rev Rog rant


in brief:

my proposal is this -
lets keep on discussing this rift between the abstract and the practical

meanwhile
firing away at everything under this 'Law of Fives' umbrella



also - to come up with a better phrase than 'Law of Fives' that captures the essence behind 'the more i look for it, the more i see it manifest'


this could tie Prof Cram's latest effort with what Vex was talking about
could also tie Net's latest artworks into this plus the Durden rants, plus the latest discussions on Chaos theory as well as Cain's conspiracy work - etc, etc, etc



desired result:
instead of having people being told to 'Think for Yourself' -
provide context, warnings, benefits, and applications


this is all fresh and unpolished right now...

[P3nT4gR4m]

Sounds tickety! Could someone just remind me what the law of fives was again? I either skimmed over it while reading PD the one time I did, or my lack of short term memory erased it from my head.

[LHX]

http://www.principiadiscordia.com/book/23.php

THE INSIDE STORY!

The Law of Fives

The Law of Fives is one of the oldest Erisian Mysterees. It was first revealed to Good Lord Omar and is one of the great contributions to come from The Hidden Temple of The Happy Jesus.

POEE subscribes to the Law of Fives of Omar's sect. And POEE also recognizes the holy 23 (2+3=5) that is incorporated by Episkopos Dr. Mordecai Malignatus, KNS, into his Discordian sect, The Ancient Illuminated Seers of Bavaria.

The Law of Fives states simply that: ALL THINGS HAPPEN IN FIVES, OR ARE DIVISIBLE BY OR ARE MULTIPLES OF FIVE, OR ARE SOMEHOW DIRECTLY OR INDIRECTLY APPROPRIATE TO 5.

The Law of Fives is never wrong.

In the Erisian Archives is an old memo from Omar to Mal-2: "I find the Law of Fives to be more and more manifest the harder I look."

bolded for emphasis

[Jasper]

I'm not down with it, personally.  Think For Yourself Shmuck has been  a good theme, and I don't think it's been explored to the fullest quite yet.  I'd move on when there's a lot more cut-and-dry documentation on it and there's some kind of output from it all.  Not only that, the law of fives, while a multi-layered subject seems fluffy and trite to me, and isn't how I'd choose to represent myself.

I recognize that there is some content carry-over for it, though.  Maybe it could be worked in as an aspect or angle.

[LHX]

I'm not down with it, personally.  Think For Yourself Shmuck has been  a good theme, and I don't think it's been explored to the fullest quite yet.  I'd move on when there's a lot more cut-and-dry documentation on it and there's some kind of output from it all.  Not only that, the law of fives, while a multi-layered subject seems fluffy and trite to me, and isn't how I'd choose to represent myself.

I recognize that there is some content carry-over for it, though.  Maybe it could be worked in as an aspect or angle.

bring the Law of Fives to peoples attention, and our audience suddenly becomes very broad, and the writing becomes very pertinent

- we immediately become appealing to conspiracy theorists who are trying to 'piece everything together'
- there is appeal to occultists who are prakticing ckhaos mahdgjickque
- pragmatists have something tangible that they can put to use (mnemonics)
- esoterists have something they can experiment and play with


instead of preaching 'Think for Yourself' - we could provide examples of where this 'free thought' actually exists - where/how people get manipulated

[Cain]

I'm not down with it, personally.  Think For Yourself Shmuck has been  a good theme, and I don't think it's been explored to the fullest quite yet.  I'd move on when there's a lot more cut-and-dry documentation on it and there's some kind of output from it all.  Not only that, the law of fives, while a multi-layered subject seems fluffy and trite to me, and isn't how I'd choose to represent myself.

I recognize that there is some content carry-over for it, though.  Maybe it could be worked in as an aspect or angle.

[LHX]

'think for yourself schmuck' would benefit from the good cop/bad cop routine

[Jasper]

Or perhaps, less hate and more weary ambivalence?  The weary amb. is a good way to seem unconfrontational, unadversarial so as to get into more people's heads.

[LHX]

not for the older crowd

i see what youre saying tho

[Triple Zero]

umm i just wanted to mention that the number-theoretical proof of 2+3=5 was
1) not chosen because of the law of fives, could have been anything
2) will probably bore the hell out of anyone not prepared for that kind of shit, i didnt leave it out the first time only because it was long, but also because it's a boring repetitive proof, doing the same thing (adding 1 to 2) three times, essentially.

also, personally, i like the "think for yourself" meme better than the "law of fives" meme. they're not about the same thing. "think for yourself" is basically the key to any prison cell of the BIP, where the "law of fives" describes a certain type of bar the entire BIP is made of here and there.

i'd also like to remind Felix that there cannot be any "more cut-and-dry documentation" to thinking for yourself, as this defeats the purpose, sort of.
but on the other hand, i sort of enjoy getting people to think. and think hard.

the only problem is when you hit the point where they have seemed to stop thinking. then, a few things can happen,

- they can jokingly admit "ha ha no i don't like to think about that no ha ha i'm a consumer slave heh heh" (srsly i know people that can literally tell me this in all seriousness)
- another option is that they sort of stare at you with a sort of bunny-car-headlights glaze in their eyes.
- third, perhaps most common in certain environments, is that they just continue barging on, either ignore what you just said or just start repeating their initial arguments in the hope they'll win this time around.

what to do in these cases, is probably the more cut-and-dry documentation you are looking for?

notice that this is at a moment in discussion where a lot of the schopenhauer eristics has already failed (except perhaps for the public ridiculing and ad hominems)

[LHX]

umm i just wanted to mention that the number-theoretical proof of 2+3=5 was
1) not chosen because of the law of fives, could have been anything

i dont think anybody thought otherwise

also, personally, i like the "think for yourself" meme better than the "law of fives" meme. they're not about the same thing. "think for yourself" is basically the key to any prison cell of the BIP, where the "law of fives" describes a certain type of bar the entire BIP is made of here and there.

im not so sure

i think they might be more related than that

if anything - i think a familiarity with the implications of the Law of Fives forces a person to think for themselves

as in - you cant understand the implications of the Law of Fives and not be a free thinker (or on your way to becoming one)

the only problem is when you hit the point where they have seemed to stop thinking. then, a few things can happen,

- they can jokingly admit "ha ha no i don't like to think about that no ha ha i'm a consumer slave heh heh" (srsly i know people that can literally tell me this in all seriousness)
- another option is that they sort of stare at you with a sort of bunny-car-headlights glaze in their eyes.
- third, perhaps most common in certain environments, is that they just continue barging on, either ignore what you just said or just start repeating their initial arguments in the hope they'll win this time around.

what to do in these cases, is probably the more cut-and-dry documentation you are looking for?

notice that this is at a moment in discussion where a lot of the schopenhauer eristics has already failed (except perhaps for the public ridiculing and ad hominems)

nobody listens to anybody telling them anything

unless there is fear involved or the prospect of fulfilling desire


"Think for yourself" evokes no fear and provides no prospect of fulfilling a desire

[Triple Zero]

nobody listens to anybody telling them anything

unless there is fear involved or the prospect of fulfilling desire


"Think for yourself" evokes no fear and provides no prospect of fulfilling a desire

ok, so you gotta demonstrate thinking for yourself

and the law of fives (and "23") is a demonstration of some sort .. i can see where that's going.

i think, especially after watching the movie 23, we need to make the idea of "it's all in your mind, you fool" a LOT more clearer, it was already vague, because really if you see that movie, Jim Carrey is FREAKING OUT (ok turns out he had a good reason to, but his son blindly follows him as well -- he is the target and he should have known better) .. i wonder why not much more people get completely freaked at the number 23, it's everywhere, DUH of course it is .. suckers.

[Jasper]

A good law of fives/BIP parable:

"Guy's sitting in his world, his BIP.  Gets bored, starts drawing on the walls.  Eventually he just covers the walls in writing and drawing.  He then notices that a lot of the letter 'E' shows up in his writing, it being the most common letter of the language (but he doesn't know that).  So he starts rationalizing and philosophizing as to why this is.  He's not unclever, and generates some convincing arguments along the lines of it's shape, pleasing sound, perhaps some psychological obsession with the letter.  So over time E becomes his symbol for "unknown" and "wierd" things.  E is now synonymous with something irrationally correlated for some arbitrary reason.  Around this point the man is deranged with excitement at the very thought of E.  When the gaurds say words with E he giggles or sobs.  He writes it on his face in the mirror.  He's over the edge. 

There's this great They Might Be Giants song called E Eats Everything."

[Benaclypse]

Why 5?  Srsly.  I actually have been noticing the number five an awful lot lately.  I have a five magnet on my fridge, with five ordinary magnets surrounding it.  The strange thing is, I picked up the five magnet long before I ever heard about the law of fives, years ago.  Come to think of it, I don't know where I got that magnet, but I know it was many years ago.  I just went to San Francisco this weekend.  I got room 500 on the fifth floor, and my sister parked on the fifth floor of the parking garage.  I also used to visualize pentagons in my mind's eye long before I learned about Discordianism and the LAW.  Maybe coincidence, and maybe something more like the law of attraction, but I can only wonder.  But we might explore the law of fives more.  We might open up a new subforum, but keep the bip, even though everybody wants to escape it.  What does the five mean in numerology?  In tarot, it is the number of conflict.  In the enneagram, it's the number of the thinker, of genius and of paranoia.  555 is the number that's just a little bit humbler than the devil, though I haven't explored its full meaning.  What else does it mean?  Does the topic deserve a subforum?

[Triple Zero]

A good law of fives/BIP parable:

"Guy's sitting in his world, his BIP.  Gets bored, starts drawing on the walls.  Eventually he just covers the walls in writing and drawing.  He then notices that a lot of the letter 'E' shows up in his writing, it being the most common letter of the language (but he doesn't know that).  So he starts rationalizing and philosophizing as to why this is.  He's not unclever, and generates some convincing arguments along the lines of it's shape, pleasing sound, perhaps some psychological obsession with the letter.  So over time E becomes his symbol for "unknown" and "wierd" things.  E is now synonymous with something irrationally correlated for some arbitrary reason.  Around this point the man is deranged with excitement at the very thought of E.  When the gaurds say words with E he giggles or sobs.  He writes it on his face in the mirror.  He's over the edge. 

There's this great They Might Be Giants song called E Eats Everything."

"E" is the 5th letter of the alphabet. just saying