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Open Bar: Arguments About Turtles, All the Way Down

Started by Cain, August 09, 2014, 07:29:35 AM

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Doktor Howl

Quote from: Doktor Skinsaw on October 02, 2014, 01:21:46 AM
Quote from: Doktor Howl on October 02, 2014, 01:09:23 AM
Quote from: Doktor Skinsaw on October 02, 2014, 12:34:32 AM
Facebook's lack of giving a fuck about the safety of various groups of people including (but not limited to) drag performers, schoolteachers, minor children, and people fleeing domestic violence, at least until the bad publicity sunk in, is far more damning of their ethical senses, IMO, than the fact that they enacted the policy in the first place, which is merely damning of their collective ability to rub two sticks together to make fire.

Not that their ethical senses were in question to begin with, having set them on fire and thrown them out the window earlier this year when they performed human subject research without informed consent.

I wonder if that was a case of "we have no idea what we're doing BUT IT'S SCIENCE" or "We know and don't care"?

My suspicion is the latter, because when the editor asked about it she was told that the "local IRB" had approved it, which later turned out to not be a formal IRB application or even a review board at all, but a Facebook Ethics Committee discussing it after the fact, which, well.

"OOPSIE!"
- Adolf Eichmann
Molon Lube

Doktor Howl

Quote from: Sita on October 02, 2014, 10:44:46 AM
Well, after the backlash it seems Facebook is going to be a bit more lenient on it's real name policy.
Seems to be the same thing that Google went through a while back.

Why sites are so insistent on this real name stuff I don't understand.

It's already going horrible and wrong.  Something about having to "prove" that you are an artist and/or LGBT.

Which might be interesting.
Molon Lube

Mesozoic Mister Nigel

Quote from: Chelagoras The Lust-Driven Dickwolf on October 02, 2014, 03:28:51 AM
Last week i started a male feminist facebook group centered on fighting male gender roles and promoting a kinder more progressive masculinity. I was almost immediately screeched at by two feminist acquaintances of mine for...i'm still not entirely sure what to be honest, at a certain point they were just flinging Tumblr-grade talking points at me without even engaging my arguments directly. I somehow managed to field the entire fiasco without calling either one of them a name or resorting to ad hominem attacks, which believe took the patience of a saint on Quaaludes. Joke's on them though, after that shitstorm, people actually started showing up to make discussion and post things so... i win i guess?

That does, indeed, sound like a win!
"I'm guessing it was January 2007, a meeting in Bethesda, we got a bag of bees and just started smashing them on the desk," Charles Wick said. "It was very complicated."


Nephew Twiddleton

I've left the closed Discordian group. I was just going to start blocking people, but I have better things to do with my time than to block fucking monkeys on an individual level everyone they decide to post a pornographic picture or a guy whose had his chest blasted open. Even if I didn't mind seeing that shit I still check my Facebook on my phone when I'm at work or on the T. So fuck that shit.
Strange and Terrible Organ Laminator of Yesterday's Heavy Scene
Sentence or sentence fragment pending

Soy El Vaquero Peludo de Oro

TIM AM I, PRIMARY OF THE EXTRA-ATMOSPHERIC SIMIANS

Mesozoic Mister Nigel

Quote from: Sita on October 02, 2014, 10:44:46 AM
Well, after the backlash it seems Facebook is going to be a bit more lenient on it's real name policy.
Seems to be the same thing that Google went through a while back.

Why sites are so insistent on this real name stuff I don't understand.

In Facebook's case, I think they're trying to use it as a means of reducing bullying and harassment without paying to have employees actually investigate bullying and harassment.
"I'm guessing it was January 2007, a meeting in Bethesda, we got a bag of bees and just started smashing them on the desk," Charles Wick said. "It was very complicated."


Mesozoic Mister Nigel

Which, of course, is pretty much wholly ineffective. Basically they don't want to actually pay mods to mod.
"I'm guessing it was January 2007, a meeting in Bethesda, we got a bag of bees and just started smashing them on the desk," Charles Wick said. "It was very complicated."


Mesozoic Mister Nigel

Quote from: Doktor Howl on October 02, 2014, 02:02:26 PM
Quote from: Sita on October 02, 2014, 10:44:46 AM
Well, after the backlash it seems Facebook is going to be a bit more lenient on it's real name policy.
Seems to be the same thing that Google went through a while back.

Why sites are so insistent on this real name stuff I don't understand.

It's already going horrible and wrong.  Something about having to "prove" that you are an artist and/or LGBT.

Which might be interesting.

Yeah.

People are really outraged (people LOVE being outraged, especially about first world problems) but I'm more excited in the ways in which this is likely to go horribly wrong. ("Horribly" and "wrong" from the perspective of people whose worst problem is the possibility of losing their Facebook account, of course).
"I'm guessing it was January 2007, a meeting in Bethesda, we got a bag of bees and just started smashing them on the desk," Charles Wick said. "It was very complicated."


Cain

On the one hand: Facebook is a private site, and they can administer that private site in whatever hilariously inept, counterproductive and stupid way they want to.  Any whining about so-called rights mistakes our society for one in which said rights trump ownership rights, and making such complaints for FB to acquiese to merely allows them to mask the true authoritarian nature of the omnscient nerd complex that seeks to put us all under surveillance for greater good and profit.

On the other hand, I don't like Facebook much, so have at them.

Doktor Howl

Quote from: Doktor Skinsaw on October 02, 2014, 03:07:01 PM
Quote from: Doktor Howl on October 02, 2014, 02:02:26 PM
Quote from: Sita on October 02, 2014, 10:44:46 AM
Well, after the backlash it seems Facebook is going to be a bit more lenient on it's real name policy.
Seems to be the same thing that Google went through a while back.

Why sites are so insistent on this real name stuff I don't understand.

It's already going horrible and wrong.  Something about having to "prove" that you are an artist and/or LGBT.

Which might be interesting.

Yeah.

People are really outraged (people LOVE being outraged, especially about first world problems) but I'm more excited in the ways in which this is likely to go horribly wrong. ("Horribly" and "wrong" from the perspective of people whose worst problem is the possibility of losing their Facebook account, of course).

I just love the idea of "PROVE YOU'RE LGBT".  Yeah, it's not on par with Darfur and ebola, but it's still funny in a grotesque sort of way.

And, as well, it is directed. 

The FUNNY part is WHY the policy exists.  It's hard to collect personal data if people change their names.
Molon Lube

Mesozoic Mister Nigel

I am especially amused by the fact that this policy has apparently been in place for the last ten years, and it's only now that people are noticing.

The whole thing, really, is kind of delicious.
"I'm guessing it was January 2007, a meeting in Bethesda, we got a bag of bees and just started smashing them on the desk," Charles Wick said. "It was very complicated."


Faust

Thank you for submitting the picture of Bear George sucking your dick.

Unfortunately we cannot beyond a reasonable doubt ascertain your LGBT status from this as you could just be looking to get your dick wet or merely curious, please submit pictures of assfucking so we can continue processing your application.
Sleepless nights at the chateau

Chelagoras The Boulder

Quote from: Doktor Skinsaw on October 02, 2014, 02:59:48 PM
Quote from: Chelagoras The Lust-Driven Dickwolf on October 02, 2014, 03:28:51 AM
Last week i started a male feminist facebook group centered on fighting male gender roles and promoting a kinder more progressive masculinity. I was almost immediately screeched at by two feminist acquaintances of mine for...i'm still not entirely sure what to be honest, at a certain point they were just flinging Tumblr-grade talking points at me without even engaging my arguments directly. I somehow managed to field the entire fiasco without calling either one of them a name or resorting to ad hominem attacks, which believe took the patience of a saint on Quaaludes. Joke's on them though, after that shitstorm, people actually started showing up to make discussion and post things so... i win i guess?

That does, indeed, sound like a win!
Thanks! :D BTW, anyone wanting to check the group out feel free to PM me or hit me up on facebook.
"It isn't who you know, it's who you know, if you know what I mean.  And I think you do."

Doktor Howl

Quote from: Doktor Skinsaw on October 02, 2014, 03:31:12 PM
I am especially amused by the fact that this policy has apparently been in place for the last ten years, and it's only now that people are noticing.

The whole thing, really, is kind of delicious.

I think they only just started enforcing it.
Molon Lube

Roly Poly Oly-Garch

#1048
Quote from: Chelagoras The Lust-Driven Dickwolf on October 02, 2014, 03:28:51 AM
Last week i started a male feminist facebook group centered on fighting male gender roles and promoting a kinder more progressive masculinity. I was almost immediately screeched at by two feminist acquaintances of mine for...i'm still not entirely sure what to be honest, at a certain point they were just flinging Tumblr-grade talking points at me without even engaging my arguments directly. I somehow managed to field the entire fiasco without calling either one of them a name or resorting to ad hominem attacks, which believe took the patience of a saint on Quaaludes. Joke's on them though, after that shitstorm, people actually started showing up to make discussion and post things so... i win i guess?

Ooh. I wanna see!

^^^^Derp after reading your next post.
Back to the fecal matter in the pool

Roly Poly Oly-Garch

Quote from: Doktor Skinsaw on October 02, 2014, 03:31:12 PM
I am especially amused by the fact that this policy has apparently been in place for the last ten years, and it's only now that people are noticing.

The whole thing, really, is kind of delicious.

It was a major part of the appeal when I joined back in 2005. It was super small, and only available to people with certain university email addresses. You could search people you knew by their actual name, or even what department they were in, and there they were. It was actually really novel for the time.

Different time, though. Different site entirely. What was this super-cool feature, is now...exactly the opposite.
Back to the fecal matter in the pool