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Are YOU on the PATH? I hope not.

Started by Reeducation, March 18, 2011, 12:59:30 PM

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Captain Utopia

Quote from: Reeducation on March 18, 2011, 03:08:37 PM
Once I got this, I just went outside and played football with my kid for the rest of the day.

Win  :D

LMNO

But "enlightenment" describes a quality of emotion, at the very least.  You cannot reach that emotional state simply by denying it exists.

I think we may be talking about this on two levels.

Enlightenment1 is the overwhelming emotional state of mind, largely consisting of a resolution of cognitive dissonance and/or physical/chemical stress.  It is, essentially, a brain state.

Enlightenment2 is the cultural perception of Enlightenment1, declaring it to be a mystical truth-revealing experience.

Bebek Sincap Ratatosk

I agree with LMNO.

Any and all of us may experience Enlightenment1 at any time... particularly if we question our own perceptions and/or beliefs. That some crystal gazing, navel searching fool might think they're gonna get The Enlightenment (Enlightnment2 is more a function of typical monkey brains.
- I don't see race. I just see cars going around in a circle.

"Back in my day, crazy meant something. Now everyone is crazy" - Charlie Manson

The Good Reverend Roger

Wait.

Someone define "enlightened" for me.

If it means "seeing the world as it really is, rather than how you'd like it to be", then I'm all for it.

If it means some hippie Buddhist shit about accepting your fate, then KILL IT WITH FIRE.
" It's just that Depeche Mode were a bunch of optimistic loveburgers."
- TGRR, shaming himself forever, 7/8/2017

"Billy, when I say that ethics is our number one priority and safety is also our number one priority, you should take that to mean exactly what I said. Also quality. That's our number one priority as well. Don't look at me that way, you're in the corporate world now and this is how it works."
- TGRR, raising the bar at work.

LMNO

Quote from: The Good Reverend Roger on March 18, 2011, 04:16:05 PM
Wait.

Someone define "enlightened" for me.

If it means "seeing the world as it really is, rather than how you'd like it to be", then I'm all for it.

If it means some hippie Buddhist shit about accepting your fate, then KILL IT WITH FIRE.

I think that's the root of the conflict here.  OP didn't define exactly what he meant by the term.

Bebek Sincap Ratatosk

Quote from: The Good Reverend Roger on March 18, 2011, 04:16:05 PM
Wait.

Someone define "enlightened" for me.

If it means "seeing the world as it really is, rather than how you'd like it to be", then I'm all for it.

If it means some hippie Buddhist shit about accepting your fate, then KILL IT WITH FIRE.

THIS

Enlightenment can be seeing the world or yourself as you really are, or 'belief' and 'certainty' for the joke that they really are... at least IMO.

- I don't see race. I just see cars going around in a circle.

"Back in my day, crazy meant something. Now everyone is crazy" - Charlie Manson

The Good Reverend Roger

Quote from: Ratatosk on March 18, 2011, 04:26:21 PM
Quote from: The Good Reverend Roger on March 18, 2011, 04:16:05 PM
Wait.

Someone define "enlightened" for me.

If it means "seeing the world as it really is, rather than how you'd like it to be", then I'm all for it.

If it means some hippie Buddhist shit about accepting your fate, then KILL IT WITH FIRE.

THIS

Enlightenment can be seeing the world or yourself as you really are, or 'belief' and 'certainty' for the joke that they really are... at least IMO.



Some things in life ARE certain, though.  Most of them have to do with physical laws, of course.
" It's just that Depeche Mode were a bunch of optimistic loveburgers."
- TGRR, shaming himself forever, 7/8/2017

"Billy, when I say that ethics is our number one priority and safety is also our number one priority, you should take that to mean exactly what I said. Also quality. That's our number one priority as well. Don't look at me that way, you're in the corporate world now and this is how it works."
- TGRR, raising the bar at work.

Bebek Sincap Ratatosk

Quote from: The Good Reverend Roger on March 18, 2011, 04:31:13 PM
Quote from: Ratatosk on March 18, 2011, 04:26:21 PM
Quote from: The Good Reverend Roger on March 18, 2011, 04:16:05 PM
Wait.

Someone define "enlightened" for me.

If it means "seeing the world as it really is, rather than how you'd like it to be", then I'm all for it.

If it means some hippie Buddhist shit about accepting your fate, then KILL IT WITH FIRE.

THIS

Enlightenment can be seeing the world or yourself as you really are, or 'belief' and 'certainty' for the joke that they really are... at least IMO.



Some things in life ARE certain, though.  Most of them have to do with physical laws, of course.

Well I agree with that. If you step off a building, you will fall. We might end up have questions of certainty about gravity, mass, space time curvatures and the like as causes... but the effect is pretty damn certain :)
- I don't see race. I just see cars going around in a circle.

"Back in my day, crazy meant something. Now everyone is crazy" - Charlie Manson

Dysfunctional Cunt

Quote from: Ratatosk on March 18, 2011, 04:37:45 PM
Well I agree with that. If you step off a building, you will fall. We might end up have questions of certainty about gravity, mass, space time curvatures and the like as causes... but the effect is pretty damn certain :)

SQUISH?

Elder Iptuous

this reminds me of a book that i have to pick back up.
it's called "Zen and the Brain" by James Austin M.D.
hes a neuroscientist that practices Zen as well as brain research.  it was very interesting, discussing the physiological aspects of the various brain states achieved with Zen...

it was a good number of years ago that i picked it up, but i recall it was pretty dense.


rong

The OP would be very enlightening to many.

I believe the enlightenment described in the OP is a conclusion where one stopped thinking.

I also choose to interpret "enlightened" literally as "un-burdened" mainly in the sense of no longer carrying the mental weight of unanswered questions whether by answering the question or dismissing the value of the answer.

I enjoyed this thread and found many quotable elements in the op. Nice job.
"a real smart feller, he felt smart"

Cramulus

I like the OP

it brings to mind this comic I found the other day:




I do believe in enlightenment, but I like LMNO's angle on it. It's not like you pass into the enlightened state and remain there for the rest of your life. I have moments of extreme lucidity, and I have long stretches of zombie trance.

I can identify a few moments in my life, however, where something CLICKED -- and I was better for it. I'd call those moments of enlightenment. There's this Zen idea that enlightenment happens suddenly, without warning... it's not like academic knowledge. you don't get it by doing your homework every night for four years and then it's handed to you by some guy in a mortarboard. Anyway, I feel like a douchebag for trying to describe the ineffable so I'll cut it off there.  :p

Cramulus


P3nT4gR4m

One thing I'd add is there is enlightenment and there's ENLIGHTENMENT. Like the buddhists are going on about some big mystical all encompassing oneness gobshite but there's also the feeling you get when you realise or learn something new. That's enlightenment too. Buddha will tell you that enlightenment is often accompanied by laughter. You never had that feeling when someone has been trying to explain something to you but you just can't get it but then suddenly the penny drops and you just crack up? That's enlightenment. Happens all the time. ENLIGHTENMENTtm is just that sensation applied to metaphysical wankery

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I see "enlightenment" as the ah-ha moment where you have a shift in perspective and GET something. It only lasts for a second, and then the information is integrated into your worldview.
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