Its been a while since I made fun of terrible things on tumblr....

[Dildo Argentino]

But let me reframe my initial point.

- hit myself in the junk with the hammer -

"Oops, shouldn't have done that"

"But you wanted to, 'cos that's what you are like."

"Actually, what I meant to do was something quite different, it was..."

- more voices join in -

"No it wasn't, you sad, ridiculous, backpedalling bastard"

"Let me try to explain..."

"Shut the fuck up already!"

[Mesozoic Mister Nigel]

Yea, it is entirely that you're a poor, beleaguered, misunderstood soul, and none if it has in any way to do with your own behavior.

[Pæs]

Don't worry, Dodo. While some of these other people are refusing to play along with your 'unjust persecution' interpretation of events, I am more than willing to totally write you off for no reason at all, other than that you don't seem to be very well liked by anyone else, because I want to support you and your position.

So fuck you and you're welcome.

[EK WAFFLR]

ACTUALLY, it's everyone else who is at fault. Not Dodo. He's a special snowflake.

[trix]

But but but, if he could just make us UNDERSTAND that we're totally taking everything he says wrong, and we should just assume that everything he says he means in the best, most intelligent and respectful of ways possible.

It's hard for me to make fun of the guy, given that his position here so very well mirrors mine before I learned better.

Which is why my only other post in this thread was quoting myself from the Story of Trix.

[Mesozoic Mister Nigel]

Don't worry, Dodo. While some of these other people are refusing to play along with your 'unjust persecution' interpretation of events, I am more than willing to totally write you off for no reason at all, other than that you don't seem to be very well liked by anyone else, because I want to support you and your position.

So fuck you and you're welcome.

[Doktor Howl]

But let me reframe my initial point.

- hit myself in the junk with the hammer -

"Oops, shouldn't have done that"

"But you wanted to, 'cos that's what you are like."

"Actually, what I meant to do was something quite different, it was..."

- more voices join in -

"No it wasn't, you sad, ridiculous, backpedalling bastard"

"Let me try to explain..."

"Shut the fuck up already!"

How many years has it been?  And you're just figuring this out now?

It's almost like you have trouble communicating.

[Doktor Howl]

It's rather fascinating how this board tends to make people double down on their positions.

Crazy people start screaming at Roger and Nigel about the thing from 20 years ago that they feel strongly about or film adverts being really real.

Racists wait for the opportunity to just drop any semblance of humanity and start screaming about them folk from not round here who look different.

And the dullards, well, need I say more?

It's amazing.  They get burned, so they pull their underwear onto their head and run screaming at the wall.

I have never been able to explain it.

[Doktor Howl]

I think it's important to remember that in Dodo, we are dealing with the actual smartest user of the board; a person who knows American English better than those for whom it is their native tongue. He may not be a trained linguist or etymologist, but his years of experience translating technical documents gives him knowledge much deeper and broader than anyone who has studied English or, certainly, merely grown up speaking it.

Therefore, we should not argue with his corrections, however condescending, but instead, bow our heads before his wisdom.

Is there a name for the disorder characterised by the obsessive attribution of condescension?

No, but there is one for the disorder characterized by limited or absent theory of mind, including but not limited to the inability to understand why other people will perceive certain statements and behavior as condescending. It's called "autism".

I think I had "inferiority complex" in mind. I wasn't 100% sure about it (as I am sure the venerable Cain was!), so I looked up the etymology of 'homosexual'. I found a funny quote, so I thought I'd share it... primarily with Joe, who seemed interested.

Supposing I were autistic... what exactly would repeatedly rubbing my nose in it accomplish? And... would I be morally culpable?

The interesting thing is that the lack of theory of mind only becomes a massive social liability when it's combined with the kind of hubris that insists on denying other people's experience, as in when the affected person is under the delusional belief that they know more about what others are experiencing than they themselves do.

I think you are wrong there, and doubly so. Firstly, either way, combined with hubris or not, the lack of a theory of mind, as exhibited by severely autistic people, is a massive social liability. More interestingly, it seems practically tautological that having a theory of mind is a necessary condition for having the delusional belief that one knows more about what others are experiencing than they themselves do. In order to have experiences, you need to have mind. So, in order to attribute experiences to others, you need to have a theory of mind that you apply to them. So, I think, one could have the delusional belief about others that you were describing, or one could suffer from autism, but not both at the same time.

So while the deficit itself is not a character or moral flaw, the arrogance of insisting that one's behavior is not condescending, and refusing to modify it accordingly despite being told repeatedly that others are perceiving it as such, is.

Given the above, we're left with the assertion that the arrogance of insisting that one's behaviour is not condescending, and refusing to modify it accordingly despite being told repeatedly that others are perceiving it as such, is a character or moral flaw.

I think that very much depends on whether those others perceive correctly or not. Is arrogance in the eye of the beholder? I think that's going too far. It seems clearly possible to be wrong about whether another person is arrogant (cultural mismatch, rather different linguistic habits, lack of sufficient communication for a robust conclusion... there are probably other possible reasons.

Is it possible to be condescending without noticing? I think that's a question of definition. We can decide whether the intention to condescend is an essential part of the concept or not. I think I prefer to say yes to that question and call a person who appears to be condescending without intending to be condescending just socially inept, sometimes even naive (early teens are very good at this) - this way, it is much easier to learn not to take offence.

In this particular instance, I had no intention to be condescending. There have been other times, when I permitted myself to use a condescening tone on this forum: when I thought that the views I encountered (correctly or incorrectly) were not only wrong, but really laughably so, or when I was responding to abusive condescension. Much the same has been done to me, repeatedly, in fact, it seems to be done to most newcomers, which is puzzling, hence interesting... I've been told that while I do not experience myself as an aspie, I am in fact one, I was told that while I do not experience myself as a racist person, I am in fact one, I was told that while I do not experience myself as arrogant and have no intention of being arrogant, I am in fact continuously insufferably arrogant. One of the last times this happened, I was accused of obliquely responding to Alty's relationship troubles in an insensitive, rude and downright rotten fashion, which I wasn't... but I was told that I was. Quite likely (well, unless I am just ignored, which is also a strong possibility), I will now be told that I am lying. Are those character or moral flaws as well?

The fact is, after some ups and downs, several of the most vocal members decided that I was an arrogant attention-seeking prick not worth any attention, unless, possibly, as a target for abuse to alleviate boredom. Hooray.

NOTHING EVER CHANGES.

[Dildo Argentino]

Yea, it is entirely that you're a poor, beleaguered, misunderstood soul, and none if it has in any way to do with your own behavior.

No, it has a great deal to do with my behaviour. I joined the board in a really cocky mood, made the mistake of thinking I could just join the banter and become a regular immediately, which was stupid. Then I kicked entirely the wrong bucket with the homeopathy thing, which was also cocky and stupid. After that: the archaic minds were different to modern minds, the 3rd world cities have deep differences to 1st world cities, the self-employed translation business has some similarity to sex work thing... I still think those were interesting points, but I came off as condescening, hardly ever stopped to think about it and achieved arsehole status in double-quick time. Since then, I've been sporadically present, unable to get out from under the rock I certainly helped put on me.

[Dildo Argentino]

Don't worry, Dodo. While some of these other people are refusing to play along with your 'unjust persecution' interpretation of events, I am more than willing to totally write you off for no reason at all, other than that you don't seem to be very well liked by anyone else, because I want to support you and your position.

So fuck you and you're welcome.

You are too kind, sir! 

[Dildo Argentino]

But let me reframe my initial point.

- hit myself in the junk with the hammer -

"Oops, shouldn't have done that"

"But you wanted to, 'cos that's what you are like."

"Actually, what I meant to do was something quite different, it was..."

- more voices join in -

"No it wasn't, you sad, ridiculous, backpedalling bastard"

"Let me try to explain..."

"Shut the fuck up already!"

How many years has it been?  And you're just figuring this out now?

It's almost like you have trouble communicating.

It is, isn't it? 

Surprisingly, it's only been 3.5 years and less than fifteen hundred posts, only less than half of those really relevant. By my standards, that's excellent going. I have some major ruts it took me over 30 years to get out of. I smoked dope all the time I was awake for about 15. So 3.5 years (provided I am making some progress here, we'll see) - not bad.

[Dildo Argentino]

For all of this, I should add, I am kinda grateful.   

[Pæs]

WAIT. DODO IS HOLIST?

OKAY, IT ALL MAKES SENSE NOW. AS YOU WERE, EVERYONE.

[Dildo Argentino]

WAIT. DODO IS HOLIST?

OKAY, IT ALL MAKES SENSE NOW. AS YOU WERE, EVERYONE.

Oh. You didn't know. Damn!