Your body

[Thurnez Isa]

I have never seen the continuum idea presented outside a feminist context, and I don't believe the debate is actually between medical researchers. I believe the debate is between scientists and ideologues, much like the debate over creationism.

between scientists and other scientists as peer review goes
like I said Im very unfamiliar with genetics and with the debate
and I don't know diddly squat about feminism, so I wouldn't know anything about that

[Thurnez Isa]

[quote author=Thurnez Isa link=topic=19634.msg657868#msg657868 date=1234465219
Now my knowledge of genetics is not comfortable but there is a ongoing debate between medical researchers, who maintain that gender development is an example of dichotomy (meaning two contradictory parts) and genetic researchers who maintain gender development is and example of continuum (meaning all separate parts are arbitrary) Now I admit I  haven't read a lot on the subject, and only have vague remembrance of articles I half read. I could say the division between animal sexes can get really complicated
I would be interested in a biologists opinion...[/quote]


repeated for BMW... figure you might now more
sorry about grammar really busy

[Thurnez Isa]

Now my knowledge of genetics is not comfortable but there is a ongoing debate between medical researchers, who maintain that gender development is an example of dichotomy (meaning two contradictory parts) and genetic researchers who maintain gender development is and example of continuum (meaning all separate parts are arbitrary) Now I admit I  haven't read a lot on the subject, and only have vague remembrance of articles I half read. I could say the division between animal sexes can get really complicated
I would be interested in a biologists opinion...

repeated for BMW... figure you might now more
sorry about the grammar Im really busy as its the last few days before reading week

[Mesozoic Mister Nigel]

It's really fascinating that Little Jefe seems to believe that philosophy is the ONLY form of intellectualism possible, and to dislike philosophers = anti-intellectual.

(I only hate the living ones, Jefe. A dead philosopher is a good philosopher.)

At the same time, English, writing, and reading comprehension don't seem to be his strong points... despite his claim to be a "professional writer", which sounds suspiciously like "blogger" to me. Probably a Very Important blogger, too, with practically dozens of other Important Modern Philosophers (unemployable co-sycophantic web pedants) following his frequently-updated (due to being unemployable) Very Important Drivel.

[Dead Kennedy]

Dude, you don't even know the difference between a premise and an opening statement...

Are you really so stupid that you can't even identify the premise of your own post?   

[Dead Kennedy]

As for your whole take on gender, eat a dick, twatface. Yes, I am insulting you. No, I will not waste my time pretending anything you say is greater than useless drivel.   You're just another one of those needle dicks with a BA in Philosophy...

I do not have a BA in Philosophy.  My major was criminal justice, my minor was women's studies.  I'm just well read.  Unlike you.

[Dead Kennedy]

It's really fascinating that Little Jefe seems to believe that philosophy is the ONLY form of intellectualism possible, and to dislike philosophers = anti-intellectual.

I have never made any claims of the sort.  What I have suggested is that hating on philosophers when one clearly knows nothing about philosophy is anti-intellectual.

Is the glorification of ignorance.   Essentially many people are using the argument "You appear to have an education, therefore you must be wrong.  And elitist!"

That's fucking retarded.

At the same time, English, writing, and reading comprehension don't seem to be his strong points...

BWAH-HAH-HAH-HAH!!!!

Oh, that is too damn funny.

despite his claim to be a "professional writer", which sounds suspiciously like "blogger" to me. Probably a Very Important blogger, too, with practically dozens of other Important Modern Philosophers (unemployable co-sycophantic web pedants) following his frequently-updated (due to being unemployable) Very Important Drivel.

I'm a screenwriter.  I write for television.

[Mesozoic Mister Nigel]

Dude, you don't even know the difference between a premise and an opening statement...

Are you really so stupid that you can't even identify the premise of your own post?   

The premise is that biology is simply what it is, and to decide that you are something else based on social constructs is just a story you're telling yourself.

And you are a complete fucking idiot. At one point I was convinced that you were pretty smart, but an asshole. It's more and more evident that you're one of those people who can memorize but not think. And an asshole.

[Mesozoic Mister Nigel]

I'm a screenwriter.  I write for television.

You write THAT shit????



Does any of it get used?

[Mesozoic Mister Nigel]

Never mind! I don't really care. You're a disrespectful, unoriginal drone pratting around trying to pick fights about Descartes, and you write SCREENPLAYS FOR TELEVISION.  Could it get any better?

Go stuff yourself full of more philosophical drivel so you can regurgitate it for us, monkey. Dance!

[Kai]

[quote author=Thurnez Isa link=topic=19634.msg657868#msg657868 date=1234465219
Now my knowledge of genetics is not comfortable but there is a ongoing debate between medical researchers, who maintain that gender development is an example of dichotomy (meaning two contradictory parts) and genetic researchers who maintain gender development is and example of continuum (meaning all separate parts are arbitrary) Now I admit I  haven't read a lot on the subject, and only have vague remembrance of articles I half read. I could say the division between animal sexes can get really complicated
I would be interested in a biologists opinion...

repeated for BMW... figure you might now more
sorry about grammar really busy
[/quote]

It is. Sexes, for humans at least, are fixed from birth, since we have binary sex chromosomes, and when I say sex, I mean genetic sex. I mean, you get an X and a Y or an X and an X or an X or an X and an X and a Y or a X and a Y and a Y, and thats it, you can't change that. HOWEVER, secondary sexual characterics (the phenotype) are a continuum, as is gender. Hell, you CAN get true hermaphrodites provided there is some sort of chimeralism going on, but its more general that an intersexed person will have some sort of gradient of secondary sexual characteristics. Indeed, there is no absolute as far as what is male and what is female sex wise culturally EXCEPT genes.

And then theres gender.... not even gonna go there, gone there too much. My feelings are pretty similar to the ones in the OP.

Now, in insects for example, there aren't binary sex chromosomes, theres only one, its called X. If there are two x's then its what entomologists would consider female sexed, and if it has only one x then its male. Now, because there is only one type of sex chromosome, you can get all sorts of sexual weirdness in insects, like bilateral gynandromorphs, where one half is male, complete with testis and adeagus, and the other half is female with an ovary, a true hermaphrodite, and this happens more often than people think. There are insects that can change sex halfway through their lifecycle, can determine the sex of the egg, and then theres parthenogenesis, where females give way to female clones until its time to mate and then males get made, all by /removing a sex chromosome during development/.

Also, spotted hyenas, but don't get me started about those.  

Unless you want to argue that gender is the same in all cultures, and that gender is always related to sex, and that sex is immutable and always binary everywhere, DK really has no arguement. If phenotypic sex (meaning the sex that is expressed, like if I have a penis and wide hips and breasts, or a vagina and face stubble) is a continuum/gradient, then why would gender be any different? The only reason someone would argue for the binary sex/gender arguement is that they are either militantly stupid, or they need it to justify their mysogynistic/mysandric worldviews.

Yeah, thats right. DK is just another sexist xenophobic libertarian wannabe.

[Dead Kennedy]

The premise is that biology is simply what it is, and to decide that you are something else based on social constructs is just a story you're telling yourself.

No, that was not the premise of the piece you wrote. 

And you are a complete fucking idiot. At one point I was convinced that you were pretty smart, but an asshole. It's more and more evident that you're one of those people who can memorize but not think. And an asshole.

Aww.  You're still a moron.

[Kai]

As for your whole take on gender, eat a dick, twatface. Yes, I am insulting you. No, I will not waste my time pretending anything you say is greater than useless drivel.   You're just another one of those needle dicks with a BA in Philosophy...

I do not have a BA in Philosophy.  My major was criminal justice, my minor was women's studies.  I'm just well read.  Unlike you.

I've got a BS in biology and in the process of getting a masters. I grew up in a library.   There is nothing you can say that will make me do more than laugh at you and your pittiful....SCREENWRITING!!  

[Mesozoic Mister Nigel]

The premise is that biology is simply what it is, and to decide that you are something else based on social constructs is just a story you're telling yourself.

No, that was not the premise of the piece you wrote. 

Says the fuckwit who thinks my rant about people's nonstop running off at the mouth also applies to written communication. 

[Kai]

The premise is that biology is simply what it is, and to decide that you are something else based on social constructs is just a story you're telling yourself.

No, that was not the premise of the piece you wrote. 

Yes, yes it was the premise, as a BIOLOGIST, I got /IT/. Okay? You can go on and on about criminal justice or women's studies or screenwriting or whatever you want to do, but when it comes to biology I'M THE SMARTEST MOTHERFUCKER HERE.

And I don't much like you acting you know anything about biology, okay? Thats MY domain, and I am sure any person here will tell you I am DAMN GOOD at biology. So back the fuck off until you've read Darwin, Mendel, Watson and Crick, McClintock and everything else I've read about the subject, not to mention all the interdisciplinary work I've done in geology, chemistry and physics.

Fucktard. DO NEVER STEP. Specially not on Darwin's birthday.