The Collective "You" (short).

[Kai]

There's this tendency to generalize when making statements of opinion. And I don't mean the "all sheep are black" sorts of opinions. I'm talking about making declarative statements as if they are fact which use the collective "you". Example: "You know when you go outside and it's raining, and you didn't know beforehand, and you end up wet and irritated and crabby with your co workers? This is why you should always bring an umbrella." Completely made up, I'm sure you could provide your own. (Hey, there's another one!).

What it seems is that these are projection. The speaker assumes everyone else shares his or her experience, and projects their opinions into the ether. This is annoying. Maybe I check the weather before going outside, or don't get crabby when I get soaking wet. The collective you not only pretends that the opinions are general, but also avoids taking responsibility for those opinions.

Antero Ali has a segment on this in Angel Tech, and I can't remember it exactly but it goes something like this: When stating an opinion, use "I" or "me" or "myself" instead of "you". This takes responsibility and agency into the hands of the wielder, and avoids passing the buck. At which point I can say, "Sorry, I don't share your experience", because it's quite clear that the statement is opinion and theirs. I don't have to pretend it's fact because there's no collective you.

[Mesozoic Mister Nigel]

That's really good advice. It also helps dispel the false sense of consensus in the speaker.

[LMNO]

Not to play the semantic game, but I feel the intent is this:

"Have you ever gone outside and it's raining, and you didn't know beforehand, and you end up wet and irritated and crabby with your co workers?

I think it's a way of trying to find a Common Wall.  However,

This is why you should always bring an umbrella."

is probably projection, like you said.

[Cramulus]

Huh, I never thought about it that way, interesting point.

The collective you is probably useful if you're trying to persuade somebody though, I can see situations where you'd want to use it (Hah!). Encourages the audience to visualize themselves in that position being described.

The alternative, using the generic "one", makes one sound a bit like yoda IMO.

[Kai]

Not to play the semantic game, but I feel the intent is this:

"Have you ever gone outside and it's raining, and you didn't know beforehand, and you end up wet and irritated and crabby with your co workers?

I think it's a way of trying to find a Common Wall.  However,

This is why you should always bring an umbrella."

is probably projection, like you said.

I was pressed for an example and I didn't want to plagiarize without permission. It ended up being a poor example.

[LMNO]

I apologize for the pedantry.

[The Good Reverend Roger]

Frankly, I can't imagine how you'd communicate at all without some form (assumed) common reference points.

[AFK]

Particularily if you are communicating with a group of people about an idea or concept.  You kind of have to establish common ground for the discussion, but of course it won't apply to all absolutely.

[The Good Reverend Roger]

"You" in that sense means "we".

Contrast that with "You People".

[Cardinal Pizza Deliverance.]

Established common reference points are good. Assumed common reference points are bad.

I know people who are LOUSY with assuming I have arrived to the same conclusions they did and then they get bent when I don't and use the line : "I don't know what your problem is, we have the exact same set of information."

[Reginald Ret]

Established common reference points are good. Assumed common reference points are bad.

I know people who are LOUSY with assuming I have arrived to the same conclusions they did and then they get bent when I don't and use the line : "I don't know what your problem is, we have the exact same set of information."

"Unlike you, I am not a computer"

[Bu🤠ns]

I can see a distinction between describing the human experience and assuming the opinions of others...

"You know that feeling you get when you are about to fall asleep and you begin to dream about something and then something happens where you trip and fall.  Then all of a sudden you wake up with a startle!" 

compared to...

"Ohhh you know about those liberals!" 

Often I will catch my self saying You and I'll (sometimes) correct myself by saying "and by you I mean me."  My intention is to draw someone into the human experience by pointing out the faulty language we were both assuming.  I mean I doubt many people will consider the "You" issue Kai brought up in the OP during normal conversation.

[The Johnny]

"one" vs. "you" seems to work sometimes, coupled with "sometimes" or something like that...

for example...

Example: "You know when you go outside and it's raining, and you didn't know beforehand, and you end up wet and irritated and crabby with your co workers? This is why you should always bring an umbrella." Completely made up, I'm sure you could provide your own. (Hey, there's another one!).

One would think when going outside and its raining, and didnt know beforehand, one would end up wet and irritated and crabby with its co-workers. This is why one should always bring an umbrella. Completely made up, Im sure everyone could provide their own."

[Mesozoic Mister Nigel]

I think that what Kai is talking about is the language we use when trying to connect with or influence people.

[Cainad (dec.)]

Right, it seems to be a way to influence whatever mini-narrative you're relaying so that the person interprets it in first-person perspective, rather than third-person (as with the use of the formal "one").

The ability to project our sense of self into a possible scenario, either to speculate or to empathize with another person, is a pretty powerful tool for getting certain kinds of information across. Combine that with how fluid and changeable human memory can be, and you get that false consensus effect:

Spag 1: "You know what it's like, when you <scenario that the listener has never actually been in>."

Spag 2: "Yeah, yeah totally!"


as compared to:

Spag 1: "One knows what it's like when one <exact same scenario>."

Spag 2: "Who the hell talks like that?"



*All of the above based on rigorous research of a study*

Actually I'd like to see an experiment that compares people's reactions to the same information expressed in these two different ways.