Help me understand the tea party

[Disco Pickle]

Nope, I'm sure there are plenty of bigots in the Tea Party.  Statistically, there would have to be.  It is a bit (quite a bit) of a generalization to say the entire group

(I'm pretty shit for analogy's today, but then I'm supposed to be working atm.)

How is it a generalization to say a group that you have to be a bigot to be accepted in is 100% bigots?

But, you don't.  You just think you do, because that's what you want to believe, because it makes it easier for you to dismiss anything else that might be said by anyone identifying with them.

That happens a LOT with people. 

[LMNO]

Any =/= some.

Well as it happens, your reply didn't strike me as bigoted, and I wasn't calling you one, but I understand how it goes around here when there's blood in the water.

Well, I do feel similarly.  And I was pretty sure you were getting your terms crossed, so I wanted to help.  Also, it's really funny to see you call Dok a bigot.

Sorry, I can't keep up with you guys fast enough when you're double teaming me.

[Disco Pickle]

BRB.  I have to go to a meeting, in which I will express disdain for people who aren't just like me.

Yeah, I really need to go back to work on these damn boxes.  I'll try and drop in occasionaly.

LMNO, regarding your explanation of the definition and my reply that Dok dismissed because I didn't type it fast enough.  Am I getting it wrong and if so, where?

[Anna Mae Bollocks]

Nope, I'm sure there are plenty of bigots in the Tea Party.  Statistically, there would have to be.  It is a bit (quite a bit) of a generalization to say the entire group

(I'm pretty shit for analogy's today, but then I'm supposed to be working atm.)

How is it a generalization to say a group that you have to be a bigot to be accepted in is 100% bigots?

But, you don't.  You just think you do, because that's what you want to believe, because it makes it easier for you to dismiss anything else that might be said by anyone identifying with them.

That happens a LOT with people. 

DP. have you actually looked at their stance on immigration or religion?

[Anna Mae Bollocks]

Or Muslims, or a fuckload of other things...

[LMNO]

LMNO, regarding your explanation of the definition and my reply that Dok dismissed because I didn't type it fast enough.  Am I getting it wrong and if so, where?

I typed this before I saw your question, so my next post will address that.

DP, you're wading into semantic territory here.

Anyone can call themselves a Teabagger.

There are several platforms that Teabaggers hold dear.  Among them are xenophobia, homophobia, creationism, and certain irrational beliefs about the government and the free market.

A person can say, "I am a Teabagger, but I am not a racist," but if you choose to wear the label, you choose to tacitly wear the beliefs of the majorty of the group.

It would be like saying, "I am a Catholic, but I don't recognize the rite of baptism."  

I have met people who say they like some of the Teabagger platforms, but don't want to be associated with the fuckheads.  That's fine, sort of, but the point is that they do not identify as a teabagger, because they disagree with parts of it.

So, when we say, "Teabaggers are racist, bigoted nutbags", we refer to those who espouse the tea party platform in all it's hateful glory.

[Disco Pickle]

Or Muslims, or a fuckload of other things...

You'll find people with those beliefs in quite a few political blocks other than the Tea Party.  The religiously intolerant are not somehow relegated only to the Tea Party.  Neither are immigration policies based entirely on racism, but ARE certainly very based in nationalism.

But ok, which Tea Party organization are you talking about, and please to provide links to support these positions.

[LMNO]

DP, the inclusion of "any" in the definiton of "bigot" gives it a very solipsistic feel.  That is, you are intolerant of any other belief out there.

"All of my beliefs are 100% correct.  All others are THE DEVIL."

What we're expressing is more specific than that.

"Bigotry is FUCKED.  But if you have different, non-bigoted beliefs than I do, that's cool."

See the difference?

[Disco Pickle]

DP, the inclusion of "any" in the definiton of "bigot" gives it a very solipsistic feel.  That is, you are intolerant of any other belief out there.

"All of my beliefs are 100% correct.  All others are THE DEVIL."

What we're expressing is more specific than that.

"Bigotry is FUCKED.  But if you have different, non-bigoted beliefs than I do, that's cool."

See the difference?

Very clear, thank you.

[LMNO]

Of course, now I've just ruined all of Dok's fun for the day...



Sorry, Dok.  I could call you names, if you'd like.

[Anna Mae Bollocks]

Or Muslims, or a fuckload of other things...

You'll find people with those beliefs in quite a few political blocks other than the Tea Party.

True, and those people suck too. But a racist person who supports moveon, for example, is a fluke, while this shit is what DEFINES the Tea Party.

The religiously intolerant are not somehow relegated only to the Tea Party.  Neither are immigration policies based entirely on racism, but ARE certainly very based in nationalism.

Compare the Mexican border to the Canadian border. Racism.

Nationalism is bad too, though, it's for nazis.

But ok, which Tea Party organization are you talking about, and please to provide links to support these positions.

http://lmgtfy.com/?q=tea+party+bigotry

[AFK]

You only need to look at the policy aims and statements of Tea Partiers to surmise there is at least some level of bigotry or prejudice at play.  When they say they want to take their country back....who are they taking it back from?  Who took it from them?  The Black President.  The Black President, whom many Tea Party activists will criticize for "apologizing to our enemies", for building Big Government to help the poor (who are made up of significant numbers of minorities)....

But then....you peel back another layer of the Onion, and we have this.  That many of them have a strong social conservative streak.  That they actually want Big Government, they just want less of it in the checkbook and more of it in the bedroom.  This entails discrimination of homosexual Americans.  Poor, pregnant women (again made up of a large number of minorities)

If you really look at the body of their policy positions, it really does begin to paint a very compelling portrait of a movement that wants to protect their idea of America for their idea of True Americans.  The poor minorities are not part of that, the gays and lesbians are not a part of that, Muslims are not a part of that, college students are not a part of that, old people who can't afford healthcare are not a part of that.  

The WASPiness of this movement is plainly obvious to anyone.  To call this out is not bigotry.  It is honest and forthright policy analysis.  Their policies are only good for certain Americans, they are BAD for all Americans.  

[Doktor Howl]

I think DP might have confused "Bigotry" with "Bias".

Yes, I am biased against people who are bigots.

I wouldn't say that there's an equivalence, however.

I meant in this manner:

World English Dictionary
bigot  (ˈbɪɡət) [Click for IPA pronunciation guide]

— n
   a person who is intolerant of any ideas other than his or her own, esp on religion, politics, or race

Bolded for the applicable word here.  I am biased against a bigoted idea, which is other than my own.

I am not biased against a non-bigoted idea, if it is other than my own.

Any =/= some.

Well as it happens, your reply didn't strike me as bigoted, and I wasn't calling you one, but I understand how it goes around here when there's blood in the water.

Wasn't his point.  The definition is "any", not "a".

[Doktor Howl]

Of course, now I've just ruined all of Dok's fun for the day...



Sorry, Dok.  I could call you names, if you'd like.

[Disco Pickle]

Or Muslims, or a fuckload of other things...

You'll find people with those beliefs in quite a few political blocks other than the Tea Party.

True, and those people suck too. But a racist person who supports moveon, for example, is a fluke, while this shit is what DEFINES the Tea Party.

The religiously intolerant are not somehow relegated only to the Tea Party.  Neither are immigration policies based entirely on racism, but ARE certainly very based in nationalism.

Compare the Mexican border to the Canadian border. Racism.

Nationalism is bad too, though, it's for nazis.

But ok, which Tea Party organization are you talking about, and please to provide links to support these positions.

http://lmgtfy.com/?q=tea+party+bigotry

If Canadians were impoverished and pouring across the border, I argue that you'd see a similar reaction.  Granted, maybe not with the same fervor.  But difference of language goes a lot more to engender bias against another nationality than it gets credit for in popular discourse.  Just look at Quebecois vs the rest of Canada.  Same skin colors, but a bias against based in linguistic differences.  Of course there are racists who judge only on skin color, but when clear communication can occur between people you find communities where skin color is less of an issue.