ADD Drugs Do More Harm than Good

[Prince Glittersnatch III]

http://www.atimes.com/atimes/Global_Economy/NA31Dj01.html

In the January 29 New York Times, [1] a prominent professor of child development shows that attention-deficit-disorder drugs only harm the three million children who take them. One out of 10 American children have been diagnosed with so-called Attention Deficit/Hyperactivity Disorder and most of them have been medicated. [2]

''Back in the 1960s I, like most psychologists, believed that children with difficulty concentrating were suffering from a brain problem of genetic or otherwise inborn origin. Just as Type I diabetics need insulin to correct problems with their inborn biochemistry, these children were believed to require attention-deficit drugs to correct theirs. It turns out, however, that there is little to no evidence to support this theory.''

Of particular note.

Some months ago, the Times reported that test scores lagged in school districts that invested massively in digital education. [3] It does not seem to have occurred to the mandarins that computers cause attention deficit disorder. The brain is a machine, in the enlightened secular model, and so-called brain science teaches us to tweak its functioning with pharmaceuticals, or stimulate its development through digital approximations of intelligence. The grand result of a generation's worth of brain-science application is a generation of schoolchildren who are disproportionately illiterate, innumerate, anxious, angry, and unhappy.

Which reminds me of: http://www.nytimes.com/2010/11/21/technology/21brain.html?ref=yourbrainoncomputers

[The Good Reverend Roger]

ADD is - in my humble, non-medically trained opinion - just another way of saying "future shock", we just use different brain-smashing drugs on it than we do on older people, who have to rely on Prosac.

[Cramulus]

While I strongly agree that ADD is overdiagnosed and that America's kids are badly overmedicated, I don't want to brush off the whole disease. It IS a real thing, many kids benefit enormously from that type of medication. Do 1 out of 10 kids need it? Definitely fucking not. But let's be careful before saying that NONE of those kids are being helped by their medication.

[The Good Reverend Roger]

While I strongly agree that ADD is overdiagnosed and that America's kids are badly overmedicated, I don't want to brush off the whole disease. It IS a real thing, many kids benefit enormously from that type of medication. Do 1 out of 10 kids need it? Definitely fucking not. But let's be careful before saying that NONE of those kids are being helped by their medication.

I don't agree that they're over-medicated.  I think they're screwed up for the same reason adults are.  Too much input, too much information, smacking into a monkey brain that is programmed to deal with only 5 stressors.

[Cramulus]

you don't think kids are overmedicated? Something seems really weird to me about a 9 year old taking a fist full of pills. Personally, I think we should let kids brains develop before we medicate them. It's the same with pot and booze - wait till your brain is fully baked before you start experimenting with its chemistry.


I didn't believe ADD or ADHD was a "real" disease until I went to a really good lecture by an MD named Jeffery Halperin. While I cannot recall the details of the lecture anymore, I remember walking out of there pretty confident that there is a real brain chemistry difference between ADD kids and "normals". Halperin points out that lots of ADD cases go away by puberty. And to treat ADD and ADHD, he recommends "regular outdoor exercise" before you cram your kid full of pills. Good advice, IMO, because a number of these ADD cases are just bad parenting.

[Elder Iptuous]

... I remember walking out of there pretty confident that there is a real brain chemistry difference between ADD kids and "normals"....

does a brain chemistry difference necessarily indicate disease?
doesn't an entirely 'normal' brain develop chemistry differences when given a different set of stimuli?
and isn't there chemistry difference between brains that would both be considered 'normal', and wouldn't prompt medication?
at what point does personality become pathology?

[Cramulus]

those are great questions

does a brain chemistry difference necessarily indicate disease?

Psychological pathology gets really weird at the borders, especially when you're talking about behavioral things. What IS the difference between a "psychological disease" and, say, having a weird opinion, attitude, lifestyle, et cetera?

The evidence that people with ADDs brains are physically different is part of the ongoing "Is this a real disease?" dialog. The observable physical traits of ADD are evidence that ADD isn't just "kids who consume too much sugar and television".

---and that did need to be said. There's still a vibe out there that all kids with ADD really just need discipline. And I think this is missing the point just as much as medicating all kids who don't want to do their homework.

Do physical abnormalities imply you should try to "normalize" those brains? That's another kettle of fish. Ultimately, it's subjective - doctors don't really decide that your kid should be medicated, parents do. There's no medical requirement for people with depression (for example) to go on meds, it's something that the patient should decide for him/herself.

[Jasper]

I take the stance that everything we are, and ever will naturally evolve into, are mutations.  Whether they are called diseases or not are a matter of success.  Can people with ADD live functional, happy, productive lives?  Sometimes yes, sometimes less so.  It's hard to call it a disease based on that.

This is just my opinion.  All biology I know is self-taught.

[The Good Reverend Roger]

you don't think kids are overmedicated? Something seems really weird to me about a 9 year old taking a fist full of pills. Personally, I think we should let kids brains develop before we medicate them.

Here's the problem:  People now exist in an environment where it is damn near impossible to develop a young primate properly.  There are too many stressors in the environment.  If you took an adult from 1700 and brought them to modern America, they'd go bonkers, and not because of superstition, etc, but rather the fact that they'd have no filters for dealing with the insane flood of information and demands put upon people by modern life.  Most people can sort of adapt to this if raised in it, but many cannot.

[Cain]

Spenger's article is full of silly ideological bullshit, as it always is.

The NYT article is somewhat better, though I'm going to do more research and think about what it says.

[Prince Glittersnatch III]

I do think that ADD is a very real biological condition, if an over diagnosed one. There are all sorts of weird little things like correlation with dysgraphia and inner ear problems that suggest that its biological.

But one thing I have noticed is as a whole peoples attention spans have gone down, especially young people. I was watching Texas Chainsaw Massacre the other day and it occurred to me if it was made today the Van Scene would be half the length.

Sure enough: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ChexglKUhaE

Keep in mind this wasn't high art, it was a fucking slasher movie made for stupid teenagers. Yet I cant show my friend Reservoir Dogs without him complaining about all the "long boring talking parts". Something is very fucking wrong.

[Cramulus]

In some alternate timeline, people are talking about how kids these days can't sit through a silent film without complain about the "long boring non-talking parts". 

[Prince Glittersnatch III]

In some alternate timeline, people are talking about how kids these days can't sit through a silent film without complain about the "long boring non-talking parts". 

[Freeky]

But one thing I have noticed is as a whole peoples attention spans have gone down, especially young people. I was watching Texas Chainsaw Massacre the other day and it occurred to me if it was made today the Van Scene would be half the length.

Sure enough: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ChexglKUhaE

Keep in mind this wasn't high art, it was a fucking slasher movie made for stupid teenagers. Yet I cant show my friend Reservoir Dogs without him complaining about all the "long boring talking parts". Something is very fucking wrong.

Related:

I was watching a Half in the Bag review of Cowboys and Aliens, and they said something along the lines of a lot of people might not like it because it's slow to get moving what with all the character development and all. 

I watched it quite soon after that, and I was like "People would have issues with this moving too slowly?  "  I agree, I think people who can focus on stuff that are deeper than "BOOM! ACTION! SHINY!" are a dying breed. 

[Q. G. Pennyworth]

I just think there are a lot of people who aren't very good at doing risk/benefit analysis for medications in general, and doctors are either unwilling or unable to give them any help in that regard. Sure, there are people who have legitimate attention problems, but the improved classroom/work performance has to be balanced against (among other things) the risk of life-long chemical dependency. If you aren't gonna graduate high school without it, then sure, that's totally reasonable.