Principia Discordia

Principia Discordia => Two vast and trunkless legs of stone => Topic started by: E.O.T. on April 19, 2011, 05:25:07 AM

Title: RAEP IS GOOD MAJIK
Post by: E.O.T. on April 19, 2011, 05:25:07 AM

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZbZIK9Ce0yM&feature=player_embedded#at=184

I CAN'T

          really say anything about, or explain this interview clip. however, the title of this thread is taken from the subject content. what would the wiccans say?
Title: Re: RAEP IS GOOD MAJIK
Post by: Salty on April 19, 2011, 05:53:51 AM
Just think, there are Americans out there who don't understand patriotism the way those men do.
Title: Re: RAEP IS GOOD MAJIK
Post by: E.O.T. on April 19, 2011, 06:04:53 AM
Quote from: Alty on April 19, 2011, 05:53:51 AM
Just think, there are Americans out there who don't understand patriotism the way those men do.

HA!

          it's the magiks angle that i find amusing
Title: Re: RAEP IS GOOD MAJIK
Post by: Salty on April 19, 2011, 06:19:05 AM
I mean, people talk about patriotism as though it were a given, the same way they talk about god or the lasting strength of a 401(k) despite all external evidence to the fragility of these things, their inherent lack of essential reality. They rest on certainty:

-God will protect me.
-Everything happens for a reason.
-My prayers will be heard.
-Love will see this through.
-Raping in accordance with my magical potion will protect my country.

Remove and add conditions until you can't see straight and you'll see the same thing all the way down: people looking for certainty.

And that thing, country. We either want what we want so hard that we'll convince ourselves that RAPE is a viable way of obtaining it OR we want the rape and the COUNTRY is just an excuse.

That calm sonofabitch pissed me off. He didn't shy away once from the thought of his mother or sister getting raped as long as he knew it would benefit his country. Myself, I'm a rational person. I don't think child rapists should be killed immediately. But when I let myself think of someone doing that to my child all I can see is red haze. That fucker didn't mind one little bit. How the fuck does that happen?
Title: Re: RAEP IS GOOD MAJIK
Post by: Prince Glittersnatch III on April 19, 2011, 06:29:56 AM
Read the comments.
Title: Re: RAEP IS GOOD MAJIK
Post by: Subtract Eight! on April 19, 2011, 07:50:43 AM
........was just mind raped.. /slither
Title: Re: RAEP IS GOOD MAJIK
Post by: Mesozoic Mister Nigel on April 19, 2011, 08:33:21 AM
That's so sad and disturbing. And the thing is, for those men to think it's OK or right, they have to be pretty traumatized too.
Title: Re: RAEP IS GOOD MAJIK
Post by: Prince Glittersnatch III on April 19, 2011, 08:45:22 AM
Quote from: Nigel on April 19, 2011, 08:33:21 AM
That's so sad and disturbing. And the thing is, for those men to think it's OK or right, they have to be pretty traumatized too.

Most of those people have been in the military since they were 12 or so.
Title: Re: RAEP IS GOOD MAJIK
Post by: E.O.T. on April 19, 2011, 01:42:43 PM
Quote from: Lord Glittersnatch on April 19, 2011, 06:29:56 AM
Read the comments.

I DID NOT

          find the comments to be very enlightening. what's your point there?
Title: Re: RAEP IS GOOD MAJIK
Post by: Nephew Twiddleton on April 19, 2011, 01:45:09 PM
Quote from: E.O.T. on April 19, 2011, 01:42:43 PM
Quote from: Lord Glittersnatch on April 19, 2011, 06:29:56 AM
Read the comments.

I DID NOT

          find the comments to be very enlightening. what's your point there?

I think that he was trying to point out that the comments are also disturbing by turning into a race thing. Most of them seemed to be from Nazis.
Title: Re: RAEP IS GOOD MAJIK
Post by: E.O.T. on April 19, 2011, 01:54:06 PM

TO LG & NIGEL

         most people who've studied war/ battle and delved into the "collateral damage" pouring onto civilians - and i don't mean scholars but simply curious readers, know that horrible things like this, or their equivalent, do happen. maybe all the time. aside from the frankness of the soldiers delivery being rather mind numbing, the whole topic of rape as a magic potion, as an almost alchemical process makes me wonder what the history behind this is.
Title: Re: RAEP IS GOOD MAJIK
Post by: Nephew Twiddleton on April 19, 2011, 02:02:56 PM
Quote from: E.O.T. on April 19, 2011, 01:54:06 PM

TO LG & NIGEL

         most people who've studied war/ battle and delved into the "collateral damage" pouring onto civilians - and i don't mean scholars but simply curious readers, know that horrible things like this, or their equivalent, do happen. maybe all the time. aside from the frankness of the soldiers delivery being rather mind numbing, the whole topic of rape as a magic potion, as an almost alchemical process makes me wonder what the history behind this is.

I was wondering about the origin of this idea too. It seems... just really fucking bizarre of a concept, even in comparison to other folk beliefs and superstitions.
Title: Re: RAEP IS GOOD MAJIK
Post by: E.O.T. on April 19, 2011, 02:17:20 PM
Quote from: Doktor Blight on April 19, 2011, 01:45:09 PM
Quote from: E.O.T. on April 19, 2011, 01:42:43 PM
Quote from: Lord Glittersnatch on April 19, 2011, 06:29:56 AM
Read the comments.

I DID NOT

          find the comments to be very enlightening. what's your point there?

I think that he was trying to point out that the comments are also disturbing by turning into a race thing. Most of them seemed to be from Nazis.

THAT

         to me is hardly surprising, but i think nazi is a misleading term. i get what you're saying but still, reading the comments doesn't really shed any light on the documentary/ interview footage itself.

NOT

         being able to understand the original dialects personally, actually brought a sense of doubt to my mind as to the authenticity of the video, but watching further it seems legit. i posted the video clip pretty much immediately after watching it twice through. and then my mind collapsed from exhaustion and i crashed out. had some strange dreams.

LORD G

         is correct in pointing out that fighting and war in these regions creates a life spanning environment for the soldiers (and everyone else involved) so i'm curious as to what comparative versions of the practice exist and where/ when(?). and of course, what would the wiccans have to say about this?
Title: Re: RAEP IS GOOD MAJIK
Post by: LMNO on April 19, 2011, 02:28:30 PM
I haven't researched this, but I seem to recall the prevalence of superstitions at very high level of African governments and societies, even in the 20th and 21st centuries.  Usually based on sympathetic magic principles, this ranges from witch doctors attempting to influence the African Cup football matches to the belief that having sex with a virgin will cure AIDS, to Idi Amin (possibly) engaging in cannabalism.

I have no idea why Africa seem to be the focus of these stories, but I do know it's not unusual for societies to hold on to their superstitions well into the modern age, and so-called "Western" countries are not exempt.
Title: Re: RAEP IS GOOD MAJIK
Post by: Nephew Twiddleton on April 19, 2011, 02:41:34 PM
EOT-

I think that the Wiccan position would be fairly easy to determine, since they follow a harm none perspective. However, if I recall, Gardner's Book of Shadows commented on the efficacy of blood sacrifice while simultaneously asserting that it is abominable. Would Wiccans think that there is actually a magic potion that is rape activated? I don't know. Maybe they could see it working in the sense of both sex magic and blood sacrifice analogs. I'm also wondering if potion is a mistranslation of some sort. They don't really explain what the potion is or why it requires rape.
Title: Re: RAEP IS GOOD MAJIK
Post by: hooplala on April 19, 2011, 03:25:48 PM
Quote from: LMNO, PhD on April 19, 2011, 02:28:30 PM
I haven't researched this, but I seem to recall the prevalence of superstitions at very high level of African governments and societies, even in the 20th and 21st centuries.  Usually based on sympathetic magic principles, this ranges from witch doctors attempting to influence the African Cup football matches to the belief that having sex with a virgin will cure AIDS, to Idi Amin (possibly) engaging in cannabalism.

I have no idea why Africa seem to be the focus of these stories, but I do know it's not unusual for societies to hold on to their superstitions well into the modern age, and so-called "Western" countries are not exempt.

I know a disturbing amount of people who still firmly believe in jinxes.

Is raping for magic much different from killing people in an embassy because people in the embassy's country burned your chosen holy book?
Title: Re: RAEP IS GOOD MAJIK
Post by: Cinderflame KSC on April 19, 2011, 04:22:17 PM
Quote from: Doktor Blight on April 19, 2011, 02:41:34 PM
EOT-

I think that the Wiccan position would be fairly easy to determine, since they follow a harm none perspective. However, if I recall, Gardner's Book of Shadows commented on the efficacy of blood sacrifice while simultaneously asserting that it is abominable. Would Wiccans think that there is actually a magic potion that is rape activated? I don't know. Maybe they could see it working in the sense of both sex magic and blood sacrifice analogs. I'm also wondering if potion is a mistranslation of some sort. They don't really explain what the potion is or why it requires rape.
I don't know a single Wiccan that would condone rape as a magickal act. As far as blood sacrifice, most I know won't even swat a mosquito while in circle. That's not to say that what these soldiers are doing isn't magick; any magickal act can be taken with mal-intent, sex magick being no different.
Title: Re: RAEP IS GOOD MAJIK
Post by: hooplala on April 19, 2011, 04:33:22 PM
Quote from: Cinderflame KSC on April 19, 2011, 04:22:17 PM
Quote from: Doktor Blight on April 19, 2011, 02:41:34 PM
EOT-

I think that the Wiccan position would be fairly easy to determine, since they follow a harm none perspective. However, if I recall, Gardner's Book of Shadows commented on the efficacy of blood sacrifice while simultaneously asserting that it is abominable. Would Wiccans think that there is actually a magic potion that is rape activated? I don't know. Maybe they could see it working in the sense of both sex magic and blood sacrifice analogs. I'm also wondering if potion is a mistranslation of some sort. They don't really explain what the potion is or why it requires rape.
I don't know a single Wiccan that would condone rape as a magickal act. As far as blood sacrifice, most I know won't even swat a mosquito while in circle. That's not to say that what these soldiers are doing isn't magick; any magickal act can be taken with mal-intent, sex magick being no different.

Isn't that basically what Blight just said?
Title: Re: RAEP IS GOOD MAJIK
Post by: BabylonHoruv on April 19, 2011, 05:14:37 PM
Quote from: Cinderflame KSC on April 19, 2011, 04:22:17 PM
Quote from: Doktor Blight on April 19, 2011, 02:41:34 PM
EOT-

I think that the Wiccan position would be fairly easy to determine, since they follow a harm none perspective. However, if I recall, Gardner's Book of Shadows commented on the efficacy of blood sacrifice while simultaneously asserting that it is abominable. Would Wiccans think that there is actually a magic potion that is rape activated? I don't know. Maybe they could see it working in the sense of both sex magic and blood sacrifice analogs. I'm also wondering if potion is a mistranslation of some sort. They don't really explain what the potion is or why it requires rape.
I don't know a single Wiccan that would condone rape as a magickal act. As far as blood sacrifice, most I know won't even swat a mosquito while in circle. That's not to say that what these soldiers are doing isn't magick; any magickal act can be taken with mal-intent, sex magick being no different.

condone and believe it works are two very different things.
Title: Re: RAEP IS GOOD MAJIK
Post by: Prince Glittersnatch III on April 19, 2011, 06:10:22 PM
Quote from: Doktor Blight on April 19, 2011, 02:02:56 PM
Quote from: E.O.T. on April 19, 2011, 01:54:06 PM

TO LG & NIGEL

         most people who've studied war/ battle and delved into the "collateral damage" pouring onto civilians - and i don't mean scholars but simply curious readers, know that horrible things like this, or their equivalent, do happen. maybe all the time. aside from the frankness of the soldiers delivery being rather mind numbing, the whole topic of rape as a magic potion, as an almost alchemical process makes me wonder what the history behind this is.

I was wondering about the origin of this idea too. It seems... just really fucking bizarre of a concept, even in comparison to other folk beliefs and superstitions.

It isnt just traditional superstitions that are still around. Witch burnings, both by muslims and christians, are still very popular.
Title: Re: RAEP IS GOOD MAJIK
Post by: E.O.T. on April 19, 2011, 06:21:54 PM
Quote from: Doktor Blight on April 19, 2011, 02:41:34 PM
EOT-

I think that the Wiccan position would be fairly easy to determine, since they follow a harm none perspective. However, if I recall, Gardner's Book of Shadows commented on the efficacy of blood sacrifice while simultaneously asserting that it is abominable. Would Wiccans think that there is actually a magic potion that is rape activated? I don't know. Maybe they could see it working in the sense of both sex magic and blood sacrifice analogs. I'm also wondering if potion is a mistranslation of some sort. They don't really explain what the potion is or why it requires rape.

DOK B

          i'm actually not the least interested in the wiccs, i'm just riding out a stupid joke because of the majiks association. i think LMNO's point is a great insight, the magic rather precedes much action or intent culturally.
it's possible that if this video clip has more footage to it somewhere, that less vague elements are elaborated on. it would be interesting if this angle (for lack of a better word?) on rape in war/ battle was unique because of the influence from within the culture/ belief systems itself.
Title: Re: RAEP IS GOOD MAJIK
Post by: BabylonHoruv on April 19, 2011, 07:38:05 PM
The Serbians put a lot of stock in rape as well, they didn't call it magic specifically, but the ways they pursued it suggested there was an element of the same sort of school of thought. 
Title: Re: RAEP IS GOOD MAJIK
Post by: LMNO on April 19, 2011, 07:47:34 PM
Well, if we're going to go in that direction, rape as a war tactic has been around probably since we were barely more than apes.

The justifications are varied, but it's pretty much a universal tactic.
Title: Re: RAEP IS GOOD MAJIK
Post by: Mesozoic Mister Nigel on April 19, 2011, 07:54:10 PM
Yup; that much is well-documented.
Title: Re: RAEP IS GOOD MAJIK
Post by: Bebek Sincap Ratatosk on April 19, 2011, 09:14:40 PM
Quote from: LMNO, PhD on April 19, 2011, 07:47:34 PM
Well, if we're going to go in that direction, rape as a war tactic has been around probably since we were barely more than apes.

The justifications are varied, but it's pretty much a universal tactic.


We can document it in various primate groups today, so I'd say it was used since we were apes.
Title: Re: RAEP IS GOOD MAJIK
Post by: Nephew Twiddleton on April 19, 2011, 11:40:26 PM
Quote from: Hoopla on April 19, 2011, 04:33:22 PM
Quote from: Cinderflame KSC on April 19, 2011, 04:22:17 PM
Quote from: Doktor Blight on April 19, 2011, 02:41:34 PM
EOT-

I think that the Wiccan position would be fairly easy to determine, since they follow a harm none perspective. However, if I recall, Gardner's Book of Shadows commented on the efficacy of blood sacrifice while simultaneously asserting that it is abominable. Would Wiccans think that there is actually a magic potion that is rape activated? I don't know. Maybe they could see it working in the sense of both sex magic and blood sacrifice analogs. I'm also wondering if potion is a mistranslation of some sort. They don't really explain what the potion is or why it requires rape.
I don't know a single Wiccan that would condone rape as a magickal act. As far as blood sacrifice, most I know won't even swat a mosquito while in circle. That's not to say that what these soldiers are doing isn't magick; any magickal act can be taken with mal-intent, sex magick being no different.

Isn't that basically what Blight just said?

Yep. Bolding it in case he missed it the second read through. I thought it was a fairly straightforward post.
Title: Re: RAEP IS GOOD MAJIK
Post by: Cinderflame KSC on April 20, 2011, 01:50:12 AM
Quote from: Doktor Blight on April 19, 2011, 11:40:26 PM
Quote from: Hoopla on April 19, 2011, 04:33:22 PM
Quote from: Cinderflame KSC on April 19, 2011, 04:22:17 PM
Quote from: Doktor Blight on April 19, 2011, 02:41:34 PM
EOT-

I think that the Wiccan position would be fairly easy to determine, since they follow a harm none perspective. However, if I recall, Gardner's Book of Shadows commented on the efficacy of blood sacrifice while simultaneously asserting that it is abominable. Would Wiccans think that there is actually a magic potion that is rape activated? I don't know. Maybe they could see it working in the sense of both sex magic and blood sacrifice analogs. I'm also wondering if potion is a mistranslation of some sort. They don't really explain what the potion is or why it requires rape.
I don't know a single Wiccan that would condone rape as a magickal act. As far as blood sacrifice, most I know won't even swat a mosquito while in circle. That's not to say that what these soldiers are doing isn't magick; any magickal act can be taken with mal-intent, sex magick being no different.

Isn't that basically what Blight just said?

Yep. Bolding it in case he missed it the second read through. I thought it was a fairly straightforward post.

Fuck. This is what I get for posting right before I go to bed. My post seemed much more detailed and profound when it was still stuck in my head.
Title: Re: RAEP IS GOOD MAJIK
Post by: E.O.T. on April 20, 2011, 06:23:34 AM
Quote from: LMNO, PhD on April 19, 2011, 07:47:34 PM
Well, if we're going to go in that direction, rape as a war tactic has been around probably since we were barely more than apes.

The justifications are varied, but it's pretty much a universal tactic.

RIGHT

         and i was definitely drawing focus/ interested in feedback on the "magic potion" element. rape as a topic would i guess be a misinterpretation of the thread intent. just trying to be clear. i worked like 14 hrs today and haven't had a chance to look into the regional history/ expanse of the theory behind this. all of the other related material, which there is quite a LOT on the use of rape by congo armies/ fighters, does not seem to touch on this element. i'm also still not sure where this clip is taken from, there must be a larger documentary or interview which this is a segment of.

I DO

         realize that this is gruesome stuff, but it's the kind of wtf that makes me want to know more. i've always been interested in the comparative structures of belief systems and i'm just really curious if the focal point of the "rape magic" has any universality to it. yes, sex magic is an obvious connection for sure, this being a really extreme application - and the context of extended warfare as an environment makes me wonder if there is a history outside of the congo involving something similar.

MY IMMEDIATE

         thought was that it would be greatly possible that something correlative exists as far at least as the middle east if not possibly into asia and eastern europe. i am wondering if ancient western cultures held a similar belief/ practice. "righteousness" as a retaliation tactic is more the domain of man in service to a god/ goddess/ deity than perhaps how the understanding of magic and how it works for the african magic user. (?)
Title: Re: RAEP IS GOOD MAJIK
Post by: Telarus on April 20, 2011, 06:43:23 AM
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-891321698051955222#

Watch it now, Freeman's stuff (and everyone else's on Google Video) gets axed on May 15th.  :fnord:
Title: Re: RAEP IS GOOD MAJIK
Post by: E.O.T. on April 20, 2011, 06:56:56 AM
Quote from: Telarus on April 20, 2011, 06:43:23 AM
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-891321698051955222#

Watch it now, Freeman's stuff (and everyone else's on Google Video) gets axed on May 15th.  :fnord:

THIS APPEARS TO BE AWESOME

          i'll give it a go around
Title: Re: RAEP IS GOOD MAJIK
Post by: Prince Glittersnatch III on April 20, 2011, 07:00:41 AM
Quote from: Telarus on April 20, 2011, 06:43:23 AM
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-891321698051955222#

Watch it now, Freeman's stuff (and everyone else's on Google Video) gets axed on May 15th.  :fnord:

Gah fuck.

Brb downloading fucking everything.
Title: Re: RAEP IS GOOD MAJIK
Post by: BadBeast on April 20, 2011, 07:09:20 AM
Rape is extremely common in conquering Armies, not just in Africa, but Europe and America too. In the first Gulf War, there were many reports of American Soldiers raping women after the fall of Basra. In WWII, one of the reasons the Germans were so quick to surrender to British and American troops, was because they had spent the last year raping their way across Eastern Europe, and they knew they wouldn't get the chance to surrender to the Russians, who had driven them back towards Berlin, because of the atrocities committed.
But the thing is, those men who rape during wartime are not monsters, they're normal, family men who find themselves in the middle of a horrible war. Many of them have difficulty accepting what they've had done, after being demobbed, and while I'm not using this as any kind of justification, it does seem that victory in War, produces some kind of biological imperative in the male of the species, to maximise the spread of his seed. In purely evolutionary terms, these Wartime scenarios are an excellent opportunity for the spreading of the more robust, dominant, genetic strains, which biologically, is good for the species.   As for the "Magic potion" element, people will justify their actions with whatever paradigm is most expedient. In WWII, German Soldiers were led to believe the the Slavic races were "less than human" so it didn't matter. The Russian Army saw it  as one of the spoils of War, and a Soldiers right.  I know it sounds pretty lame, in the cold light of day, but we are talking about Wartime, which tends to throw the rulebook for conventional behavior right out the window.
Title: Re: RAEP IS GOOD MAJIK
Post by: E.O.T. on April 20, 2011, 07:25:14 AM
Quote from: BadBeast on April 20, 2011, 07:09:20 AM
Rape is extremely common in conquering Armies, not just in Africa, but Europe and America too. In the first Gulf War, there were many reports of American Soldiers raping women after the fall of Basra. In WWII, one of the reasons the Germans were so quick to surrender to British and American troops, was because they had spent the last year raping their way across Eastern Europe, and they knew they wouldn't get the chance to surrender to the Russians, who had driven them back towards Berlin, because of the atrocities committed.
But the thing is, those men who rape during wartime are not monsters, they're normal, family men who find themselves in the middle of a horrible war. Many of them have difficulty accepting what they've had done, after being demobbed, and while I'm not using this as any kind of justification, it does seem that victory in War, produces some kind of biological imperative in the male of the species, to maximise the spread of his seed. In purely evolutionary terms, these Wartime scenarios are an excellent opportunity for the spreading of the more robust, dominant, genetic strains, which biologically, is good for the species.   As for the "Magic potion" element, people will justify their actions with whatever paradigm is most expedient. In WWII, German Soldiers were led to believe the the Slavic races were "less than human" so it didn't matter. The Russian Army saw it  as one of the spoils of War, and a Soldiers right.  I know it sounds pretty lame, in the cold light of day, but we are talking about Wartime, which tends to throw the rulebook for conventional behavior right out the window.

NO, HONEY

          you need to read the op and responses. this is about magic potion rape, not monkey war.

Title: Re: RAEP IS GOOD MAJIK
Post by: BadBeast on April 20, 2011, 07:40:06 AM
Quote from: E.O.T. on April 20, 2011, 07:25:14 AM
Quote from: BadBeast on April 20, 2011, 07:09:20 AM
Rape is extremely common in conquering Armies, not just in Africa, but Europe and America too. In the first Gulf War, there were many reports of American Soldiers raping women after the fall of Basra. In WWII, one of the reasons the Germans were so quick to surrender to British and American troops, was because they had spent the last year raping their way across Eastern Europe, and they knew they wouldn't get the chance to surrender to the Russians, who had driven them back towards Berlin, because of the atrocities committed.
But the thing is, those men who rape during wartime are not monsters, they're normal, family men who find themselves in the middle of a horrible war. Many of them have difficulty accepting what they've had done, after being demobbed, and while I'm not using this as any kind of justification, it does seem that victory in War, produces some kind of biological imperative in the male of the species, to maximise the spread of his seed. In purely evolutionary terms, these Wartime scenarios are an excellent opportunity for the spreading of the more robust, dominant, genetic strains, which biologically, is good for the species.   As for the "Magic potion" element, people will justify their actions with whatever paradigm is most expedient. In WWII, German Soldiers were led to believe the the Slavic races were "less than human" so it didn't matter. The Russian Army saw it  as one of the spoils of War, and a Soldiers right.  I know it sounds pretty lame, in the cold light of day, but we are talking about Wartime, which tends to throw the rulebook for conventional behavior right out the window.

NO, HONEY

          you need to read the op and responses. this is about magic potion rape, not monkey war.


I read the OP, watched the video, and read the 'magic potion rape' thing as another of the justification mechanisms for the triggered 'rape' behavioral pattern exhibited in Armies.
On reflection, and after watching the freeman vid, I can see that the 'magic potion' rape scenario can also be applied in the Nazi Army's rapefest of eastern Europe, with Meth as the magic potion.
Even the Gulf War/Basra instances could be viewed like this if you take the Drugs given to US (esp) Troops that resulted in Gulf War Syndrome' as being the 'magic potion'.   
Title: Re: RAEP IS GOOD MAJIK
Post by: E.O.T. on April 20, 2011, 07:58:51 AM
Quote from: BadBeast on April 20, 2011, 07:40:06 AM
Quote from: E.O.T. on April 20, 2011, 07:25:14 AM
Quote from: BadBeast on April 20, 2011, 07:09:20 AM
Rape is extremely common in conquering Armies, not just in Africa, but Europe and America too. In the first Gulf War, there were many reports of American Soldiers raping women after the fall of Basra. In WWII, one of the reasons the Germans were so quick to surrender to British and American troops, was because they had spent the last year raping their way across Eastern Europe, and they knew they wouldn't get the chance to surrender to the Russians, who had driven them back towards Berlin, because of the atrocities committed.
But the thing is, those men who rape during wartime are not monsters, they're normal, family men who find themselves in the middle of a horrible war. Many of them have difficulty accepting what they've had done, after being demobbed, and while I'm not using this as any kind of justification, it does seem that victory in War, produces some kind of biological imperative in the male of the species, to maximise the spread of his seed. In purely evolutionary terms, these Wartime scenarios are an excellent opportunity for the spreading of the more robust, dominant, genetic strains, which biologically, is good for the species.   As for the "Magic potion" element, people will justify their actions with whatever paradigm is most expedient. In WWII, German Soldiers were led to believe the the Slavic races were "less than human" so it didn't matter. The Russian Army saw it  as one of the spoils of War, and a Soldiers right.  I know it sounds pretty lame, in the cold light of day, but we are talking about Wartime, which tends to throw the rulebook for conventional behavior right out the window.

NO, HONEY

          you need to read the op and responses. this is about magic potion rape, not monkey war.


I read the OP, watched the video, and read the 'magic potion rape' thing as another of the justification mechanisms for the triggered 'rape' behavioral pattern exhibited in Armies.
On reflection, and after watching the freeman vid, I can see that the 'magic potion' rape scenario can also be applied in the Nazi Army's rapefest of eastern Europe, with Meth as the magic potion.
Even the Gulf War/Basra instances could be viewed like this if you take the Drugs given to US (esp) Troops that resulted in Gulf War Syndrome' as being the 'magic potion'.   

IT'S

         the belief system not drug abuse i'm drawing focus to. there's no mention of drugs in the video.
Title: Re: RAEP IS GOOD MAJIK
Post by: BadBeast on April 20, 2011, 08:05:57 AM
It mentions that they were given a 'magic potion' that's effectiveness was accentuated by rape. The belief system, whether Congolese, Teutonic, or Ancient Roman, seems immaterial consideringthe end result of Armies raping the Women of the conquered. 
Title: Re: RAEP IS GOOD MAJIK
Post by: E.O.T. on April 20, 2011, 08:21:38 AM
Quote from: BadBeast on April 20, 2011, 08:05:57 AM
It mentions that they were given a 'magic potion' that's effectiveness was accentuated by rape. The belief system, whether Congolese, Teutonic, or Ancient Roman, seems immaterial consideringthe end result of Armies raping the Women of the conquered. 

I APPRECIATE

          your input, don't get me wrong. you're throwing in a lot of interesting information. if you pay closer attention to the minutes of 1:20-2:20, you'll see that the rape itself is the potion component, there's no other drug or input which results in the rape, the rape itself is the potion or potion component. the belief that the rape itself will bring results is what i'm addressing. not every person in the video makes a related comment.

Title: Re: RAEP IS GOOD MAJIK
Post by: BabylonHoruv on April 20, 2011, 08:34:23 AM
Quote from: Telarus on April 20, 2011, 06:43:23 AM
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-891321698051955222#

Watch it now, Freeman's stuff (and everyone else's on Google Video) gets axed on May 15th.  :fnord:

This video freaked me out.  I'm either having a giant Law of Fivegasm or I have some connection with the mother's of darkness.

Title: Re: RAEP IS GOOD MAJIK
Post by: BabylonHoruv on April 20, 2011, 08:36:25 AM
Quote from: E.O.T. on April 20, 2011, 08:21:38 AM
Quote from: BadBeast on April 20, 2011, 08:05:57 AM
It mentions that they were given a 'magic potion' that's effectiveness was accentuated by rape. The belief system, whether Congolese, Teutonic, or Ancient Roman, seems immaterial consideringthe end result of Armies raping the Women of the conquered. 

I APPRECIATE

          your input, don't get me wrong. you're throwing in a lot of interesting information. if you pay closer attention to the minutes of 1:20-2:20, you'll see that the rape itself is the potion component, there's no other drug or input which results in the rape, the rape itself is the potion or potion component. the belief that the rape itself will bring results is what i'm addressing. not every person in the video makes a related comment.



This does tie in with the Serbs then.  For them the rape of Bosnians was a symbolic act, not just psychological warfare but a ritual act.
Title: Re: RAEP IS GOOD MAJIK
Post by: E.O.T. on April 20, 2011, 08:40:26 AM

http://www.infosud.org/spip.php?article8526

         so, apparently in the congo, raping infants may guarantee wealth. i guess LMNO was on point when he directed the notion toward magic as an influence in general. from this i'd have to say the issue becomes that of knowing the congolese psychology. i'm not coming up with any cultural comparisons.

http://www.moxdiamond.com/Magic-The-Gathering/Deck/1919/total-white-black-rape.html

         i have no idea what is going on in this game, but several variations on rape come up.
Title: Re: RAEP IS GOOD MAJIK
Post by: E.O.T. on April 20, 2011, 08:41:29 AM
Quote from: BabylonHoruv on April 20, 2011, 08:36:25 AM
Quote from: E.O.T. on April 20, 2011, 08:21:38 AM
Quote from: BadBeast on April 20, 2011, 08:05:57 AM
It mentions that they were given a 'magic potion' that's effectiveness was accentuated by rape. The belief system, whether Congolese, Teutonic, or Ancient Roman, seems immaterial consideringthe end result of Armies raping the Women of the conquered. 

I APPRECIATE

          your input, don't get me wrong. you're throwing in a lot of interesting information. if you pay closer attention to the minutes of 1:20-2:20, you'll see that the rape itself is the potion component, there's no other drug or input which results in the rape, the rape itself is the potion or potion component. the belief that the rape itself will bring results is what i'm addressing. not every person in the video makes a related comment.



This does tie in with the Serbs then.  For them the rape of Bosnians was a symbolic act, not just psychological warfare but a ritual act.

TELL

          moar?
Title: Re: RAEP IS GOOD MAJIK
Post by: P3nT4gR4m on April 20, 2011, 08:50:38 AM
I agree with Badbeast, raping the vanquished is purely monkey behaviour. The leaders of any ill-disciplined conscript force know it's going to happen whether they want it to or not so they have two choices - court martial half their army or tart it up with some symbolic bullshit and condone it.
Title: Re: RAEP IS GOOD MAJIK
Post by: E.O.T. on April 20, 2011, 08:58:38 AM
Quote from: P3nT4gR4m on April 20, 2011, 08:50:38 AM
I agree with Badbeast, raping the vanquished is purely monkey behaviour. The leaders of any ill-disciplined conscript force know it's going to happen whether they want it to or not so they have two choices - court martial half their army or tart it up with some symbolic bullshit and condone it.

I THINK WE

         all agree with that point (?) - however, the focus i'm drawing attention to is that rape itself is a magical practice not a result of warfare.
Title: Re: RAEP IS GOOD MAJIK
Post by: BabylonHoruv on April 20, 2011, 09:11:27 AM
I'm trying to source this online and having no luck, most likely the good stuff is in Serbo-Croatian.  My source was a Bosnian refugee so the information he gave me was probably biased and possibly inaccurate but he said that the rape of women by invading Serbs was not just for sexual gratification or demoralization.  According to him when he talked to the women who had been raped they said the Serbs talked about planting the seed of great Serbia and that it was treated very much as a necessary act.  The levels of nested metaphor here (planting a seed, impregnating, spreading a country) look very much like the western magical tradition.
Title: Re: RAEP IS GOOD MAJIK
Post by: BadBeast on April 20, 2011, 09:13:18 AM
Quote from: E.O.T. on April 20, 2011, 08:58:38 AM
Quote from: P3nT4gR4m on April 20, 2011, 08:50:38 AM
I agree with Badbeast, raping the vanquished is purely monkey behaviour. The leaders of any ill-disciplined conscript force know it's going to happen whether they want it to or not so they have two choices - court martial half their army or tart it up with some symbolic bullshit and condone it.

I THINK WE

         all agree with that point (?) - however, the focus i'm drawing attention to is that rape itself is a magical practice not a result of warfare.
So what about singular, non warfare type rape? If the rape itself is a magical act, what is the (supposed) result of the magic?
Title: Re: RAEP IS GOOD MAJIK
Post by: BabylonHoruv on April 20, 2011, 09:32:19 AM
Quote from: BadBeast on April 20, 2011, 09:13:18 AM
Quote from: E.O.T. on April 20, 2011, 08:58:38 AM
Quote from: P3nT4gR4m on April 20, 2011, 08:50:38 AM
I agree with Badbeast, raping the vanquished is purely monkey behaviour. The leaders of any ill-disciplined conscript force know it's going to happen whether they want it to or not so they have two choices - court martial half their army or tart it up with some symbolic bullshit and condone it.

I THINK WE

         all agree with that point (?) - however, the focus i'm drawing attention to is that rape itself is a magical practice not a result of warfare.
So what about singular, non warfare type rape? If the rape itself is a magical act, what is the (supposed) result of the magic?

That's got to depend on the circumstances surrounding the rape.  Consensual sex is a common magical component as well, and while it has certain aspects associated with it (fertility, connection, etc) what the intended results of a specific act of magical sex are vary greatly.

In both the Serbian and African cases the rape seems to be tied to growing a nation and military victory and conquest.
Title: Re: RAEP IS GOOD MAJIK
Post by: BadBeast on April 20, 2011, 10:06:44 AM
Quote from: BabylonHoruv on April 20, 2011, 09:32:19 AM
Quote from: BadBeast on April 20, 2011, 09:13:18 AM
Quote from: E.O.T. on April 20, 2011, 08:58:38 AM
Quote from: P3nT4gR4m on April 20, 2011, 08:50:38 AM
I agree with Badbeast, raping the vanquished is purely monkey behaviour. The leaders of any ill-disciplined conscript force know it's going to happen whether they want it to or not so they have two choices - court martial half their army or tart it up with some symbolic bullshit and condone it.

I THINK WE

          all agree with that point (?) - however, the focus i'm drawing attention to is that rape itself is a magical practice not a result of warfare.
So what about singular, non warfare type rape? If the rape itself is a magical act, what is the (supposed) result of the magic?

That's got to depend on the circumstances surrounding the rape.  Consensual sex is a common magical component as well, and while it has certain aspects associated with it (fertility, connection, etc) what the intended results of a specific act of magical sex are vary greatly.

In both the Serbian and African cases the rape seems to be tied to growing a nation and military victory and conquest.
Which ties in with the biological imperative that seems to be triggered whenever an invading Army is concerned.
Title: Re: RAEP IS GOOD MAJIK
Post by: E.O.T. on April 20, 2011, 11:28:13 AM
Quote from: BabylonHoruv on April 20, 2011, 09:32:19 AM
Quote from: BadBeast on April 20, 2011, 09:13:18 AM
Quote from: E.O.T. on April 20, 2011, 08:58:38 AM
Quote from: P3nT4gR4m on April 20, 2011, 08:50:38 AM
I agree with Badbeast, raping the vanquished is purely monkey behaviour. The leaders of any ill-disciplined conscript force know it's going to happen whether they want it to or not so they have two choices - court martial half their army or tart it up with some symbolic bullshit and condone it.

I THINK WE

         all agree with that point (?) - however, the focus i'm drawing attention to is that rape itself is a magical practice not a result of warfare.
So what about singular, non warfare type rape? If the rape itself is a magical act, what is the (supposed) result of the magic?

That's got to depend on the circumstances surrounding the rape.  Consensual sex is a common magical component as well, and while it has certain aspects associated with it (fertility, connection, etc) what the intended results of a specific act of magical sex are vary greatly.

In both the Serbian and African cases the rape seems to be tied to growing a nation and military victory and conquest.

OK

         i'm interested, but please provide access to the serbian rape magic material you're talking about.
Title: Re: RAEP IS GOOD MAJIK
Post by: E.O.T. on April 20, 2011, 11:31:35 AM
Quote from: BadBeast on April 20, 2011, 10:06:44 AM
Quote from: BabylonHoruv on April 20, 2011, 09:32:19 AM
Quote from: BadBeast on April 20, 2011, 09:13:18 AM
Quote from: E.O.T. on April 20, 2011, 08:58:38 AM
Quote from: P3nT4gR4m on April 20, 2011, 08:50:38 AM
I agree with Badbeast, raping the vanquished is purely monkey behaviour. The leaders of any ill-disciplined conscript force know it's going to happen whether they want it to or not so they have two choices - court martial half their army or tart it up with some symbolic bullshit and condone it.

I THINK WE

          all agree with that point (?) - however, the focus i'm drawing attention to is that rape itself is a magical practice not a result of warfare.
So what about singular, non warfare type rape? If the rape itself is a magical act, what is the (supposed) result of the magic?

That's got to depend on the circumstances surrounding the rape.  Consensual sex is a common magical component as well, and while it has certain aspects associated with it (fertility, connection, etc) what the intended results of a specific act of magical sex are vary greatly.

In both the Serbian and African cases the rape seems to be tied to growing a nation and military victory and conquest.
Which ties in with the biological imperative that seems to be triggered whenever an invading Army is concerned.

WHICH

          is still differentiated by rape being a magical act. or at least a significant part of a magical process.
Title: Re: RAEP IS GOOD MAJIK
Post by: Luna on April 20, 2011, 11:50:44 AM
Quote from: E.O.T. on April 20, 2011, 08:58:38 AM
Quote from: P3nT4gR4m on April 20, 2011, 08:50:38 AM
I agree with Badbeast, raping the vanquished is purely monkey behaviour. The leaders of any ill-disciplined conscript force know it's going to happen whether they want it to or not so they have two choices - court martial half their army or tart it up with some symbolic bullshit and condone it.

I THINK WE

         all agree with that point (?) - however, the focus i'm drawing attention to is that rape itself is a magical practice not a result of warfare.

No, it's not.  It's a justification.  It's a way for those in charge to convince these men who have been in their control since they were kids to perform acts that they know aren't right.  (See the one who said that if he caught someone raping his sister, he wouldn't stand for it.)  "It's okay, it's magic" is pretty much the same as "it's okay to throw rocks at her, God says you should."
Title: Re: RAEP IS GOOD MAJIK
Post by: P3nT4gR4m on April 20, 2011, 12:01:47 PM
Quote from: Luna on April 20, 2011, 11:50:44 AM
No, it's not.  It's a justification.  It's a way for those in charge to convince these men who have been in their control since they were kids to perform acts that they know aren't right.  (See the one who said that if he caught someone raping his sister, he wouldn't stand for it.)  "It's okay, it's magic" is pretty much the same as "it's okay to throw rocks at her, God says you should."

Nail on head! It's not real magic (are we actually having this conversation, ffs?) It's filling stoopid heads full of stoopid bullshit so they'll kill people for you. The magic component doesn't have any effect whatsoever. It's just like non rape-based magic in that respect.
Title: Re: RAEP IS GOOD MAJIK
Post by: Faust on April 20, 2011, 12:11:48 PM
We are in full danger of starting off the magic thread cycle. From this point on everyone please wear a hard hat and avoid cycling into that monster of a thread.
Title: Re: RAEP IS GOOD MAJIK
Post by: LMNO on April 20, 2011, 01:04:27 PM
(using EOT speak)



OKAY

          We understand that magic is bullshit

AND

          That rape is a monkey-war-power act of violence

PLUS

          The objective ovservance of using Magic as an excuse for Rape is justification (and bullshit)

BUT

          The point here (I think) is to look deeper into the psychological constructs that make such (to us) obvious irrational explanations regarding rape and magic apparently culturally accepted by a large amount of Congolese.  Saying, "its a tactic to get them to do bad things" is true, but it doesn't speak to the main question regarding the culture, mindset and history taking place here.
Title: Re: RAEP IS GOOD MAJIK
Post by: P3nT4gR4m on April 20, 2011, 01:13:08 PM
The culture and mindset we're dealing with is based around taking 11-12 year old kids, sticking a gun in their hands and teaching them how to make people dead with it. It's not all innocent shooting, tho, maiming and torture (including the raeping) is all part of their playtime. This "culture" as you call it is seven shades of fucked (even by western standards) So when a fifteen year old kid who's been sending bullets toward his classmates for a few years and hacking off limbs with machetes, turns around and tells me that sticking his dick in some half dead chick he finds lying on the battlefield is powerful voodoo, forgive me for not appearing the least bit shocked or surprised.
Title: Re: RAEP IS GOOD MAJIK
Post by: Luna on April 20, 2011, 01:22:26 PM
Most cultures have some acceptance of "magical thinking."  I can't even tell you how often my grandmother told me that if I pray hard enough for something, God will answer.  I'd be hard pressed to find a culture that did NOT have a degree of this kind of thing.  This is an extreme.
Title: Re: RAEP IS GOOD MAJIK
Post by: hooplala on April 20, 2011, 02:26:01 PM
Personally, I want to know a WHOLE lot more about this "potion" they kept referring to.

Who made it?  What did they claim it would do exactly?
Title: Re: RAEP IS GOOD MAJIK
Post by: BadBeast on April 20, 2011, 02:43:44 PM
Quote from: Hoopla on April 20, 2011, 02:26:01 PM
Personally, I want to know a WHOLE lot more about this "potion" they kept referring to.

Who made it?  What did they claim it would do exactly?
I know that a lot of African Armys (and western ones too) use amphetamines, (usually Meth as it's easiest to make)  quat, alcohol and cannabis, and to a superstitious people with little education, and even less knowledge of pharmacology, under a manipulative Warlord, Meth would seem like Superman juice. Added to some ritualistic pre-battle communal 'taking of the sacrament', and a good old sing-song, they must be worse than tooled up Millwall fans, before an away match at Cardiff. Add AK47s, and the promise of a chance to dip their wicks if they win the day, and it's just asking for trouble. Especially if the Spirits are on their side. (Which they invariably are) These people will go into War with a "magic" Nike shirt on that makes them bulletproof, bombproof and invisible. I could make up a potion like that in the next couple of hours (If I went "shopping") in my kitchen if I had a mind to.
Title: Re: RAEP IS GOOD MAJIK
Post by: Mesozoic Mister Nigel on April 20, 2011, 02:51:29 PM
This thread makes me wish SMF had an "ignore thread" feature.
Title: Re: RAEP IS GOOD MAJIK
Post by: Triple Zero on April 20, 2011, 03:35:39 PM
Quote from: E.O.T. on April 20, 2011, 07:58:51 AM
Quote from: BadBeast on April 20, 2011, 07:40:06 AM
Quote from: E.O.T. on April 20, 2011, 07:25:14 AM
Quote from: BadBeast on April 20, 2011, 07:09:20 AM
Rape is extremely common in conquering Armies, not just in Africa, but Europe and America too. In the first Gulf War, there were many reports of American Soldiers raping women after the fall of Basra. In WWII, one of the reasons the Germans were so quick to surrender to British and American troops, was because they had spent the last year raping their way across Eastern Europe, and they knew they wouldn't get the chance to surrender to the Russians, who had driven them back towards Berlin, because of the atrocities committed.
But the thing is, those men who rape during wartime are not monsters, they're normal, family men who find themselves in the middle of a horrible war. Many of them have difficulty accepting what they've had done, after being demobbed, and while I'm not using this as any kind of justification, it does seem that victory in War, produces some kind of biological imperative in the male of the species, to maximise the spread of his seed. In purely evolutionary terms, these Wartime scenarios are an excellent opportunity for the spreading of the more robust, dominant, genetic strains, which biologically, is good for the species.   As for the "Magic potion" element, people will justify their actions with whatever paradigm is most expedient. In WWII, German Soldiers were led to believe the the Slavic races were "less than human" so it didn't matter. The Russian Army saw it  as one of the spoils of War, and a Soldiers right.  I know it sounds pretty lame, in the cold light of day, but we are talking about Wartime, which tends to throw the rulebook for conventional behavior right out the window.

NO, HONEY

          you need to read the op and responses. this is about magic potion rape, not monkey war.


I read the OP, watched the video, and read the 'magic potion rape' thing as another of the justification mechanisms for the triggered 'rape' behavioral pattern exhibited in Armies.
On reflection, and after watching the freeman vid, I can see that the 'magic potion' rape scenario can also be applied in the Nazi Army's rapefest of eastern Europe, with Meth as the magic potion.
Even the Gulf War/Basra instances could be viewed like this if you take the Drugs given to US (esp) Troops that resulted in Gulf War Syndrome' as being the 'magic potion'.   

IT'S

         the belief system not drug abuse i'm drawing focus to. there's no mention of drugs in the video.

this is kind of contradictory... I'm not following what you're trying to get at, here.

first Badbeast explains himself in terms of belief systems and paradigms, but then you say you don't want to talk about "monkey war" but "magic potion rape".

then Badbeast explains the same thing in terms of magic potions, and suddenly you do a 180 and tell him you want to focus on belief systems, not the drugs.

seems to me like you don't really mind what perspective is taken, as long as it contrasts what happens/happened in the Congo with wars in the rest of the world and human history?
Title: Re: RAEP IS GOOD MAJIK
Post by: LMNO on April 20, 2011, 03:41:04 PM
I think he's trying to talk about the artificial map in their heads, not the actual territory.

That is, the physical act of rape and the physical use of drugs is what is actually happening in the real world.

But in their heads, there's some sort of bizarre (to us) world of magic potions and spell casting.  And that's what he wants to find out about.

I think.


EOT, let me know if I'm off base.
Title: Re: RAEP IS GOOD MAJIK
Post by: Triple Zero on April 20, 2011, 04:01:07 PM
Quote from: E.O.T. on April 20, 2011, 08:40:26 AM
http://www.moxdiamond.com/Magic-The-Gathering/Deck/1919/total-white-black-rape.html

         i have no idea what is going on in this game, but several variations on rape come up.

It's a collectible card game called "Magic". "White" and "Black" are two of the five colours or suits used in the game. It has nothing to do with actual rape.

It does, however, also indicate you were googling for terms like white+black+rape+magic ...

Does skin colour factor in it for you as well?

Title: Re: RAEP IS GOOD MAJIK
Post by: East Coast Hustle on April 20, 2011, 04:06:36 PM
actually, that's the 2nd link on the page if you just google "rape magic". I think I see where you think you're going with this; I can assure you that EOT is the furthest thing from a rape-racist.
Title: Re: RAEP IS GOOD MAJIK
Post by: Mesozoic Mister Nigel on April 20, 2011, 08:49:57 PM
Quote from: Rip City Hustle on April 20, 2011, 04:06:36 PM
actually, that's the 2nd link on the page if you just google "rape magic". I think I see where you think you're going with this; I can assure you that EOT is the furthest thing from a rape-racist.

This.
Title: Re: RAEP IS GOOD MAJIK
Post by: Mesozoic Mister Nigel on April 20, 2011, 08:53:41 PM
"Potion", btw, may be a  mistranslation of "ritual".
Title: Re: RAEP IS GOOD MAJIK
Post by: Triple Zero on April 20, 2011, 11:06:15 PM
Quote from: Rip City Hustle on April 20, 2011, 04:06:36 PM
actually, that's the 2nd link on the page if you just google "rape magic". I think I see where you think you're going with this; I can assure you that EOT is the furthest thing from a rape-racist.

I know that. I didn't really want to go there really, it's just the "white/black" in the title and Congo made me wonder, even though I knew better.

Sorry about the possible implication, EOT.
Title: Re: RAEP IS GOOD MAJIK
Post by: BabylonHoruv on April 20, 2011, 11:12:21 PM
Quote from: Nigel on April 20, 2011, 08:53:41 PM
"Potion", btw, may be a  mistranslation of "ritual".

I'm pretty sure that is one of the basic miscommunications that is going on in this thread. (and where the stuff about drugs is coming from)
Title: Re: RAEP IS GOOD MAJIK
Post by: BadBeast on April 20, 2011, 11:54:19 PM
I've been thinking about this today, while I was fishing. Especially the second video. And how Armies are made. Here, (& in Western Aries generally) we take the recruits, and with an almost formulaic combination of intimidation, grueling physical hardship, and obsessive pointless repetition of Drill, we psychologically break down the recruit, until he is utterly without any value system but the Army's. Then build them up, through training, and attention to detail into tightly knit Units of fighting men, superbly trained, armed, and disciplined. An Warrior Elite system, that rewards competence with Rank and Command. Every part steps in time with every other, and the chain of command keeps everything working in synchronized efficiency. Or that's the idea anyway.

Compare that with the way the Congolese Army is built. Traumatized War Orphans, of perhaps 6 7 years old, are taken in, looked after, fed, and basically brought up by their 'new family', the Army. These kids don't need to be broken down, they are already broken. The Army is everything to them. They learn to use weapons. They get to kill people, to have the power of life and death over just about anybody that isn't their own Army/Tribe. They kill without compunction, or remorse, because it's all that they have ever known. They are accountable to no-one, except to their Brothers in the Army. They have no fear, because they're de-sensitized, having been exposed to horrific levels of violence, right from their earliest memories. They have no knowledge of Women, save for a hazy sense of their dead Mothers, and the stories of the older boys who have been in combat, and know what it is to rape, and kill, and to slay your enemies. Not just with bullets, but by torturing and raping the survivors, they are brutalizing and scarring their enemies head-space, in an act that by it's sheer desecration of everything their enemy is, psychologically damages them.

The  The Mothers they cannot recall, who abandoned them by dying, but whose tits they suckled for their first years, are sublimated as  the Dark Mother, mentioned in the Freeman vid.  They are serving Kali Drga, like the Thuggee Cultists in India,   

"My Enemy's  Blood, for my Dark destroying Mother of ruination! Blood for Kali, Blood of the English"
And the chanting calls of
"Thuggee, thuggee, thugee, (Oi, oi, oi,)"  in the dark Jungles at night, would turn the blood of the Englishman, safe inside his Fortified Palace, to ice in his veins. The Empire, the Army, the Queen, meant fuck all when the strangling Thuggees were hunting for their horrible Skull bedecked, Demon Goddess.   


To all intents and purposes, the raping of the Enemy's women, empowers the victors, and devastates the losers. Which is, I suppose, from one viewpoint, is pretty powerful magics. Especially when their Generals have access to the same kind of Drugs the Nazis used to forge their Super loyal Berserkers, and their SS Werewolf Elite forces. Only stronger.
And an Army that were more polarized than the Nazis. Recruited and trained just like the Hitler Youth. Only far more brutal. More hardened to committing atrocious acts of violence, from an earlier age than the Nazis. But less disciplined, less effective against a modern Army. But they don't have to fight our Armies. As long as they keep it to Africa, they have pretty much whatever they can take.
Look at the Tutsi / Hutu thing in Rwanda. No-one intervened. Or Idi Amin's insane brutalization of post colonial Uganda. Or  Mugabe today. Holding on to power by terrorizing the populace with his Army.

And in Africa, even the climate is enlisted to brutalize the people. The famines, enabled by western aid, ensure a desperately hungry refugee population, who are broken and brutalized, sacrificed to this dark Corn Mother, who withholds her bounty, and watches as people feed her dusty deserts with the blood of their children. Aids, rages across the continent, infecting more readily than anywhere else, a population with no spiritual immune system, no anti Aids drugs, no clean fucking water even! This is where that damage takes them.
Like an abused child, who unknowingly carries the resonance of his abuse ready to visit upon the next generation, ticking like a time bomb in his psyche, Africa sits there. it's size so intimidatingly huge that we scale it down in all our Maps. The Dark Continent. Devils, and superstition ruling people.
We shiver still, not just in fear, but with shame, for our exploitation of her resources. Fearing some new Mau-Mau type rising of all Africa, we keep her suppressed by our Economic Policies. We keep her woefully behind us in all technologies. Her guns are our cast offs. Her diseases and plagues, we withhold the cures from them, while generation after generation die, in Plagues, Famines, and Wars, all instigated and funded by our combined foreign policies. To them, this is magic. . . . . . We are raping them, with Multinationals, Aid Programs, and crippling, never ending debt.   
Title: Re: RAEP IS GOOD MAJIK
Post by: Nephew Twiddleton on April 21, 2011, 12:30:35 AM
Quote from: Nigel on April 20, 2011, 08:53:41 PM
"Potion", btw, may be a  mistranslation of "ritual".

Ritual makes more sense, at least in the context that the clip puts it. You get it in other languages too. Irish has a word that can translate as curse, superstition, or some sort of amulet. It could be that rituals there (in Congo) usually use some sort of potion involved, so the word for one can also mean the other.
Title: Re: RAEP IS GOOD MAJIK
Post by: Kurt Christ on April 21, 2011, 12:36:37 AM
Quote from: Doktor Blight on April 21, 2011, 12:30:35 AM
Quote from: Nigel on April 20, 2011, 08:53:41 PM
"Potion", btw, may be a  mistranslation of "ritual".

Ritual makes more sense, at least in the context that the clip puts it. You get it in other languages too. Irish has a word that can translate as curse, superstition, or some sort of amulet. It could be that rituals there (in Congo) usually use some sort of potion involved, so the word for one can also mean the other.
I had a Kenyan biology teacher in high school, and the topic of African beliefs about magic came up (I do not at all recall how this came up in bio), and in conversations he used the word "witchcraft" for basically all variations of stuff you do with magic (I specifically remember him saying to cast a witchcraft on something rather than a spell or ritual or whatever), which I think was due to the same sort of translation issue with a word that is more broad in meaning than its closest English equivalent.
Title: Re: RAEP IS GOOD MAJIK
Post by: Nephew Twiddleton on April 21, 2011, 12:48:44 AM
Quote from: Vartox on April 21, 2011, 12:36:37 AM
Quote from: Doktor Blight on April 21, 2011, 12:30:35 AM
Quote from: Nigel on April 20, 2011, 08:53:41 PM
"Potion", btw, may be a  mistranslation of "ritual".

Ritual makes more sense, at least in the context that the clip puts it. You get it in other languages too. Irish has a word that can translate as curse, superstition, or some sort of amulet. It could be that rituals there (in Congo) usually use some sort of potion involved, so the word for one can also mean the other.
I had a Kenyan biology teacher in high school, and the topic of African beliefs about magic came up (I do not at all recall how this came up in bio), and in conversations he used the word "witchcraft" for basically all variations of stuff you do with magic (I specifically remember him saying to cast a witchcraft on something rather than a spell or ritual or whatever), which I think was due to the same sort of translation issue with a word that is more broad in meaning than its closest English equivalent.

Even the English word witchcraft is kinda vague these days. Is it interchangeable with the word for magic? Is it a specific method of magic? Are there supposed to be any religious overtones to it? Or is it just some spooky relic from Europe's past?

ETA: of thread is drifting, willing to stop with this statement.
Title: Re: RAEP IS GOOD MAJIK
Post by: BadBeast on April 21, 2011, 03:33:10 AM
Quote from: Doktor Blight on April 21, 2011, 12:30:35 AM
Quote from: Nigel on April 20, 2011, 08:53:41 PM
"Potion", btw, may be a  mistranslation of "ritual".

Ritual makes more sense, at least in the context that the clip puts it. You get it in other languages too. Irish has a word that can translate as curse, superstition, or some sort of amulet. It could be that rituals there (in Congo) usually use some sort of potion involved, so the word for one can also mean the other.
Maybe the Congolese definition for "Rape" has been similarly misinterpreted, and simply means any kind of fornication.
Title: Re: RAEP IS GOOD MAJIK
Post by: Nephew Twiddleton on April 21, 2011, 04:30:03 AM
Quote from: BadBeast on April 21, 2011, 03:33:10 AM
Quote from: Doktor Blight on April 21, 2011, 12:30:35 AM
Quote from: Nigel on April 20, 2011, 08:53:41 PM
"Potion", btw, may be a  mistranslation of "ritual".

Ritual makes more sense, at least in the context that the clip puts it. You get it in other languages too. Irish has a word that can translate as curse, superstition, or some sort of amulet. It could be that rituals there (in Congo) usually use some sort of potion involved, so the word for one can also mean the other.
Maybe the Congolese definition for "Rape" has been similarly misinterpreted, and simply means any kind of fornication.

cringe....
Title: Re: RAEP IS GOOD MAJIK
Post by: E.O.T. on April 21, 2011, 04:57:30 AM
Quote from: Triple Zero on April 20, 2011, 04:01:07 PM
Quote from: E.O.T. on April 20, 2011, 08:40:26 AM
http://www.moxdiamond.com/Magic-The-Gathering/Deck/1919/total-white-black-rape.html

         i have no idea what is going on in this game, but several variations on rape come up.

It's a collectible card game called "Magic". "White" and "Black" are two of the five colours or suits used in the game. It has nothing to do with actual rape.

It does, however, also indicate you were googling for terms like white+black+rape+magic ...

Does skin colour factor in it for you as well?



I GOOGLED

          rape magic
Title: Re: RAEP IS GOOD MAJIK
Post by: E.O.T. on April 21, 2011, 05:01:19 AM
Quote from: BabylonHoruv on April 20, 2011, 09:11:27 AM
I'm trying to source this online and having no luck, most likely the good stuff is in Serbo-Croatian.  My source was a Bosnian refugee so the information he gave me was probably biased and possibly inaccurate but he said that the rape of women by invading Serbs was not just for sexual gratification or demoralization.  According to him when he talked to the women who had been raped they said the Serbs talked about planting the seed of great Serbia and that it was treated very much as a necessary act.  The levels of nested metaphor here (planting a seed, impregnating, spreading a country) look very much like the western magical tradition.

I AM MORE

          inclined to think that falls under conquest rather than magic
Title: Re: RAEP IS GOOD MAJIK
Post by: E.O.T. on April 21, 2011, 05:10:37 AM
Quote from: BadBeast on April 20, 2011, 09:13:18 AM
Quote from: E.O.T. on April 20, 2011, 08:58:38 AM
Quote from: P3nT4gR4m on April 20, 2011, 08:50:38 AM
I agree with Badbeast, raping the vanquished is purely monkey behaviour. The leaders of any ill-disciplined conscript force know it's going to happen whether they want it to or not so they have two choices - court martial half their army or tart it up with some symbolic bullshit and condone it.

I THINK WE

         all agree with that point (?) - however, the focus i'm drawing attention to is that rape itself is a magical practice not a result of warfare.
So what about singular, non warfare type rape? If the rape itself is a magical act, what is the (supposed) result of the magic?

I'M NOT CERTAIN

          why you'd direct that question to me (?) - i'm not here promoting rape magic, on the contrary i (more or less) started this thread with the question - what the hell is rape magic?

HOWEVER

          an individual may be one thing, like say (generically) some metal head "satanist" committing such an act. what intrigued me about the interview statements is the appearance of a belief system of rape magic, held by a group of individuals, or a collective thought.
Title: Re: RAEP IS GOOD MAJIK
Post by: E.O.T. on April 21, 2011, 05:14:04 AM
Quote from: BadBeast on April 20, 2011, 10:06:44 AM
Quote from: BabylonHoruv on April 20, 2011, 09:32:19 AM
Quote from: BadBeast on April 20, 2011, 09:13:18 AM
Quote from: E.O.T. on April 20, 2011, 08:58:38 AM
Quote from: P3nT4gR4m on April 20, 2011, 08:50:38 AM
I agree with Badbeast, raping the vanquished is purely monkey behaviour. The leaders of any ill-disciplined conscript force know it's going to happen whether they want it to or not so they have two choices - court martial half their army or tart it up with some symbolic bullshit and condone it.

I THINK WE

          all agree with that point (?) - however, the focus i'm drawing attention to is that rape itself is a magical practice not a result of warfare.
So what about singular, non warfare type rape? If the rape itself is a magical act, what is the (supposed) result of the magic?

That's got to depend on the circumstances surrounding the rape.  Consensual sex is a common magical component as well, and while it has certain aspects associated with it (fertility, connection, etc) what the intended results of a specific act of magical sex are vary greatly.

In both the Serbian and African cases the rape seems to be tied to growing a nation and military victory and conquest.
Which ties in with the biological imperative that seems to be triggered whenever an invading Army is concerned.

MY IMPRESSION

          is more that the act is more like a sacrifice to the magic source, i guess, rather than as i said, conquest. like in wickerman or something.
Title: Re: RAEP IS GOOD MAJIK
Post by: BabylonHoruv on April 21, 2011, 05:14:51 AM
I hope they lose a bunch of fights right after a batch of rape and that causes them to decide the rape thing isn't such efective magic after all.
Title: Re: RAEP IS GOOD MAJIK
Post by: E.O.T. on April 21, 2011, 05:15:53 AM
Quote from: Luna on April 20, 2011, 11:50:44 AM
Quote from: E.O.T. on April 20, 2011, 08:58:38 AM
Quote from: P3nT4gR4m on April 20, 2011, 08:50:38 AM
I agree with Badbeast, raping the vanquished is purely monkey behaviour. The leaders of any ill-disciplined conscript force know it's going to happen whether they want it to or not so they have two choices - court martial half their army or tart it up with some symbolic bullshit and condone it.

I THINK WE

         all agree with that point (?) - however, the focus i'm drawing attention to is that rape itself is a magical practice not a result of warfare.

No, it's not.  It's a justification.  It's a way for those in charge to convince these men who have been in their control since they were kids to perform acts that they know aren't right.  (See the one who said that if he caught someone raping his sister, he wouldn't stand for it.)  "It's okay, it's magic" is pretty much the same as "it's okay to throw rocks at her, God says you should."

THAT'S

          a fair enough point, but that's inferred by you.
Title: Re: RAEP IS GOOD MAJIK
Post by: Prince Glittersnatch III on April 21, 2011, 05:16:24 AM
Quote from: BabylonHoruv on April 21, 2011, 05:14:51 AM
I hope they lose a bunch of fights right after a batch of rape and that causes them to decide the rape thing isn't such efective magic after all.

Dont you know? Confirmation bias is the foundation of all good magikal practice.... and QUANTUMZ.
Title: Re: RAEP IS GOOD MAJIK
Post by: E.O.T. on April 21, 2011, 05:17:04 AM
Quote from: LMNO, PhD on April 20, 2011, 01:04:27 PM
(using EOT speak)



OKAY

          We understand that magic is bullshit

AND

          That rape is a monkey-war-power act of violence

PLUS

          The objective ovservance of using Magic as an excuse for Rape is justification (and bullshit)

BUT

          The point here (I think) is to look deeper into the psychological constructs that make such (to us) obvious irrational explanations regarding rape and magic apparently culturally accepted by a large amount of Congolese.  Saying, "its a tactic to get them to do bad things" is true, but it doesn't speak to the main question regarding the culture, mindset and history taking place here.

THIS
Title: Re: RAEP IS GOOD MAJIK
Post by: E.O.T. on April 21, 2011, 05:19:52 AM
Quote from: Triple Zero on April 20, 2011, 03:35:39 PM
Quote from: E.O.T. on April 20, 2011, 07:58:51 AM
Quote from: BadBeast on April 20, 2011, 07:40:06 AM
Quote from: E.O.T. on April 20, 2011, 07:25:14 AM
Quote from: BadBeast on April 20, 2011, 07:09:20 AM
Rape is extremely common in conquering Armies, not just in Africa, but Europe and America too. In the first Gulf War, there were many reports of American Soldiers raping women after the fall of Basra. In WWII, one of the reasons the Germans were so quick to surrender to British and American troops, was because they had spent the last year raping their way across Eastern Europe, and they knew they wouldn't get the chance to surrender to the Russians, who had driven them back towards Berlin, because of the atrocities committed.
But the thing is, those men who rape during wartime are not monsters, they're normal, family men who find themselves in the middle of a horrible war. Many of them have difficulty accepting what they've had done, after being demobbed, and while I'm not using this as any kind of justification, it does seem that victory in War, produces some kind of biological imperative in the male of the species, to maximise the spread of his seed. In purely evolutionary terms, these Wartime scenarios are an excellent opportunity for the spreading of the more robust, dominant, genetic strains, which biologically, is good for the species.   As for the "Magic potion" element, people will justify their actions with whatever paradigm is most expedient. In WWII, German Soldiers were led to believe the the Slavic races were "less than human" so it didn't matter. The Russian Army saw it  as one of the spoils of War, and a Soldiers right.  I know it sounds pretty lame, in the cold light of day, but we are talking about Wartime, which tends to throw the rulebook for conventional behavior right out the window.

NO, HONEY

          you need to read the op and responses. this is about magic potion rape, not monkey war.


I read the OP, watched the video, and read the 'magic potion rape' thing as another of the justification mechanisms for the triggered 'rape' behavioral pattern exhibited in Armies.
On reflection, and after watching the freeman vid, I can see that the 'magic potion' rape scenario can also be applied in the Nazi Army's rapefest of eastern Europe, with Meth as the magic potion.
Even the Gulf War/Basra instances could be viewed like this if you take the Drugs given to US (esp) Troops that resulted in Gulf War Syndrome' as being the 'magic potion'.   

IT'S

         the belief system not drug abuse i'm drawing focus to. there's no mention of drugs in the video.

this is kind of contradictory... I'm not following what you're trying to get at, here.

first Badbeast explains himself in terms of belief systems and paradigms, but then you say you don't want to talk about "monkey war" but "magic potion rape".

then Badbeast explains the same thing in terms of magic potions, and suddenly you do a 180 and tell him you want to focus on belief systems, not the drugs.

seems to me like you don't really mind what perspective is taken, as long as it contrasts what happens/happened in the Congo with wars in the rest of the world and human history?

000

          you're taking an agenda perspective. i'm asking really specifically, and i did not 180, for examples of this elsewhere - not that i want that to exist, but does it?
Title: Re: RAEP IS GOOD MAJIK
Post by: E.O.T. on April 21, 2011, 05:21:46 AM
Quote from: LMNO, PhD on April 20, 2011, 03:41:04 PM
I think he's trying to talk about the artificial map in their heads, not the actual territory.

That is, the physical act of rape and the physical use of drugs is what is actually happening in the real world.

But in their heads, there's some sort of bizarre (to us) world of magic potions and spell casting.  And that's what he wants to find out about.

I think.


EOT, let me know if I'm off base.

EXACTLY

          and, if throughout human history, this specific perspective has been shared.
Title: Re: RAEP IS GOOD MAJIK
Post by: E.O.T. on April 21, 2011, 05:23:23 AM
Quote from: Rip City Hustle on April 20, 2011, 04:06:36 PM
actually, that's the 2nd link on the page if you just google "rape magic". I think I see where you think you're going with this; I can assure you that EOT is the furthest thing from a rape-racist.

THANK YOU

         
Title: Re: RAEP IS GOOD MAJIK
Post by: BadBeast on April 21, 2011, 05:23:47 AM
Quote from: E.O.T. on April 21, 2011, 05:10:37 AM
Quote from: BadBeast on April 20, 2011, 09:13:18 AM
Quote from: E.O.T. on April 20, 2011, 08:58:38 AM
Quote from: P3nT4gR4m on April 20, 2011, 08:50:38 AM
I agree with Badbeast, raping the vanquished is purely monkey behaviour. The leaders of any ill-disciplined conscript force know it's going to happen whether they want it to or not so they have two choices - court martial half their army or tart it up with some symbolic bullshit and condone it.

I THINK WE

         all agree with that point (?) - however, the focus i'm drawing attention to is that rape itself is a magical practice not a result of warfare.
So what about singular, non warfare type rape? If the rape itself is a magical act, what is the (supposed) result of the magic?

I'M NOT CERTAIN

         why you'd direct that question to me (?) - i'm not here promoting rape magic, on the contrary i (more or less) started this thread with the question - what the hell is rape magic?

HOWEVER

         an individual may be one thing, like say (generically) some metal head "satanist" committing such an act. what intrigued me about the interview statements is the appearance of a belief system of rape magic, held by a group of individuals, or a collective thought.
This is just a localized Military belief system, one that happens to hold rape as a magical act, in order to . . .well, to rape. There are plenty of other Armys where rape is common, and there is no such belief. So it seems to suggest the common thread is the act itself. The justification just builds itself around local frames of reference. In this case, superstition, reinforced by some potion or ritual. (Doesn't really matter what the word means in this instance)  
Title: Re: RAEP IS GOOD MAJIK
Post by: E.O.T. on April 21, 2011, 05:24:16 AM
Quote from: Doktor Blight on April 21, 2011, 12:30:35 AM
Quote from: Nigel on April 20, 2011, 08:53:41 PM
"Potion", btw, may be a  mistranslation of "ritual".

Ritual makes more sense, at least in the context that the clip puts it. You get it in other languages too. Irish has a word that can translate as curse, superstition, or some sort of amulet. It could be that rituals there (in Congo) usually use some sort of potion involved, so the word for one can also mean the other.

I AGREE
Title: Re: RAEP IS GOOD MAJIK
Post by: E.O.T. on April 21, 2011, 05:38:35 AM
Quote from: BadBeast on April 21, 2011, 05:23:47 AM
Quote from: E.O.T. on April 21, 2011, 05:10:37 AM
Quote from: BadBeast on April 20, 2011, 09:13:18 AM
Quote from: E.O.T. on April 20, 2011, 08:58:38 AM
Quote from: P3nT4gR4m on April 20, 2011, 08:50:38 AM
I agree with Badbeast, raping the vanquished is purely monkey behaviour. The leaders of any ill-disciplined conscript force know it's going to happen whether they want it to or not so they have two choices - court martial half their army or tart it up with some symbolic bullshit and condone it.

I THINK WE

         all agree with that point (?) - however, the focus i'm drawing attention to is that rape itself is a magical practice not a result of warfare.
So what about singular, non warfare type rape? If the rape itself is a magical act, what is the (supposed) result of the magic?

I'M NOT CERTAIN

         why you'd direct that question to me (?) - i'm not here promoting rape magic, on the contrary i (more or less) started this thread with the question - what the hell is rape magic?

HOWEVER

         an individual may be one thing, like say (generically) some metal head "satanist" committing such an act. what intrigued me about the interview statements is the appearance of a belief system of rape magic, held by a group of individuals, or a collective thought.
This is just a localized Military belief system, one that happens to hold rape as a magical act, in order to . . .well, to rape. There are plenty of other Armys where rape is common, and there is no such belief. So it seems to suggest the common thread is the act itself. The justification just builds itself around local frames of reference. In this case, superstition, reinforced by some potion or ritual. (Doesn't really matter what the word means in this instance)  

I DISAGREE

          because i think you're over generalizing

HOWEVER

          i am going to discontinue input at this point, i think this topic is just freakin people out

I BELIEVE

          LMNO gave some direct insight. i've been into/ studied comparative religions for a good twenty years now, just out of personal interest and that's where i'm coming from on this topic. that is all.
Title: Re: RAEP IS GOOD MAJIK
Post by: Nephew Twiddleton on April 21, 2011, 06:05:32 AM
Quote from: E.O.T. on April 21, 2011, 05:14:04 AM
Quote from: BadBeast on April 20, 2011, 10:06:44 AM
Quote from: BabylonHoruv on April 20, 2011, 09:32:19 AM
Quote from: BadBeast on April 20, 2011, 09:13:18 AM
Quote from: E.O.T. on April 20, 2011, 08:58:38 AM
Quote from: P3nT4gR4m on April 20, 2011, 08:50:38 AM
I agree with Badbeast, raping the vanquished is purely monkey behaviour. The leaders of any ill-disciplined conscript force know it's going to happen whether they want it to or not so they have two choices - court martial half their army or tart it up with some symbolic bullshit and condone it.

I THINK WE

          all agree with that point (?) - however, the focus i'm drawing attention to is that rape itself is a magical practice not a result of warfare.
So what about singular, non warfare type rape? If the rape itself is a magical act, what is the (supposed) result of the magic?

That's got to depend on the circumstances surrounding the rape.  Consensual sex is a common magical component as well, and while it has certain aspects associated with it (fertility, connection, etc) what the intended results of a specific act of magical sex are vary greatly.

In both the Serbian and African cases the rape seems to be tied to growing a nation and military victory and conquest.
Which ties in with the biological imperative that seems to be triggered whenever an invading Army is concerned.

MY IMPRESSION

          is more that the act is more like a sacrifice to the magic source, i guess, rather than as i said, conquest. like in wickerman or something.

Quid pro quo. Interesting observation.
Right now I'm hoping that some random Congolese Discordian happens upon this forum and sheds some light on this. Highly unlikely, but one can hope.
Title: Re: RAEP IS GOOD MAJIK
Post by: Triple Zero on April 21, 2011, 07:47:07 AM
Quote from: E.O.T. on April 21, 2011, 05:19:52 AM
000

          you're taking an agenda perspective. i'm asking really specifically, and i did not 180, for examples of this elsewhere - not that i want that to exist, but does it?

I dunno, this thread is really weird. And the subject is awful. And there's a strange guy trying to lead the conversation that starts each of his sentences with shouting, followed by a pause, then the rest of his sentence. I don't want to start that again, I know you're okay (from ECh and Nigel and Sig meeting you), but if you're looking for an explanation for my strange reactions, I can't read your posts in my mind in any other way. Simply unable to, and I tried. Just a little reminder that the way you write is still making normal communication between us impossible.

I see a strange man SHOUTing in staccato, trying to lead an awful awful discussion about mass rape and magic.

Have your fun with that, I'm out.
Title: Re: RAEP IS GOOD MAJIK
Post by: LMNO on April 21, 2011, 12:54:36 PM
Quote from: BadBeast on April 20, 2011, 11:54:19 PM
I've been thinking about this today, while I was fishing. Especially the second video. And how Armies are made. Here, (& in Western Aries generally) we take the recruits, and with an almost formulaic combination of intimidation, grueling physical hardship, and obsessive pointless repetition of Drill, we psychologically break down the recruit, until he is utterly without any value system but the Army's. Then build them up, through training, and attention to detail into tightly knit Units of fighting men, superbly trained, armed, and disciplined. An Warrior Elite system, that rewards competence with Rank and Command. Every part steps in time with every other, and the chain of command keeps everything working in synchronized efficiency. Or that's the idea anyway.

Compare that with the way the Congolese Army is built. Traumatized War Orphans, of perhaps 6 7 years old, are taken in, looked after, fed, and basically brought up by their 'new family', the Army. These kids don't need to be broken down, they are already broken. The Army is everything to them. They learn to use weapons. They get to kill people, to have the power of life and death over just about anybody that isn't their own Army/Tribe. They kill without compunction, or remorse, because it's all that they have ever known. They are accountable to no-one, except to their Brothers in the Army. They have no fear, because they're de-sensitized, having been exposed to horrific levels of violence, right from their earliest memories. They have no knowledge of Women, save for a hazy sense of their dead Mothers, and the stories of the older boys who have been in combat, and know what it is to rape, and kill, and to slay your enemies. Not just with bullets, but by torturing and raping the survivors, they are brutalizing and scarring their enemies head-space, in an act that by it's sheer desecration of everything their enemy is, psychologically damages them.

The  The Mothers they cannot recall, who abandoned them by dying, but whose tits they suckled for their first years, are sublimated as  the Dark Mother, mentioned in the Freeman vid.  They are serving Kali Drga, like the Thuggee Cultists in India,   

"My Enemy's  Blood, for my Dark destroying Mother of ruination! Blood for Kali, Blood of the English"
And the chanting calls of
"Thuggee, thuggee, thugee, (Oi, oi, oi,)"  in the dark Jungles at night, would turn the blood of the Englishman, safe inside his Fortified Palace, to ice in his veins. The Empire, the Army, the Queen, meant fuck all when the strangling Thuggees were hunting for their horrible Skull bedecked, Demon Goddess.   


To all intents and purposes, the raping of the Enemy's women, empowers the victors, and devastates the losers. Which is, I suppose, from one viewpoint, is pretty powerful magics. Especially when their Generals have access to the same kind of Drugs the Nazis used to forge their Super loyal Berserkers, and their SS Werewolf Elite forces. Only stronger.
And an Army that were more polarized than the Nazis. Recruited and trained just like the Hitler Youth. Only far more brutal. More hardened to committing atrocious acts of violence, from an earlier age than the Nazis. But less disciplined, less effective against a modern Army. But they don't have to fight our Armies. As long as they keep it to Africa, they have pretty much whatever they can take.
Look at the Tutsi / Hutu thing in Rwanda. No-one intervened. Or Idi Amin's insane brutalization of post colonial Uganda. Or  Mugabe today. Holding on to power by terrorizing the populace with his Army.

And in Africa, even the climate is enlisted to brutalize the people. The famines, enabled by western aid, ensure a desperately hungry refugee population, who are broken and brutalized, sacrificed to this dark Corn Mother, who withholds her bounty, and watches as people feed her dusty deserts with the blood of their children. Aids, rages across the continent, infecting more readily than anywhere else, a population with no spiritual immune system, no anti Aids drugs, no clean fucking water even! This is where that damage takes them.
Like an abused child, who unknowingly carries the resonance of his abuse ready to visit upon the next generation, ticking like a time bomb in his psyche, Africa sits there. it's size so intimidatingly huge that we scale it down in all our Maps. The Dark Continent. Devils, and superstition ruling people.
We shiver still, not just in fear, but with shame, for our exploitation of her resources. Fearing some new Mau-Mau type rising of all Africa, we keep her suppressed by our Economic Policies. We keep her woefully behind us in all technologies. Her guns are our cast offs. Her diseases and plagues, we withhold the cures from them, while generation after generation die, in Plagues, Famines, and Wars, all instigated and funded by our combined foreign policies. To them, this is magic. . . . . . We are raping them, with Multinationals, Aid Programs, and crippling, never ending debt.   

I suggest we end the thread with this.  It's pretty amazing.
Title: Re: RAEP IS GOOD MAJIK
Post by: Mesozoic Mister Nigel on April 21, 2011, 08:18:29 PM
Quote from: Triple Zero on April 21, 2011, 07:47:07 AM
Quote from: E.O.T. on April 21, 2011, 05:19:52 AM
000

          you're taking an agenda perspective. i'm asking really specifically, and i did not 180, for examples of this elsewhere - not that i want that to exist, but does it?

I dunno, this thread is really weird. And the subject is awful. And there's a strange guy trying to lead the conversation that starts each of his sentences with shouting, followed by a pause, then the rest of his sentence. I don't want to start that again, I know you're okay (from ECh and Nigel and Sig meeting you), but if you're looking for an explanation for my strange reactions, I can't read your posts in my mind in any other way. Simply unable to, and I tried. Just a little reminder that the way you write is still making normal communication between us impossible.

I see a strange man SHOUTing in staccato, trying to lead an awful awful discussion about mass rape and magic.

Have your fun with that, I'm out.


He may be strange, but he's my best friend. If that helps give you any context for his probable attitudes on racism and rape.
Title: Re: RAEP IS GOOD MAJIK
Post by: East Coast Hustle on April 21, 2011, 08:44:06 PM
There are people that I meet from PD that I end up being friends with mostly BECAUSE they're from PD, and then there are the ones that I'd have been friends with no matter what, even if we met by exchanging pleasantries at a bus stop or in line at the store.

EOT falls into the 2nd category. Dude is cool. So I'm not going to let the squicky nature of the subject matter derail a fairly interesting discussion that seems to comprise cultural idiosyncracies, linguistic uncertainties, AND 3rd world rape magic.
Title: Re: RAEP IS GOOD MAJIK
Post by: BadBeast on April 21, 2011, 08:53:55 PM
Quote from: Rip City Hustle on April 21, 2011, 08:44:06 PM
So I'm not going to let the squicky nature of the subject matter derail a fairly interesting discussion that seems to comprise cultural idiosyncracies, linguistic uncertainties, AND 3rd world rape magic.
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If Garth Ennis or Grant Morrison are reading this, they'd get a 15 issue Vertigo series out of it.
A major graphic Novel, or even a Movie if they combined it with the Iranian Dog's thread.  *Hastily scribbles sigil*  :fap: