Comparing Religions

[Sir Perineal]

But it also implies extreme passivity and Fatalism.

You say that like you think it's a bad thing 

But, I think Taoism is a little more optimistic than that description, although I could be wrong.

[P3nT4gR4m]

But it also implies extreme passivity and Fatalism.

BING! 

[LMNO]

I don't want to knock too much on Taoism, though.  Its ideas of balance and flow are pretty cool, and I really like the writing style of the Tao te Ching.

[tyrannosaurus vex]

passivity and fatalism... yes. but isn't the idea that by balancing and flowing you can avoid the situations that you'd need to be non-passive? as for fatalism, any philosophy or religion that denies that has its head up its ass -- control over your situation is almost always an illusion, regardless of how much shining jewelry and/or subservient females you dominate.

[LMNO]

Didn't we already have the Free Will discussion?

[Lies]

But it also implies extreme passivity and Fatalism.

What does?

[tyrannosaurus vex]

there's always a tendency to take these arguments to the extreme.

i admit i know pretty much jack-shit about the Tao. but iirc from my previous lifetimes, it has something to do with the "here and now" as opposed to some mythical idea like "some other time."  which (i think) means that control over your situation is an illusion -- not because there is something else controlling what you do or where you are, but because the point is not to engineer your reality but your perception and your attitude.

so when you're in the middle of a shitstorm you don't have a bunch of "that fucker did this to me" or, even worse, some unbearably emo moment.  you only have that you are there.

this post is trying to stay on topic but is apparently blindfolded and heading directly off-road.

[P3nT4gR4m]

I've read more zen than I have tao and I'm more of a zen fan although there does seem to be a lot of crossover. Reason I like zen is it focusses on the lulz. Enlightenment is almost always accompanied by laughter and all the scriptures are thinly veiled mindfuck one liners.

[Sir Perineal]

passivity and fatalism... yes. but isn't the idea that by balancing and flowing you can avoid the situations that you'd need to be non-passive? as for fatalism, any philosophy or religion that denies that has its head up its ass -- control over your situation is almost always an illusion, regardless of how much shining jewelry and/or subservient females you dominate.

yes, I don't think "wei wu-wei" or "action through non-action" necesarily means being passive all the time.  Instead, when you do things, you should finish your task, but then not dwell on it.  Also, they say you aren't supposed to desire, but rather be content.  So if you are truly content and accept the world, then you have nothing to desire and you won't have to engage in superfluous action.

for your comment on fatalism

[The Good Reverend Roger]

If Discordianism is an interpretation of Zen Buddhism, then the Church of the SubGenius is an interpretation of Taoism?

No.

You dumbshit.

[Mourning Star]

I hereby call for a vote of toolboxery on this fread...

...

[tyrannosaurus vex]

I hereby call for a vote of toolboxery on this fread...

...

way too early for that.

[B_M_W]

If Discordianism is an interpretation of Zen Buddhism, then the Church of the SubGenius is an interpretation of Taoism?

Wasn't a discordian said to be a Taoist with an odd sense of humor and the inability to sit still?

I never herd that before, but I really like it. I'm gonna start using that as the answer when someone asks me the question of our time, "What is Discordianism?"

AFAIK its actually one of the lines in the PD.

[B_M_W]

But it also implies extreme passivity and Fatalism.

What does?

Reffering to the yielding and inaction part of it. And I agree with LMNO, I really like the Tao Teh Ching, but some of it is just not good enough for me.

[Lies]

See, I think each of us interprets the tao differently. In fact, the very fact that were talking about it most likely shows that we haven't really grasped it, but we like to think we do. Oh the irony in trying to explain the Tao.

I don't know about the whole "passivity" thing, I mean, the Art of War is based on the Tao, that sure ain't hell about being passive to the enemy.

And the whole fatalism thing, I don't know where in the Tao it implies being fatalistic. I've never felt myself to be more in control of my destiny then since discovering Tao.