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Started by Mesozoic Mister Nigel, November 27, 2013, 04:52:34 PM

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LMNO

That's from 1986.

The Good Reverend Roger

Quote from: LMNO, PhD (life continues) on April 07, 2014, 06:08:01 PM
That's from 1986.

I was wondering why it started raining in my office.
" It's just that Depeche Mode were a bunch of optimistic loveburgers."
- TGRR, shaming himself forever, 7/8/2017

"Billy, when I say that ethics is our number one priority and safety is also our number one priority, you should take that to mean exactly what I said. Also quality. That's our number one priority as well. Don't look at me that way, you're in the corporate world now and this is how it works."
- TGRR, raising the bar at work.

The Good Reverend Roger

I'm working on clarifying the difference between a legitimate activist and an SJW.

So far, an activist wants to make things better.  An SJW wants to trumpet butthurt at the expense of making things better.

An activist is interested in advancing their cause.  An SJW *IS* The Cause.
" It's just that Depeche Mode were a bunch of optimistic loveburgers."
- TGRR, shaming himself forever, 7/8/2017

"Billy, when I say that ethics is our number one priority and safety is also our number one priority, you should take that to mean exactly what I said. Also quality. That's our number one priority as well. Don't look at me that way, you're in the corporate world now and this is how it works."
- TGRR, raising the bar at work.

LMNO

I like it.

An activist sees a problem in society and works to fix it.

A SJW wants you to know how it affects them personally, and alienates everyone around them not ideologically pure enough.

Cain

The most basic difference is activists do things.  SJWs and similar, as far as I can see, whine on the internet a lot.

If someone believes hashtag activism is a replacement for people on the streets, in debates and working with others, chances are they're lifestylists looking for a cause to bolster their sense of identity.

The Good Reverend Roger

Quote from: Cain on April 07, 2014, 08:17:54 PM
The most basic difference is activists do things.  SJWs and similar, as far as I can see, whine on the internet a lot.

If someone believes hashtag activism is a replacement for people on the streets, in debates and working with others, chances are they're lifestylists looking for a cause to bolster their sense of identity.

Nailed it.
" It's just that Depeche Mode were a bunch of optimistic loveburgers."
- TGRR, shaming himself forever, 7/8/2017

"Billy, when I say that ethics is our number one priority and safety is also our number one priority, you should take that to mean exactly what I said. Also quality. That's our number one priority as well. Don't look at me that way, you're in the corporate world now and this is how it works."
- TGRR, raising the bar at work.

The Good Reverend Roger

Quote from: LMNO, PhD (life continues) on April 07, 2014, 08:15:33 PM
I like it.

An activist sees a problem in society and works to fix it.

A SJW wants you to know how it affects them personally, and alienates everyone around them not ideologically pure enough.

This also.

It's hard to explain why I hate SJWs so much.  I think it's partially the phoniness.
" It's just that Depeche Mode were a bunch of optimistic loveburgers."
- TGRR, shaming himself forever, 7/8/2017

"Billy, when I say that ethics is our number one priority and safety is also our number one priority, you should take that to mean exactly what I said. Also quality. That's our number one priority as well. Don't look at me that way, you're in the corporate world now and this is how it works."
- TGRR, raising the bar at work.

The Good Reverend Roger

Also the fact that they make other peoples' lives worse for the sake of self-aggrandizement.
" It's just that Depeche Mode were a bunch of optimistic loveburgers."
- TGRR, shaming himself forever, 7/8/2017

"Billy, when I say that ethics is our number one priority and safety is also our number one priority, you should take that to mean exactly what I said. Also quality. That's our number one priority as well. Don't look at me that way, you're in the corporate world now and this is how it works."
- TGRR, raising the bar at work.

hooplala

Quote from: The Good Reverend Roger on April 07, 2014, 08:52:37 PM
Also the fact that they make other peoples' lives worse for the sake of self-aggrandizement.

This is more it, for me.
"Soon all of us will have special names" — Professor Brian O'Blivion

"Now's not the time to get silly, so wear your big boots and jump on the garbage clowns." — Bob Dylan?

"Do I contradict myself?
Very well then I contradict myself,
(I am large, I contain multitudes.)"
— Walt Whitman

Mesozoic Mister Nigel

Quote from: LMNO, PhD (life continues) on April 07, 2014, 12:25:48 PM
I've been thinking about it in a different way; more as, "Why does a minority group so often lash out at other minority groups that could easily be considered allies?"

What I noticed is that the antagonistic group can often be seen as a subset of the group on the receiving end1.  And I realized that they're pretty much the only ones who would have a chance of recognizing that subset even exists.

For example, while much of the gay/drag queen community knows the myriad forms trans* can take, the people who tangibly make life worse for them only see "a buncha fuckin' queers."  There's no distinction, so it's much harder for a trans* activist to stake out their own personal claim. 

So, while Joe McAsshole is stomping the ever-living fuck out of both of their rights, the trans* activist is going after RuPaul and Dan Savage, because at least they know what the trans* activist is talking about.

I think there is also a subset of people who are acting out of entitlement to appropriate a set of terminology that has historically belonged to another group, and at the same time seek to ingratiate themselves with the mainstream by distancing themselves from the very people whose language they are appropriating. They are the trans version of mansplainers; transplainers, I suppose you might call them. They are essentially walking into the queer community and saying "your experience is irrelevant; let me tell you what your experience is and should be".
"I'm guessing it was January 2007, a meeting in Bethesda, we got a bag of bees and just started smashing them on the desk," Charles Wick said. "It was very complicated."


The Good Reverend Roger

Quote from: Nigel on April 07, 2014, 09:29:51 PM
Quote from: LMNO, PhD (life continues) on April 07, 2014, 12:25:48 PM
I've been thinking about it in a different way; more as, "Why does a minority group so often lash out at other minority groups that could easily be considered allies?"

What I noticed is that the antagonistic group can often be seen as a subset of the group on the receiving end1.  And I realized that they're pretty much the only ones who would have a chance of recognizing that subset even exists.

For example, while much of the gay/drag queen community knows the myriad forms trans* can take, the people who tangibly make life worse for them only see "a buncha fuckin' queers."  There's no distinction, so it's much harder for a trans* activist to stake out their own personal claim. 

So, while Joe McAsshole is stomping the ever-living fuck out of both of their rights, the trans* activist is going after RuPaul and Dan Savage, because at least they know what the trans* activist is talking about.

I think there is also a subset of people who are acting out of entitlement to appropriate a set of terminology that has historically belonged to another group, and at the same time seek to ingratiate themselves with the mainstream by distancing themselves from the very people whose language they are appropriating. They are the trans version of mansplainers; transplainers, I suppose you might call them. They are essentially walking into the queer community and saying "your experience is irrelevant; let me tell you what your experience is and should be".

Yeah, I can see that.  A whole bunch.

Funny thing is, I have to smack myself around the head and neck a bunch to not do the same thing myself.  Not with respect to trans folks, but just in general.

" It's just that Depeche Mode were a bunch of optimistic loveburgers."
- TGRR, shaming himself forever, 7/8/2017

"Billy, when I say that ethics is our number one priority and safety is also our number one priority, you should take that to mean exactly what I said. Also quality. That's our number one priority as well. Don't look at me that way, you're in the corporate world now and this is how it works."
- TGRR, raising the bar at work.


Mesozoic Mister Nigel

Quote from: Cain on April 07, 2014, 08:17:54 PM
The most basic difference is activists do things.  SJWs and similar, as far as I can see, whine on the internet a lot.

If someone believes hashtag activism is a replacement for people on the streets, in debates and working with others, chances are they're lifestylists looking for a cause to bolster their sense of identity.

Boom. Dead on.
"I'm guessing it was January 2007, a meeting in Bethesda, we got a bag of bees and just started smashing them on the desk," Charles Wick said. "It was very complicated."


Mesozoic Mister Nigel

Quote from: The Good Reverend Roger on April 07, 2014, 09:33:24 PM
Quote from: Nigel on April 07, 2014, 09:29:51 PM
Quote from: LMNO, PhD (life continues) on April 07, 2014, 12:25:48 PM
I've been thinking about it in a different way; more as, "Why does a minority group so often lash out at other minority groups that could easily be considered allies?"

What I noticed is that the antagonistic group can often be seen as a subset of the group on the receiving end1.  And I realized that they're pretty much the only ones who would have a chance of recognizing that subset even exists.

For example, while much of the gay/drag queen community knows the myriad forms trans* can take, the people who tangibly make life worse for them only see "a buncha fuckin' queers."  There's no distinction, so it's much harder for a trans* activist to stake out their own personal claim. 

So, while Joe McAsshole is stomping the ever-living fuck out of both of their rights, the trans* activist is going after RuPaul and Dan Savage, because at least they know what the trans* activist is talking about.

I think there is also a subset of people who are acting out of entitlement to appropriate a set of terminology that has historically belonged to another group, and at the same time seek to ingratiate themselves with the mainstream by distancing themselves from the very people whose language they are appropriating. They are the trans version of mansplainers; transplainers, I suppose you might call them. They are essentially walking into the queer community and saying "your experience is irrelevant; let me tell you what your experience is and should be".

Yeah, I can see that.  A whole bunch.

Funny thing is, I have to smack myself around the head and neck a bunch to not do the same thing myself.  Not with respect to trans folks, but just in general.

I think a lot of smart people do, and that's part of why I'm here; to remind myself that I am NOT the smartest guy in the room.

The good news for all of us is that when we find ourselves educating someone on their own field of experience or expertise, it's never too late to just stop talking.
"I'm guessing it was January 2007, a meeting in Bethesda, we got a bag of bees and just started smashing them on the desk," Charles Wick said. "It was very complicated."


The Good Reverend Roger

Quote from: Nigel on April 07, 2014, 09:38:41 PM
The good news for all of us is that when we find ourselves educating someone on their own field of experience or expertise, it's never too late to just stop talking.

I make one exception, not joking or trying to be funny:  Mike the Engineer.  You have to keep talking.  You have to get him so mad he goes home for the day.  It's your only hope.

With that exception in mind, you are otherwise 169% correct.
" It's just that Depeche Mode were a bunch of optimistic loveburgers."
- TGRR, shaming himself forever, 7/8/2017

"Billy, when I say that ethics is our number one priority and safety is also our number one priority, you should take that to mean exactly what I said. Also quality. That's our number one priority as well. Don't look at me that way, you're in the corporate world now and this is how it works."
- TGRR, raising the bar at work.