Unlimited MENA Revolt Thread

[Jenne]

The sheer hypocrisy in Clinton's speeches this past weekend about Libya made me weep (in my head, but still).  It's like irony is completely and totally dead to these people.  But yes, the increased armament and the readying of planes to fly over is shocking, but not totally unpredictable.  I think the Conservatives have been slavering over the chance to do this for so long it must BE in some sort of "longterm war playbook" they wrote and the Obama administration keeps around for general guidelines.

And I always thought the reaction to the shootings in Bahrain had to do with a "special" relationship its King or whatever the fuck he is had with EU and US governments.  Those fuckers were killing AMBULANCE drivers and EMTs.  Pulling them out and beating/shooting them.  And the world just stood in shock SHOCK!! as they did it, but other than reporting on it, and the subsequent apologies issued (Oh, our bad, we thought you guys would find us so mighty you wouldn't REPORT on our display of great power and might against resistance...!!), uh yeah, virtual silence (there may have been a general issuing of statements of condemnation, but really, who gives a fuck, yeah?).

[Cain]

Protests were planned for today in Saudi Arabia.  Japan news likely meant reports never reached the air of most news channels.  As did the steps taken by the regime to undermine the protests, by stating foreign workers were the agitators, and sending in lots of heavily armed security people to the mostly Shia districts where the oil is extracted and where the protests were due to happen.

The Kingdom will no doubt deny, contrary to all recent evidence, that there is even a word in Arabic for "protest", but tomorrow's oil prices will show the truth of the situation.  If the Shia oil workers are getting violent, price rises will be unavoidable.  Even strike and sit-ins will cause barrels to increase steadily, as speculators become nervous.

In other news, we have to invade Libya to win the Spanish Civil War and avert World War 2, or something.

[The Good Reverend Roger]

Protests were planned for today in Saudi Arabia.  Japan news likely meant reports never reached the air of most news channels.  As did the steps taken by the regime to undermine the protests, by stating foreign workers were the agitators, and sending in lots of heavily armed security people to the mostly Shia districts where the oil is extracted and where the protests were due to happen.

The Kingdom will no doubt deny, contrary to all recent evidence, that there is even a word in Arabic for "protest", but tomorrow's oil prices will show the truth of the situation.  If the Shia oil workers are getting violent, price rises will be unavoidable.  Even strike and sit-ins will cause barrels to increase steadily, as speculators become nervous.

In other news, we have to invade Libya to win the Spanish Civil War and avert World War 2, or something.

Now, Cain, you know me, and you know I'm the last guy to run around screaming about "Zionists".

But, really.    Mister Avni seems to be a little shrill, no?

[Cain]

I personally like his assertion that Hitler and Mussolini would've settled down if Franco had lost the war.  That seems a totally credible alternative scenario.  In fact, I am surprised Harry Turtledove has not written a novel about this possibility.

[Cain]

Saudi Arabia and the UAE have sent fucking troops into Bahrain.

Morons, absolute morons.

1500 troops wont do jack shit, except turn this uprising into a sectarian conflict.  Because now Iran has been "proved" right in saying that the Gulf oil Sheikhdoms are nothing but Sunni autocracies, suppressing their Shia minorities at the behest of the House of Saud.

This wont stop the protests, and now Iran has a pretext to meddle as well.  Next step will be the Saudis and Iranians sponsoring jihadis, no doubt, since the Saudi Army has a morale somewhat below that of the Khmer Rouge rebels still holding out in the Cambodian hills, and will be solidly routed by any force showing more than basic enthusiasm and experience with weapons.

[Cain]

Har har har

http://craigmurray.org.uk/archives/2011/03/the-invasion-of-bahrain/

"A senior diplomat in a western mission to the UN in New York, who I have known over ten years and trust, has told me for sure that Hillary Clinton agreed to the cross-border use of troops to crush democracy in the Gulf, as a quid pro quo for the Arab League calling for Western intervention in Libya.

"The hideous King of Bahrain has called in troops from Saudi Arabia, UAE and Kuwait to attack pro-democracy protestors in Bahrain..."

[Don Coyote]

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20110318/ap_on_re_us/us_us_libya

WASHINGTON – After weeks of hesitation and divisions among his advisers, President Barack Obama on Friday endorsed military action against Libya's Moammar Gadhafi, saying U.S. values and credibility are at stake to stop "the potential for mass murder" of innocents.

The U.S. military, which is already stretched thin by two wars and an expanding effort to assist disaster victims in Japan, would take a supporting role, Obama said, with European and Arab partners in the lead. He explicitly ruled out sending American ground forces into the North African nation.

Nothing good will come of this.

[Don Coyote]

And we are now blowing shit up

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-africa-12796972

The UK, the US and France have begun attacking Libya as enforcement of the UN-mandated no-fly zone gets under way.

More than 110 missiles have been fired by the UK and US, officials at the Pentagon say.

Earlier, forces loyal to Libyan leader Colonel Muammar Gaddafi attacked the rebel stronghold of Benghazi despite declaring a ceasefire a day earlier.

Western planes bombed targets in the capital, Tripoli, said the AFP news agency, quoting witnesses and state TV.

[BabylonHoruv]

Protests were planned for today in Saudi Arabia.  Japan news likely meant reports never reached the air of most news channels.  As did the steps taken by the regime to undermine the protests, by stating foreign workers were the agitators, and sending in lots of heavily armed security people to the mostly Shia districts where the oil is extracted and where the protests were due to happen.

The Kingdom will no doubt deny, contrary to all recent evidence, that there is even a word in Arabic for "protest", but tomorrow's oil prices will show the truth of the situation.  If the Shia oil workers are getting violent, price rises will be unavoidable.  Even strike and sit-ins will cause barrels to increase steadily, as speculators become nervous.

In other news, we have to invade Libya to win the Spanish Civil War and avert World War 2, or something.

I always thoguht the Arabic word for protest was Jihad (although of course it means a lot of other things too)

[Juana]

And we are now blowing shit up

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-africa-12796972

The UK, the US and France have begun attacking Libya as enforcement of the UN-mandated no-fly zone gets under way.

More than 110 missiles have been fired by the UK and US, officials at the Pentagon say.

Earlier, forces loyal to Libyan leader Colonel Muammar Gaddafi attacked the rebel stronghold of Benghazi despite declaring a ceasefire a day earlier.

Western planes bombed targets in the capital, Tripoli, said the AFP news agency, quoting witnesses and state TV.

Great.

[Cain]

It is interesting to note the lack of voting on these measures in those countries undertaking them.  While the UK PM retains the Royal Perogative of military deployment, and the French frequently defer foreign policy making to the Presidency, I am fairly sure that in the US Congress and in particular Senator Lugar (one of the two Repub Senators worth listening to on foreign policy issues) have demanded a vote on military action.  Now, I have been busy, especially in the past several hours, but as far as I am aware that vote has not yet taken place.

This also adds evidence to a pet thesis of mine that states will tend to show more antidemocratic sentiment when it comes to foreign policy making and this sentiment is not necessarily linked to parliamentary formalism (though the case can be made that the three countries named above are oligarchies and not true democracies anyway).

Legally, of course, all of this is above board, with the possible exception of the USA, it is just interesting to note.

[Requia ☣]

The US has the war powers resolution, to allow Obama to do whatever the hell he feels like, regardless of what the Constitution says.

[Cain]

Actually, it gives him two months to get a vote, since the US is not under attack or imminent threat.

I'll be very surprised if all the troops come home before that deadline is reached.

[Da6s]

France has deployed Charles de Gaulle.

I'm pretty sure that means they aren't fucking around on this one.



Edit: someday I'll be able to spell that right.

[Requia ☣]

Er yes, the two month thing (in the absence of congress actually voting on the matter anyway).

I'll be highly amused if they don't come home by then, if only because it'll finally force the courts to admit if they have any intention of enforcing the war powers clause.