I had a GREAT idea for a book

[Cain]

Those of you who know my reading habits probably know I am not the greatest fan of fantasy writing in history, unless it is exceptional (see: Terry Pratchett, George RR Martin, Tolkein and Gaiman for more).  Therefore, it only seems fit to parody the fuck out of the genre.

The idea I had, while stewing in late-stage insomnia last night, was elegantly simple:  Have the usual fantasy setting, the 'evil' kingdom, the 'good' one, the ancient religion, hidden royal bloodline and all that usual crap...and then portray the "hero" as a sociopathic loose cannon with a chip on his shoulder and unreasonable sense of entitlement, who brings two said nations to the brink of war, merely to satisfy his own racist, messianic, authoritarian wet dreams (which most fantasy "heroes" have, when you strip away Authorial Intent and Implied Character Traits).

Instead, the real heroes would be the diplomats, spies, courtiers, mercenaries and other usual ensemble bad guys for the genre, who try and keep the peace while the fuckhead hero is intent on creating a devestating war which could plunge the region into complete chaos.  You know, the people actually trying to stop a war entirely, instead of glorifying in its bloodshed.

Naturally, it needs fleshing out, but that is the basic premise.

[Faust]

I'm sold

[Cainad (dec.)]

Oh sweet.

This sociopathic "hero" is celebrated and treated as a hero by the rest of the populace, I'm assuming? And the real protagonists are the ones who see him for what he really is?

I'm already chuckling.



Okay, quick brainstorm for the setting:

The "good" kingdom is Glamaria, while the "evil" kingdom is Atathraxis (here I'm attempting to satisfy the trope that good things have lilting names while the evil things have phonically harsh names).

Atathraxis is ruled by an evil emperor. Glamaria is ruled by a generally good king along with a well-intentioned but indecisive and petty council of nobles/elders.

Am I being generic enough?

[Verbal Mike]

DO EET.
Will buy.

[Prelate Diogenes Shandor]

Sounds like a good idea.

It vaguely reminds me of the way that Sir Lancelot is portrayed in Spamalot and Monty Python and the Holy Grail (its also a bit reminiscent of the musical Wicked). All of these things that it reminds me of are things that I like, by the way.

I would like to see a whole novel taken in this direction, especially if its well written.

[Lazera the forgotten]

Sounds like an awesome plan. 

[Jasper]

This would not only make a good book, but I think it'd also make a great premise for an RPG plot. 

I really enjoy morally confusing stories.  It always depresses me when the "right" thing to do is plain as day.

[Tempest Virago]

This sounds awesome.

Books where the main characters are diplomats, spies, mercenaries, etc. already tend to be my favorite fantasy books.

[Pope Lecherous]

Those of you who know my reading habits probably know I am not the greatest fan of fantasy writing in history, unless it is exceptional (see: Terry Pratchett, George RR Martin, Tolkein and Gaiman for more).  Therefore, it only seems fit to parody the fuck out of the genre.

The idea I had, while stewing in late-stage insomnia last night, was elegantly simple:  Have the usual fantasy setting, the 'evil' kingdom, the 'good' one, the ancient religion, hidden royal bloodline and all that usual crap...and then portray the "hero" as a sociopathic loose cannon with a chip on his shoulder and unreasonable sense of entitlement, who brings two said nations to the brink of war, merely to satisfy his own racist, messianic, authoritarian wet dreams (which most fantasy "heroes" have, when you strip away Authorial Intent and Implied Character Traits).

Instead, the real heroes would be the diplomats, spies, courtiers, mercenaries and other usual ensemble bad guys for the genre, who try and keep the peace while the fuckhead hero is intent on creating a devestating war which could plunge the region into complete chaos.  You know, the people actually trying to stop a war entirely, instead of glorifying in its bloodshed.

Naturally, it needs fleshing out, but that is the basic premise.

Stolen.  race you to the best sellers list

[Cain]

I think that Alan Moore, George R R Martin and Norman Spinrad have collectively beaten us both to the punch on this one, PL.  At least, that was where I got my inspiration from, along with a PhD candidate I know who studies English, and rants about terrible books she has read quite often.

[Cain]

Oh sweet.

This sociopathic "hero" is celebrated and treated as a hero by the rest of the populace, I'm assuming? And the real protagonists are the ones who see him for what he really is?

I'm already chuckling.



Okay, quick brainstorm for the setting:

The "good" kingdom is Glamaria, while the "evil" kingdom is Atathraxis (here I'm attempting to satisfy the trope that good things have lilting names while the evil things have phonically harsh names).

Atathraxis is ruled by an evil emperor. Glamaria is ruled by a generally good king along with a well-intentioned but indecisive and petty council of nobles/elders.

Am I being generic enough?

Not bad, though I planned something slightly different.

Settings:

The "good" setting I thought might be better as a republic, along Roman lines.  There is no necessary reason for a setting to be a kingdom, except to play to stereotype.  Furthermore, one monarchy allows for others, because what matters is essentially the monarch themselves, and so there is sometimes a good reason for a character to overthrow the ("illegitimate") King and take their place.  A republic, on the other hand, is in theory legitamized via its elections and its civic culture.  Plus, it allows for a setting where the Roman Senate smears against Tiberius Gracchus can be played out as if they were actually true, that our usurper/"hero" really does want to seize power and become King.

I'm still undecided on the opposing state.  I'm leaning towards Orcs, because that would illustrate the racist tendencies I believe most fantasy has better, but I might still do humans (or even a composite state of humans and orcs).  They would be a former powerful country on hard times, kind of like Russia.  They wouldn't be an enemy, per se, but there would have been past conflict between them and the republic, and due to their current misfortunes, a powerful business/criminal/political clique at the heart of their state.  The sort of people you can do business with, but also the sort of people who would take border raids being launched from inside the republic or attempted assassinations of its ambassadors badly.

As for the people...most of them will see the hero for what he is.  Some bandit who runs around with a shiny sword, killing people on flimsy premises and acting like an idiot.  However, in the past, I want the Republic to have been an actual kingdom, with our hero being descended from the last line of Kings.  Because of the expansionist natures of the Kingdom and the Republic, this original kingdom is now a province on the border with the enemy state.  They werent conquered, but united by choice into the Republic when the last king was overthrown.  However, nostalgia, and the Mystical Old Religion still hold sway there.  Its kind of like the Midwest, with the whole "we are the true Americans" thing.  Those people there, they will support our sociopathic protagonist.  Mainly because someone needs to, otherwise our hero will get sliced and diced within about 10 minutes of starting his crazy killing rampage.

[Wind rider]

What, no evil witch/wizard?

They would be a former powerful country on hard times, kind of like Russia.  They wouldn't be an enemy, per se, but there would have been past conflict between them and the republic, and due to their current misfortunes, a powerful business/criminal/political clique at the heart of their state.  The sort of people you can do business with, but also the sort of people who would take border raids being launched from inside the republic or attempted assassinations of its ambassadors badly.

Why have an attempted assassination when the "hero" can just over react to a percieved slight?

[Verbal Mike]

That sounds like a lot of fun to read, Cain.
Also, when the fuck will G.R.R. Martin complete that fucking upcoming book goddammit. I need my fix.

[Cain]

What, no evil witch/wizard?

They would be a former powerful country on hard times, kind of like Russia.  They wouldn't be an enemy, per se, but there would have been past conflict between them and the republic, and due to their current misfortunes, a powerful business/criminal/political clique at the heart of their state.  The sort of people you can do business with, but also the sort of people who would take border raids being launched from inside the republic or attempted assassinations of its ambassadors badly.

Why have an attempted assassination when the "hero" can just over react to a percieved slight?

The evil witch/wizard will probably be a member of Ancient Mystical Religion (which will be batshit insane) and will reveal the "destiny" and lineage of the hero.

No, the hero is going to attempt to assassinate the ambassador, for being evil.  Possibly.  I'm trying to figure out a way for his apparently random killing sprees to have a wider political significance and ramifications.

Verb, according to Amazon, it should be rolling off the presses sometime in September.  But, then, he said it would be finished nearly three years ago, so I wouldn't put too much trust in that. He has a couple of sample chapters up on his site, and I hear (uncomfirmed rumour) that Sandor Clegane(!) will be a POV character in this book, possibly along with Mesliandre.

[Cramulus]

this sounds good, Cain. I share your distaste for fantasy lit, despite being an avid D&D player and larpwright. (lol portmanteau)

As for the Orc nation - the racist overtones aren't recognized by most fantasy fans - maybe try something more explicit? Like humans with smudgy skin and a secondary fantastic characteristic (claws, pointed ears, weird eyes). Or "Mongrelmen". Or just call them "Chinese".



on that note, know what would be funny? To write a typical fantasy novel but it takes place in the modern world. Substitute real world concepts for all the fantasy tropes. Like a story about the last survivor of the Circuit City bloodline being knighted by Barack Obama to go into the urban jungle to slay an evil bureaucrat who is building an army of financial slaves.