Messages

Democracy is like a nice lullaby to sing while raping babies. 

Someone ought to set that fucker to music. With its haunting chorus 'If voting made any difference they wouldn't let us do it'

drunk as a skunk and all laid and splayed . . .

In LMNO's thread Fact check, plz Roger said

Silly English people.   

No wonder you had to hire Germans to run your country.

Here's something to give you  a laugh Roger -I'm not actually sure that there has ever been an English monarch of the Kingdom of England. The Neanderthals came over then there was the tribal times, then the Romans [Italian] then the dark ages - more tribalism. The Angles and Saxons were germanic, the Normans were French, King Arthur was mythical. Our favourite hero king, Richard the Lionheart didn't speak English and hardly set foot in the damn country, his evil brother John did deign to live here and was repaid for that ridiculous affectation by revolting Barons who made him sign Magna Carta.  The Tudors were Welsh, the Stuarts started out Scots and ended up Dutch and when they ran out of Dutchmen we were taken over by the Germans, from Hanoverians  [the people not the horses] to our current deeply beloved Saxe-Coburg-Gothas. Oops sorry I meant the House of Windsor. Are you still laughing because it really is utterly giggleworthy. Oh, and then there was Monty Python, which is just about appropriate I suppose

[to]

Thurnez I take your point about the limited franchise but that was what constituted democracy back then. Democracy just means "people power" and who is to be regarded as one of "the people" is wildly variable over time

I really disagree with that. By that definition everything is democracy.
The way I see it is there has be at least a small majority of power delegated to the populous, not just the ruling elite.
And Britain before the 1800's fought hard against this reorganization of power, most famous being the French democracy which threatened them far worse then any colonial power could. Now I know that wasn't the only reason but it surely was an influence in the wars against the Girondins and the Jacobins.

I understand your disagreement but *you can't base a definition of democracy on what seems to be an equitable sharing of power in contemporary society.  I would disagree that the definition I gave means that everything is "democracy", but it does mean that you need to be aware of what kind of "democracy" you are looking at in any given situation. * that's generic "you" btw not you personally

I came across this quote when I was checking some stuff and it really rings true
"Democracy is the most valued and also the vaguest of political terms in the modern world."
Its like a colour -  there are lots of different shades

I am not aware of any system where power is delegated to the populace by a ruling elite

And yeah the French Revolution scared the living shit out of the PTB over here but I don't see how that reflects on the nature of "democracy".

[British]

That would be the British Parliament then, and what is your support for the claim that the, unelected, House of Lords was dominant. Are you saying that because our upper house is still unelected, that  contemporary Britain is not a democracy?

NB I was not trying to be a prick but I get really ansty when people call Britain "England" - its like saying that all Americans live in Washington because that's where the capital is


And The Queen technically can still send all the politicians home like naughty schoolkids if the whim takes her.

Thurnez I take your point about the limited franchise but that was what constituted democracy back then. Democracy just means "people power" and who is to be regarded as one of "the people" is wildly variable over time

I'm not smart and I don't claim to be - I think I might have been for a while I think, but I gave it up for Lent one year and, after 40 days without it it never seemed that important any more. Boringly I was actually providing "facts" as per the thread title - you did Engineering and physics or whatever I was doing History. I stand by my first post - The American War of Independence was against a democracy - the franchise might have been extended but Gt Britain was a constitutional monarchy even back then which by definition is a democracy.

Boy you get tetchy when someone points out that you are as just fallible as the rest of us.

MMIX laughing at you

Would the war of 1812 count?

No, at the time, Canada and England, were part of Britain and as such were part of a constitutional monarchy.

fixed to fit the thread title 

I didn't realize the thread title was "PEDANTIC PRICKS ITT".

And a constitutional monarchy can also be a democracy. Hence the whole having a Parliament thing. 

Would the war of 1812 count?

No, at the time, Canada and England, were part of Britain and as such were part of a constitutional monarchy.

fixed to fit the thread title 

[diffident cough] er -no taxation without representation . . .

maybe dead celebrities would be better? certainly worth more. I have to wonder what David Carradine thinks of PeeDee.

it took his breath away . . .



PS Cliff Richard has been dead for over 2 hundred years now - thats not his face its the soles of his feet

Just google earthed it. WTF is with you americans? Is every fucking place over there divided into neat little perfect squares? This explains the automotive windowlicker convention that is Nascar - none of you poor bastards have ever driven a car around a proper corner have you? Only a nation with no drivable roads could possibly invent a motorsport where you just drive round in circles. It all makes perfect sense now.

I'd expect this sort of attitude from the people who thought the bagpipe was a logical choice for an instrument.

but bagpipes were originally French - you can't actually blame the Scots for that one

PD.com: we might not agree on anything, but we all agree that jazz is shit.

I'm not fucking leaving just 'cos nobody else here likes jazz - fuck that noise too . . .

Discordian evangelism = Discovangelism?

Only if BEARFORCE1 is playing  Chariots of fire in slowmo while you do it.

eta: 

two thirds of this made me laugh out loud