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Messages - P3nT4gR4m

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6301
Not normal AIDS, airborne AIDS featuring leprosy.


If this disease doesn't exist then it fucking well ought to  :lulz:

6302
Aneristic Illusions / Re: Indecision 08 Wingnut thread
« on: November 12, 2008, 11:18:42 pm »
The one you haven't noticed is being waged right under your nose.

We are at war with government inc. They started it. They're winning and, unless you wise up PDQ, the chances are it'll all be over before you notice.

Run while you still have legs :lulz:

6303
Aneristic Illusions / Re: Indecision 08 Wingnut thread
« on: November 12, 2008, 11:11:07 pm »
They never will. The government has pretty much nailed the coffin shut on this one. Right now, as we speak, "we the people" are begging on their hands and knees to have more of their rights taken away every day and the ones that oppose it are increasingly vilified and marginalised.

You might have stood a chance of organising an uprising if you'd gotten there 40 or 50 years ago but, as it stands, your constitution only means anything to the lunatic fringes. The population who you so desperately wish to save will be the first to call the cops the minute you give it a shot.

By the time the government gets bad enough to satisfy your own criterion there'll be no one left with the will to stand against them. Right now your government is rampaging across the planet, killing and torturing indiscriminately. What more would it take?


It would be foolish of me not to admit that there is a significant possibility of this being true.  But, I'm not going to resign myself to it, and certainly won't tailor my political opinions and actions as if it is.
 :sad:

If we do win this war it won't be with guns. It's how much damage you can do with your mind that'll make a difference, that and how much mental punishment you can take and still come back fighting. That's how they're winning on the domestic front. The foreign policy is merely a distraction.

Suppose they had a war and no one realised they were being killed :fnord:

6304
Aneristic Illusions / Re: Indecision 08 Wingnut thread
« on: November 12, 2008, 10:02:09 pm »
...Because while most people may say they uphold the second Ammendent and have them to defend against government tyranny, they don't mean this (or the incoming government). 

...government's do not give a shit about hypothetical threats.

...But it ain't happening now, and there are no indicators it is about to happen.
these points i call  :cn:


Oh fuck off.  You're not even debating in good faith anymore.

Try: nearly every single government paper ever produced on deterrence.  No, I don't have the time to list them all.

Bullshit. you're spouting things and you won't back them up? 
You say people that support the 2nd amendment aren't referring to it's use on our current gov?  rather pretentious to say that because people have not yet felt that it is necessary to take up arms that they wouldn't use it on the current gov if they committed atrocities at some level. 
You say gov doesn't give a shit about hypothetical threats?  You know full well that they do give a shit. enough so that they spend good resources on planning for all kinds of unlikely events.  The shit like the continuity of govt plans that take into account armed populace proves it.  They do factor an armed populace into their equations, therefore it has some deterrent effect.  you think it isn't sufficient, say that, but don't spout off superlative statements and then tell me to fuck off when i call you on it.
You say that there isn't growing resentment towards the govt, that could lead to popular support against the govt. and i'm wondering how you can possibly say that?


They never will. The government has pretty much nailed the coffin shut on this one. Right now, as we speak, "we the people" are begging on their hands and knees to have more of their rights taken away every day and the ones that oppose it are increasingly vilified and marginalised.

You might have stood a chance of organising an uprising if you'd gotten there 40 or 50 years ago but, as it stands, your constitution only means anything to the lunatic fringes. The population who you so desperately wish to save will be the first to call the cops the minute you give it a shot.

By the time the government gets bad enough to satisfy your own criterion there'll be no one left with the will to stand against them. Right now your government is rampaging across the planet, killing and torturing indiscriminately. What more would it take?

6306
Aneristic Illusions / Re: Indecision 08 Wingnut thread
« on: November 12, 2008, 09:06:38 pm »
Also, to quote Stalin:

"The Pope.  How many divisions has he got?"

That is the mentality of almost every successful leader.  The actual deterrence threat, right now, of guns in the arms of US citizens right now is hovering around zero.  Why?  Because while most people may say they uphold the second Ammendent and have them to defend against government tyranny, they don't mean this (or the incoming government).  Oh no, they mean some hypothetical government, one which presumably does more than just torture and lock people up without reason and so on and so forth.

The practical threat assessment, right now, would say: lone wolves, possibly self-organizing cells, minimal military experience.  Fuck, I wouldn't be scared of that, even if I only had the Swiss Guard as my military arm.

This is what I mean when I talk about breaking the political-social hegemon.  Guns are nothing more than a hypothetical threat, and government's do not give a shit about hypothetical threats.  Sure, some time in the future, maybe some sort of agarian revolution with a measure of popular support will be directed against Washington DC.  But it ain't happening now, and there are no indicators it is about to happen.  So the threat, the deterrent value, don't mean shit.

:potd: :mittens:

6307
Aneristic Illusions / Re: Indecision 08 Wingnut thread
« on: November 12, 2008, 08:58:29 pm »
Lets put this in perspective people - the second amendment was invented by a bunch of medieval fucks who were totally buzzed with their recent victory against 'the man' and feeling more idealistic than realistic.

Step forward 6 million years or however long it's been and 'the man' is now a lot closer to home, an with a ubiquitous reach that would have been unfathomable back then.

And you can stop him by buying a gun?

Yeah right!

6308
Aneristic Illusions / Re: Indecision 08 Wingnut thread
« on: November 12, 2008, 08:30:42 pm »
I think a government as powerful as the United States, faced with a potential insurgency, would use every tool possible to defeat such insurgents and be free to deny their methods via their friends in the media.  So poison in the water, raping and killing your family and sending you the video, bioengineered weaponry etc etc....the methods are limitless and brutal.

Could such a method work?  Its hard to say.  Terrorism would at best reduce America to a failed state status, and that's assuming this superterrorism stuff ever gets off the ground.  A guerrilla organization may have a better chance....maybe.  Depending on the particulars, such as support, ideology, lines of supply etc

Its not something I'd wish on my worst enemy though.  Counterinsurgency, by its very nature, is the nastiest form of warfare you can see.  All the rules go out the window, though it may not be publically acknowledged.  As I pointed out with my criticism in the other thread, you'd probably need to break the socio-cultural hegemon of the US political system before you could ever hope to win militarily.
i suspect the government is plenty smart enough to realise the cost of war with its own people, this is why they push the some guns are "bad" propaganda this is why they push biased  gun death statistics in the media and why the gun laws they promote effect the law abiding citizen and not criminals. the long slow approach to disarming the public is the only one that will work, England and Australia are examples of the success of this method.  

Other than the fact that I don't get shot as often what's the difference between living here or over there under Freedomtm

6309
Aneristic Illusions / Re: Indecision 08 Wingnut thread
« on: November 12, 2008, 08:21:34 pm »
I think a government as powerful as the United States, faced with a potential insurgency, would use every tool possible to defeat such insurgents and be free to deny their methods via their friends in the media.  So poison in the water, raping and killing your family and sending you the video, bioengineered weaponry etc etc....the methods are limitless and brutal.

Could such a method work?  Its hard to say.  Terrorism would at best reduce America to a failed state status, and that's assuming this superterrorism stuff ever gets off the ground.  A guerrilla organization may have a better chance....maybe.  Depending on the particulars, such as support, ideology, lines of supply etc

Its not something I'd wish on my worst enemy though.  Counterinsurgency, by its very nature, is the nastiest form of warfare you can see.  All the rules go out the window, though it may not be publically acknowledged.  As I pointed out with my criticism in the other thread, you'd probably need to break the socio-cultural hegemon of the US political system before you could ever hope to win militarily.

But it's never going to happen, cos they have the 2nd amendment and the right to shoot each other  :lulz:

6310
Think for Yourself, Schmuck! / Re: Early meditations on Mind
« on: November 12, 2008, 07:59:12 pm »
Do not compare cats to dogs. Seriously I beg you!

Cat's are not pack animals, therefore they have no desire to do what they're told hence their disobedient nature which cat owners love to anthropomorphise into human-like rebelliousness or whatever stupid fucking personality whatever stupid fucking cat owner likes to project.

Dogs on the other hand, whilst vastly more intelligent than cats, are still completely fucking stupid. However a dog will try to fit in with the pack more, because that's the way it survives in the wild.

Incidentally I place cat owners below cats in the self awareness/intelligence pecking order. 

6311
Aneristic Illusions / Re: Indecision 08 Wingnut thread
« on: November 12, 2008, 07:51:36 pm »
Of course, you could just vote people in who mostly disband the armed forces, thus making them easier to defeat.  But then you'd have to give up the empire.

The price of guns would skyrocket. Be realistic FFS!

6313
Aneristic Illusions / Re: Indecision 08 Wingnut thread
« on: November 12, 2008, 07:47:33 pm »
It's your constitutional right!

6314
Aneristic Illusions / Re: Indecision 08 Wingnut thread
« on: November 12, 2008, 07:42:53 pm »
You keep using that word.....
I do not think it means what you think it means...
I probably don't.
Why don't you enlighten me?
It was originally used in the German 'sturmgewehr' StG44 which was the result of Germany realizing that combat had evolved from shooting over long distances of no man's land to shooting shorter distances in urban settings.  They developed a medium strength cartridge of smaller caliber and made the rifle select fire (meaning it can shoot fully automatic).  So, those are the features of an assault rifle.
In the AWB of 1994, they used the term 'assault weapon' which they defined as a gun on a 'bad list' or having over a minimum amount of some features which they deemed evil:
 
Quote
   Semi-automatic rifles able to accept detachable magazines and two or more of the following:
        * Folding stock
        * Conspicuous pistol grip
        * Bayonet mount
        * Flash suppressor, or threaded barrel designed to accommodate one
        * Grenade launcher (more precisely, a muzzle device which enables the launching or firing of rifle grenades)

    Semi-automatic pistols with detachable magazines and two or more of the following:
        * Magazine that attaches outside the pistol grip
        * Threaded barrel to attach barrel extender, flash suppressor, handgrip, or silencer
        * Barrel shroud that can be used as a hand-hold
        * Unloaded weight of 50 oz (1.4 kg) or more
        * A semi-automatic version of an automatic firearm

    Semi-automatic shotguns with two or more of the following:
        * Folding or telescoping stock
        * Pistol grip
        * Fixed capacity of more than 5 rounds
        * Detachable magazine

They were essentially dictating against aesthetics, and none of these met the actual definition of 'assault rifle' because none of them are fully automatic.
They can all be used for whatever purpose you want.  So to say "...people owning assault weapons but rifles, shotguns and pistols for protection and hunting, non automatic, seems perfectly reasonable" doesn't fly because they are declaring wide swaths of them to be assault weapons.  and they are used for protection and hunting.  This last weekend, when i went out hunting i used a Remington R-25 which would be banned under the current ban legislation in the pipe (which is more restrictive yet) even though it was specifically designed for hunting.

and, again.  the whole point of the 2nd amendment, is not for protection against criminals or for hunting. it is to act as a deterrent against gov tyranny.... we should be armed with the equivalent of an infantryman, in my opinion.


The average infantryman has the ability to call in arty, an airstrike or just a couple of friendly gunships to back him up. The second amendment is bullshit because your government has bigger guns - they will win. It's not like the good old days when a couple of hicks with a horse and some black powder could take on the might of the british empire. Your guns are fucking useless against tanks so we're back to my original point - the only way the 2nd amendment would be feasible is if everyone in america had an ICBM in their back yard. I have sky news and a bigscreen teevee so I'm happy enough to support this legislation in any way I'm able. :lulz:

6315
Except that one set of labels and understandings lead to modern medicine, physics, and chemistry, while the other lead to...what?


Holy war, live 24/7 on the teevee that the scientists invented!

Do not be hating on religion, without it the achievements of science would be useless  :lulz:

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