Has this been addressed?

[P3nT4gR4m]

All optional. Every decision you make, ever, will have little or no lasting effect in the grand sheme of things. Subjectively OTOH, it's night and day.

"little or no lasting effect" on what?
Because I would submit that at the very least, the decisions you make can have an impact on what cell you are living in, even if it means deciding to stay in the one you are in. 

Awareness of your environment, I believe, has an impact on your self to a certain degree, or at least how you operate.  Being aware of the environment, I also believe, is a choice, a decision.  Ergo, I submit that decisions can have impacts.  Sure, you're not going to change the world, but anyone who thinks they could should be more self-aware of their delusions. 

What I'm saying is that all you can be aware of is delusion. There is no form of awareness beyond this. But there is the realisation of this fact. If you fully realise it the cosmic giggle becomes just that - the whole thing is a trip. As soon as you lose sight of this fact you're back into a world of right and wrong, with an arbitrary judge who is not you.

[LHX]

Does anyone ever really grasp all that is happening to them?  I mean...if you are that much inside your head, can you function?

I think we have a survival mechanism that turns that off.  Otherwise, you'll just stand in front of a snow-filled tv set drooling all day.

i think we have mechanisms to ignore it for as long as we can

it definitely isnt easy, but troof is something you have to learn to 'live' with


really - there is no other long-term choice

[LHX]

Does anyone ever really grasp all that is happening to them?  I mean...if you are that much inside your head, can you function?

I think we have a survival mechanism that turns that off.  Otherwise, you'll just stand in front of a snow-filled tv set drooling all day.

probably not, except for maybe OC-types. Even then, they are things that they are ignoring while focusing on their compulsions.

While I think we all recognize the fear, the thing we don't want to happen, at some point you just have to shrug your shoulders and say, eh fuck it. The more you try to control, to bear down and steer, the more paralyzed you'll become like you said.

That doesn't sound very funny to me.

It's a good reason for the predominant use of anethsitizing agents (drugs/alcohol/other addictions), as well.  Why deal with the troof when you can put it off til tomorrow?  And by then, your hangover will preclude you doing anything but sleeping it off...

or - that means you have troof PLUS a hangover to deal with

[LHX]

All optional. Every decision you make, ever, will have little or no lasting effect in the grand sheme of things. Subjectively OTOH, it's night and day.

"little or no lasting effect" on what?
Because I would submit that at the very least, the decisions you make can have an impact on what cell you are living in, even if it means deciding to stay in the one you are in. 

Awareness of your environment, I believe, has an impact on your self to a certain degree, or at least how you operate.  Being aware of the environment, I also believe, is a choice, a decision.  Ergo, I submit that decisions can have impacts.  Sure, you're not going to change the world, but anyone who thinks they could should be more self-aware of their delusions. 

true

there really is no reason to believe that the entire universe depends on you and your actions

or rather - there is no less reason to believe that than there is to believe that none of your actions matter




from my calculations - the best course of action is the one that successfully addresses both scenarios


(borrowing from Hagakure again:) plunge recklessly toward a irrational death by heading in what your perception deems to be the right direction; make sure you have a mechanism in place that allows your perception to take in new information and develop new approaches

continually bust out of the prison

again and again and again and again and again until every decision you make is representative of busting out

or something to that effect

[P3nT4gR4m]

I hate to be the one to quote the crow here but "Do what thou wilt"

[LHX]

I hate to be the one to quote the crow here but "Do what thou wilt"

no doubt

there is so many ways to say it - but that seems to be what it boils down to


its too bad that the statement doesnt sound right to peoples ears when they first hear it


all they think of is 'selfishness' and falling victim to temptation and vices

envy greed lust and hate

[AFK]

What I'm saying is that all you can be aware of is delusion. There is no form of awareness beyond this.

Maybe it's just semantics but this just doesn't jive with my system.  Sure, I am aware of delusions.  But I am also aware of things that I wouldn't define as delusions.  The love from my daughtert and wife.  Is that a delusion?  In some situations, perhaps it is.  My gut tells me though, that in my case, it is not. 

[P3nT4gR4m]

What I'm saying is that all you can be aware of is delusion. There is no form of awareness beyond this.

Maybe it's just semantics but this just doesn't jive with my system.  Sure, I am aware of delusions.  But I am also aware of things that I wouldn't define as delusions.  The love from my daughtert and wife.  Is that a delusion?  In some situations, perhaps it is.  My gut tells me though, that in my case, it is not. 

I'd say IMO it's all delusion. Love/hate hot/cold. Things you enjoy/things you dont even the enjoyment itself, all part of the delusion of self. But, whether the feelings are real or not, you still appear to feel them right? The subjective experience is undeniable. So what use is knowing it's all delusion? It helps you change the bits you don't like is all. Other than subjectively this makes no difference but if subjective is all that exists then it makes all the difference.

[LMNO]

Your solipsistic nihilism is showing, Silly.

[P3nT4gR4m]

Your solipsistic nihilism is showing, Silly.

Be wierd if it wasn't.

[AFK]

What I'm saying is that all you can be aware of is delusion. There is no form of awareness beyond this.

Maybe it's just semantics but this just doesn't jive with my system.  Sure, I am aware of delusions.  But I am also aware of things that I wouldn't define as delusions.  The love from my daughtert and wife.  Is that a delusion?  In some situations, perhaps it is.  My gut tells me though, that in my case, it is not. 

I'd say IMO it's all delusion. Love/hate hot/cold. Things you enjoy/things you dont even the enjoyment itself, all part of the delusion of self. But, whether the feelings are real or not, you still appear to feel them right? The subjective experience is undeniable. So what use is knowing it's all delusion? It helps you change the bits you don't like is all. Other than subjectively this makes no difference but if subjective is all that exists then it makes all the difference.

So if they are delusions then what is the reality?

[P3nT4gR4m]

What I'm saying is that all you can be aware of is delusion. There is no form of awareness beyond this.

Maybe it's just semantics but this just doesn't jive with my system.  Sure, I am aware of delusions.  But I am also aware of things that I wouldn't define as delusions.  The love from my daughtert and wife.  Is that a delusion?  In some situations, perhaps it is.  My gut tells me though, that in my case, it is not. 

I'd say IMO it's all delusion. Love/hate hot/cold. Things you enjoy/things you dont even the enjoyment itself, all part of the delusion of self. But, whether the feelings are real or not, you still appear to feel them right? The subjective experience is undeniable. So what use is knowing it's all delusion? It helps you change the bits you don't like is all. Other than subjectively this makes no difference but if subjective is all that exists then it makes all the difference.

So if they are delusions then what is the reality?

There probably is a reality, behind there somewhere. I suspect that if there is it's probably much simpler and a lot smaller than we'd expect. Regardless and to all intents and purposes it's something that doesn't exist as far as consciousness is concerned because you're never going to interact with it in any way other than the dream you are dreaming. Reality may well be up to a whole bunch of shit that doesn't relate to you personally but again, to all intents and purposes, it's only making your consciousness and it's delusional subjective interaction with 'perceived reality' happen.

Why is the notion of concrete reality/meaning/purpose, etc so important to people? I've noticed that lack of it seems to lead to despair. Christ knows I've been there myself. Personally I just like to find the whole deal amazing and hilarious. That's enough for me. God doesn't want me for a sunbeam, annubis ain't getting ready to weigh my heart against a feather, the meaning of life is null and void. Nothing exists and is all things. We know that tom and jerry are not real but we enjoy their antics regardless. That is the only sense of reality I need.

[LHX]

so you dont leave the possibility open for something concrete to appear?

that sounds a bit limiting, bro



just because you aint seen it yet or that all other theories fall short doesnt mean its not there




also - its important to people for 2 reasons:

some people have learned to be afraid of it, and have learned to base their lives around that fear

some people have learned that its nothing to be afraid of
BUT
have made the observation that the more familiar you are with 'it', the more free and powerful you become



and this is actually another example:
what is the difference between this discussion here and a Tom and Jerry cartoon?

clearly there is something 'more real' about this dialog than there is in a cartoon



or
you also type out full paragraphs discussing philosophy with the creators of Tom and Jerry as well?

[AFK]

Let's break it down this way:

World Peace = delusion 
Hot/Cold (to use one of Silly's examples) = concrete "reality"

Let's use history as the vehicle of examination.  History would suggest that World Peace is a delusion as it seems that in some corner of the world, throughout human history, there has been some degree of conflict.  If it wasn't all out war it certainly was diplomatic dislike and disdain. 

However, history would suggest to us that Hot/Cold are probably not delusions.  Why, because there have been enough instances of people being burning and freezing to death to suggest it is more than a mere delusion.  If it were mere delusion than the poor old lady that just went up in flames with her house here locally would probably be enjoying a lunch right now. 

[LHX]

its hard to say what is a delusion and what isnt when we are only dealing with such a small space of 'known' history

maybe if someone were to say that 'the world is at peace right now' it would be a delusion, but i am sure that there is some people who would be willing to argue that it is true


things that dont correspond to known laws of physics are delusions

everything else seems fair game