Yet another effort, gentleman, if we are to become Discordians!

[Cain]

When you come from the fringe, and enter an economic system, you bring some chaos, street smarts, wisdom or some kind of non-system thinking with you. And to a certain extent, this energy can help the system grow and evolve, and compete more efficiently.
-,ÄúHoward Campbell,Äù, Poker without Cards

Ideology tries to integrate even the most radical acts
- taken from a cartoon of the same title, by the SI

,ÄúWake up Neo, there is no counterculture,Äù
- James Curcio, Culture-hacking


So, I was reading on Sunday a lovely little article on some awfully designed website that the Israeli government are coming up with new theoretical models for their operations.  That in and of itself is not too worrying.  I try to steer away from the whole Israel-Palestine issue, mainly because I have no good reason to stick my arm into a hornets nest and wave it around.  However, the thing about Israel is while their recent military performance may have been poor, they do consider themselves under threat and so are always looking for an edge, especially a theoretical one for urban warfare.

However, when I see that they are using doctrines based on Deleuze, Debord, ,Äúpostmodern anarchists,Äù and ,Äúnomadic terrorists,Äù, I can't help but feel they are starting to make a move into our intellectual territory, coming towards the theories we ourselves use, the axioms we take for granted, but from totally the operate direction.  In short, the co-option of our ideas and strategies, for the most Greyfaced of purposes ,Äì to restore order, as quickly and as smoothly as possible.

We committed one of the two sins when it came to thinking about politics.  We knew they never meant well, but we had pretty much accepted they were stupid, too.  At least, stupid enough to not have learnt from people like us.  Yet, they have.  While this doctrine may not have spread yet, it soon will and it will catch on like wildfire, because its exactly what is needed for the current political climate. Debord's concepts in particular are worrying, as they are the basis for Hakim Bey's writing (probably lumped under one of the postmodern anarchists, I suspect, with Lyotard).  So, in other words, they're figuring out ways to deal with scale free networks, TAZ's, and swarming techniques that could conceivably be used to undermine, hollow out or collapse a state.  Principle ideas in subversion are being turned on their head in order to aid state power and given whose hands that currently resides in, I cannot trust their motives.

Clearly, this is a problem.

For too long, I feel, we have been content to rest on our laurels.  Discordianism has pretty much been at the centre of a lot of western agitation against the Powers That Be, if only indirectly.  RAW and Thornley, along with others, helped build up this mystical, near mythical ,Äúcounterculture,Äù in direct opposition to current one, where common wisdom was questioned and new (or old) radical theories were floated.  Again, with the early days of the internet, it was the Illuminatus! influenced hackers who were communicating on the BBS's.  A network of sorts was in place and ideas were encouraged and swapped, for the little good they have done to date.

Every time a subversive text has proved its worth, it has been co-opted at its moment of failure.  This is nothing new, of course, but it is worth noting.  And while in many cases, this was simply to ride out the effects of those who aimed at the removal of the current system, someone has been dangerously smart and has gone back to those ideas, not with plans to use them for the original intent, but to prevent against them.

And they have other advantages on us.  The texts we are talking about were mostly written in the late 70s, the 80s and the 90s.  In fact, the Israeli courses almost look like a who's who of subversive modern philosophers, from Derrida to Foucault.  Obviously not subversive enough, however.  They also have hundreds of ,Äúshadow institutes,Äù where the bright and the patriotic are being paid to study this and come up with novel solutions to the problems of the modern world, problems often based within theories expressed in those books.  Money, numbers and areas for practical trial runs.

The question of course is what is there to do about this?

Well, option one is to do nothing.  Fade into irrelevance.  Give up, admit we gave them a good run and go back to our television sets.  Not bloody likely, but possible.  Its disheartening when you realize the CoN is not only smart, its also very good at reversal, even of ideas of use to you.  There is also the rather vague hope that eventually the militaries infected with these ideas will become hotbeds of sedition and subversion, but I can't see it happening.

Secondly, we could go obscure.  Keep what we figure out away from the prying eyes of the various minions of Order and go with the idea that the unknown is what the CoN fears the most.  Of course, the problem then becomes obvious.  How do you go around attracting people to something so secretive?  More importantly, how do you stop it from becoming just another elitist social club, like the Freemasons or the OTO?

Then there is choice number three ,Äì throw the guides away.  Forget the entire counterculture movement, RAW, postmodernism, everything and go way out there, throwing out the rule book.  Off the beaten track, into totally new theories, regain the edge we lost and have some sort of advantage again.  While the soldier boys and tacticians keep their eyes on the now, we can concentrate on staying ahead of the curve.  Since we have few worries of failed careers for not obeying orders or thinking the wrong thoughts in this regard, as well as not being bound by a current, active threat, we can put one over on the monkeys who are starting to catch up.  Screw Crowley and Magick, memes and failed rebellions of the past.  The only thing we should be looking at these for is to see how they failed, not why they sorta, half worked.

Thats how I see the options before us today.  We can evolve and live up to our titles as neophiliacs, or we can stagnate and die.  As always, the choice is change or perish.

[cyberus]

This is awesomly awesome, Cain.  I'll post a more detailed reply later, after I have some time to roll this around in my head, but definitely one of the best things I have read in awhile!

[Cain]

Ta muchly.

Of course, I was only, in my usual way, trying to shake things up and destroy a couple more Discordian sacred cows in attempt to get some new stuff rolling, but if it works, it works.

[Random Probability]

While you were ranting there, an idea occurred to me regarding this whole sad state of affairs.  My mind went back into military mode and I saw the obvious advantages of co-opting subversive doctrine but then I looked beyond that.

Your opponent's defenses will always be optimized against the weapon he knows you have and, to a lesser degree, to the weapons he only thinks you may have.  In this line of reasoning, then, it becomes apparent that the prudent thing to do in order to amplify our meager forces is to put forth a doctrine for all to see which, when optimized against, leaves several fatal flaws in your opponents armour.  If done properly, these flaws should be recognized as acceptable from your opponent's defensive posture.

Naturally the converse is equally true.  For this I look no further than my childhood friend, Br'er Rabbit.  What we want is to let them convince themselves to attack a tar baby while simultaneously concluding that the worst thing they can do to us is toss us all into the briar patch.

So now I'm in search of a tar baby and a briar patch......

[Cain]

Heh, I knew there was another reason we kept you around.  Good thinking.

[The Littlest Ubermensch]

I say, fuck ideology. Don't write anything down for the fuckers to co opt. Everyone lose their damn mind, do whatever the hell they want, and smash every institution they're sick of! Yes it's extreme, yes it's impractical, yes it's down right stupid to act so extremely, but I'll be damned if there's another halfassed intellectual circlejerk that never gets fucking anywhere! Look at what they're doing! Walmart's got secret police, the powers that be are creating a permanent underclass of anyone who's not them, and capitalism has become a sort of warped oligarchy! Don't you think that's fucking extreme? So how the fuck is going half way going to fix anything? Don't just make a TAZ, be a TAZ! Destroy the boring! Don't just sit in a fucking lotus position begging for enlightenment to come! Remember why you're alive and fuck some shit up! You may say it'll run out of steam, but not if we get it big enough to be self sustaining! Make it about youth culture! Give the kids something that keeps them from being the worst horror of them all, bored! The kids have the energy, and shit, look at the statistics, they're pouring more energy into volunteerism and their school life than ever before! The time is right to harness the power that is the young, and unleash hell!

[Thurnez Isa]

ohhhh oohhhh
awesome rant...
....
ill have to post more.... hopefully tommorrow after work tommorrow morning though...

[East Coast Hustle]

you missed the fourth (and most obvious) option.

ECH,
applying for a job with the Israeli Government

[P3nT4gR4m]

How about we give them an obvious threat with no obvious target?

I'm not talking Israel specifically, I mean 'them' in general.

But let's consider the Jewish situation. Right now the threat comes from palestine. That's a place. They can, quite easily, locate and strike against that place in retaliation for actions perpetrated against themselves. Now consider teh 'nation' of islam - the idea that they are not bounded by geographic region strikes me as one which has potential.

Nation of Discordia anyone?   

[LMNO]

While you were ranting there, an idea occurred to me regarding this whole sad state of affairs.  My mind went back into military mode and I saw the obvious advantages of co-opting subversive doctrine but then I looked beyond that.

Your opponent's defenses will always be optimized against the weapon he knows you have and, to a lesser degree, to the weapons he only thinks you may have.  In this line of reasoning, then, it becomes apparent that the prudent thing to do in order to amplify our meager forces is to put forth a doctrine for all to see which, when optimized against, leaves several fatal flaws in your opponents armour.  If done properly, these flaws should be recognized as acceptable from your opponent's defensive posture.

Naturally the converse is equally true.  For this I look no further than my childhood friend, Br'er Rabbit.  What we want is to let them convince themselves to attack a tar baby while simultaneously concluding that the worst thing they can do to us is toss us all into the briar patch.

So now I'm in search of a tar baby and a briar patch......

Good idea.


I'll put this all in the mind-pot and bring it to a boil...  We'll see if it makes soup.

[Adjective Noun]

A threat with no obvious target? The USA got to that one long before you ... say it with CNN, now - TERRARISTS!
Yeah, I finally stopped just reading to post. Hey, and all that

[cyberus]

I think all these ideas need to be mushed together.  Here's my best effort, after reading the replies chronologically.

While risking the perils of a sort of 'secret society',  we need to take a step back, out of the light and into the shadows.  Almost taking on a form of greyfaced hierarchy, those in the shadows devise the phony doctrines and ideas, and disseminate them into the proper hotbeds (myspace loldiscordians maybe?), give it to the kids.  LHX and ECH can write 'counter-culture' lyrics and anonymously send them to eminem and young jeezy.  Get something with enough momentum, especially after the CoN has shifted it's defenses, and there will be a snap back to their old memes, reflexes kicking in, they can't fight two things at once.  At least not two things so diametrically opposed.  They'll have to choose, and the choice will hinge on which presents a greater threat.  After the smoke clears, we can emerge from the shadows.

[East Coast Hustle]

OK, but I ain't sending SHIT to Em or Jeezy.

ECH,
copyrights all his lyrics BEFORE he lets you pirates see them

[Cramulus]

I vote for option three, with the caveat that it's not necessary to destroy everything we have in order to build anew. We can evolve without starting from scratch. That shared history, those tired old memes, those ancient in-jokes, they're part of us and our tumultuous identity.

Yeah, we're gonna have to grow up past the 60s, past the PD, past Wilson, past the Black Iron Prison eventually, but I'm gonna keep my feet planted right here - worshiping Eris.


Call me crazy, but I want to see a popular Discordia. I want it to be a choice that average shmuck's actually heard of. And when it gets all full and sick with bobbies I'll be the first one to assassinate the polyfather, but right now we're so far out on the lunatic fringe you only meet other Discordians at crazy pagan festivals and that's neither my venue nor my type.

Cause I do think Discordia has something to offer to today's youth. There's a growing culture of bored, apathetic, restless kids who are fascinated by rebellion but don't know how or why, they just keep ducking and covering behind rebel memes like fashion and "counterculture", whatever that is.

[AFK]

I vote for option three, with the caveat that it's not necessary to destroy everything we have in order to build anew. We can evolve without starting from scratch. That shared history, those tired old memes, those ancient in-jokes, they're part of us and our tumultuous identity.

Yeah, we're gonna have to grow up past the 60s, past the PD, past Wilson, past the Black Iron Prison eventually, but I'm gonna keep my feet planted right here - worshiping Eris.


Call me crazy, but I want to see a popular Discordia. I want it to be a choice that average shmuck's actually heard of. And when it gets all full and sick with bobbies I'll be the first one to assassinate the polyfather, but right now we're so far out on the lunatic fringe you only meet other Discordians at crazy pagan festivals and that's neither my venue nor my type.

Cause I do think Discordia has something to offer to today's youth. There's a growing culture of bored, apathetic, restless kids who are fascinated by rebellion but don't know how or why, they just keep ducking and covering behind rebel memes like fashion and "counterculture", whatever that is.

It has something to offer, true.  The key is packaging.  I think the basic concepts would be very appealing to a young person, especially one who's feeling he/she's losing their way, or drowning in their community or society.  At the same time, a kid isn't going to want to look too geeky, thus the packaging comment.  Kids still want to impress other kids, especially the opposite gender.  Kind of hard to do if you are seen as the Wizard of Wierd.