Pathways: An open-source study and exploration. (Paths and Shrapnel)

[Payne]

Again, working with scientific truisms, light is both a particle and a wave.



Shrapnel can be described as a momentary event, little pieces that fly into you, into your path, dictating to some extent what route you take through life. In the same way that you will be knocked off course if a ball hits when riding your bike. You may stay upright, continue your momentum, but it will still affect the direction you are going in.

Some impacts are harder than others, and will affect you more, some are entirely welcome, and will make you "stronger"

Sometimes, the effect of Shrapnel will be longer lasting (acting not as a 'particle' but as a 'wave' [not literally, just in the difference in two different properties displayed by one phenomenon]) it will entangle you in longer term effects lasting far beyond it's initial impact.

This could possibly be described in terms of a close relationship with someone. If a friend hit's you, it can be forgotten fairly quickly, if your spouse hits you, it can have far longer lasting repercussions. This can be attributed to the closeness of your relationship (your proximity to the origin of the shrapnel) or it could also be attributed to your own perception of the impact.

If you are affected in this way by enough of these impacts, you can find yourself tied up in knots. The effect is more than the sum of the impacts. Again, this can sometimes be a good thing, Replace the violence above with a softer example, perhaps an unexpected marriage proposal, and you may find yourself in an intensely close and rewarding relationship.

The language of this is not the important thing, it's the concept of varying degrees of impact, and of varying terms of effect.

[Payne]

Re: The centralised locus of explosion problems.

I think D Cups concept of ripples is possibly the best so far, but to make the most of it, you have to get fairly complex.

The only real example I can think of off the top of my head where things are flying around in different vectors and bouncing off eachother is in Brownian Motion. This gives you the idea of non-centralised movement of a great many things.

Re: Whether everthing is shrapnel.

So far, I would have to say yes, It's identifying it though, what can use, what should we avoid, what should we accept as neutral and inevitable?

Re: The origins of shrapnel (do we generate our own)

Of course we do! Thats why we have such a ready supply of tools at our disposal that we don't really understand, and hence why I'm quite enthusiastic for this.


For all of the above, I was discussing this with 000 earlier in IRC, and used a couple of his concepts in the above post. I think starting with "shrapnel" is a good idea, start small and work up.

[AFK]

Boy, and then it gets really hard to explain to others.  Maybe we need to stick with BIP afterall.   

Anyhoo, I gotta venture outdoors.  I'll mull this over some more and post my posits as they become available. 

[B_M_W]

clarify:

so basically the 'shrapnel' model posits that we're under constant bombardment by shrapnel - bits of meaning and symbols exploded from other nearby points (such as religion, the media, all those things on your diagram). Exposure to these bits causes our path to change - sometimes towards it, sometimes away from it. We too are in a constant state of explosion, projecting shrapnel into others paths


is that what you're going for, Rev?

If shrapnel = memes, then I'm on board.

[Payne]

clarify:

so basically the 'shrapnel' model posits that we're under constant bombardment by shrapnel - bits of meaning and symbols exploded from other nearby points (such as religion, the media, all those things on your diagram). Exposure to these bits causes our path to change - sometimes towards it, sometimes away from it. We too are in a constant state of explosion, projecting shrapnel into others paths


is that what you're going for, Rev?

If shrapnel = memes, then I'm on board.

Holla BMW, as you may be able to tell, I'm STILL riffing off the Physics/Philosophy thing ( I do never learn my lesson) anything you pick up on that I've screwed up Physics wise, please tell me!

This goes to anyone else versed in science also.

[tyrannosaurus vex]

If not "Shrapnel," then:

Experience Radiation?
Point-B Lazors?
Deflection Interference? (+5 for sounding scientific)

[Payne]

If not "Shrapnel," then:

Experience Radiation?
Point-B Lazors?
Deflection Interference? (+5 for sounding scientific)

Remember if you go over 21 points, you're busted...

None of those metaphors really stick for me though. Shrapnel will have to do until we have a more complete idea of this, and someone comes up with a clever, witty, creative alternative.

[LMNO]

I think we need to dig up the point of origin on this metaphor.  I seem to remember an LHX thread where RWHN first laned on the idea.  It might help.

[tyrannosaurus vex]

If not "Shrapnel," then:

Experience Radiation?
Point-B Lazors?
Deflection Interference? (+5 for sounding scientific)

Remember if you go over 21 points, you're busted...

None of those metaphors really stick for me though. Shrapnel will have to do until we have a more complete idea of this, and someone comes up with a clever, witty, creative alternative.

PAYNE: ALWAYS NAYSAYING.

srsly tho: i agree with you.

[Payne]

If not "Shrapnel," then:

Experience Radiation?
Point-B Lazors?
Deflection Interference? (+5 for sounding scientific)

Remember if you go over 21 points, you're busted...

None of those metaphors really stick for me though. Shrapnel will have to do until we have a more complete idea of this, and someone comes up with a clever, witty, creative alternative.

PAYNE: ALWAYS TOOLBOXING!

srsly tho: i agree with you.

Fixx0red. But yeah, it's not so much naysaying, as you appreciate. Just I have put a bit of work into this previously. It's MAH BABY MISTAH!


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[Bebek Sincap Ratatosk]

I think shrapnel is a pretty good metaphor, except perhaps it's linear feel. That is, the shrapnel, sort of happens AT us from time period X to time period X+"time till shrapnel hits us". Yet, our experiences seem to be more interactive, I think. That is we affect our surrounding which in turn effects us (maybe like us stepping on an IED), however, that effect then becomes causes for further effects... almost like a room full of set mouse traps. Once you throw the ping pong ball in... everything goes nuts. I think RAW worded it as "interacting processes non-simultaneously apprehended" or a "causal feedback loop".

That seems to be the only real nit I can pick... nice metaphor!

[AFK]

I think we need to dig up the point of origin on this metaphor.  I seem to remember an LHX thread where RWHN first laned on the idea.  It might help.

Yeah, LHX talked about "shrapnel" first.  Hopefully he'll come by this thread and remember where it first came up.  

[Payne]

I think we need to dig up the point of origin on this metaphor.  I seem to remember an LHX thread where RWHN first laned on the idea.  It might help.

Yeah, LHX talked about "shrapnel" first.  Hopefully he'll come by this thread and remember where it first came up.  

If I catch him in IRC, I'll be sure to ask him.

I took a look earlier, but I couldn't find it, except in the BIP: renaming thread.

[AFK]

I think shrapnel is a pretty good metaphor, except perhaps it's linear feel. That is, the shrapnel, sort of happens AT us from time period X to time period X+"time till shrapnel hits us". Yet, our experiences seem to be more interactive, I think. That is we affect our surrounding which in turn effects us (maybe like us stepping on an IED), however, that effect then becomes causes for further effects... almost like a room full of set mouse traps. Once you throw the ping pong ball in... everything goes nuts. I think RAW worded it as "interacting processes non-simultaneously apprehended" or a "causal feedback loop".

That seems to be the only real nit I can pick... nice metaphor!

Well, the way I see it, while Shrapnel is coming at us from others and other things, we too are also creating or are part of creating the shrapnel for others.  A teacher is a good example.  The teacher him or herself has Shrapnel coming at him in his home life and professional life.  But, as a teacher, he is part of the education system which is exerting influence over children.  So yeah, it definitely is a give and take system.  

Why I think this metaphor is useful, and this is something I'll get to in my further chapters, is that being able to identify individual bits of shrapnel, and documenting their effects, can help one look at ways to target those influences that cause bad situations for people and society.  This kind of gets into the syndemics stuff I posted awhile back.  Because it is clear that multiple afflictions, whether on a personal or societal level, can be tied into common denominators.  But, I'm getting ahead of myself.  

[Payne]

I think shrapnel is a pretty good metaphor, except perhaps it's linear feel. That is, the shrapnel, sort of happens AT us from time period X to time period X+"time till shrapnel hits us". Yet, our experiences seem to be more interactive, I think. That is we affect our surrounding which in turn effects us (maybe like us stepping on an IED), however, that effect then becomes causes for further effects... almost like a room full of set mouse traps. Once you throw the ping pong ball in... everything goes nuts. I think RAW worded it as "interacting processes non-simultaneously apprehended" or a "causal feedback loop".

That seems to be the only real nit I can pick... nice metaphor!

Well, the way I see it, while Shrapnel is coming at us from others and other things, we too are also creating or are part of creating the shrapnel for others.  A teacher is a good example.  The teacher him or herself has Shrapnel coming at him in his home life and professional life.  But, as a teacher, he is part of the education system which is exerting influence over children.  So yeah, it definitely is a give and take system.  

Why I think this metaphor is useful, and this is something I'll get to in my further chapters, is that being able to identify individual bits of shrapnel, and documenting their effects, can help one look at ways to target those influences that cause bad situations for people and society.  This kind of gets into the syndemics stuff I posted awhile back.  Because it is clear that multiple afflictions, whether on a personal or societal level, can be tied into common denominators.  But, I'm getting ahead of myself.  

Maybe we should compare notes?