Where did all the militias go?

[Golden Applesauce]

innocent question

isn't it a testament to the utter stupidity and shortsightedness of people who can see the looming disaster on the horizon, that they/we are not preparing (or even talking about preparing) an independent infrastructure/economy for distributing the goods, services and information that will be critical for maintaining any kind of survival (let alone resistance) when the shit really hits the fan?

The Rapture is their exit strategy.

Oh.  I thought they were just planning on shooting people and taking their stuff.

[Cainad (dec.)]

innocent question

isn't it a testament to the utter stupidity and shortsightedness of people who can see the looming disaster on the horizon, that they/we are not preparing (or even talking about preparing) an independent infrastructure/economy for distributing the goods, services and information that will be critical for maintaining any kind of survival (let alone resistance) when the shit really hits the fan?

The Rapture is their exit strategy.

Oh.  I thought they were just planning on shooting people and taking their stuff.

That's how they have fun, and it's also the backup strategy. If the Apocalypse doesn't happen, then at least they'll have horked a bunch of cool stuff.

[Verbal Mike]

I dunno vex, I try to be cautious about that kind of thought (though it comes to mind often. I'm paranoid.) It seems to me there are lots of people erroneously believing apocalypse is coming at any given point in history... What if this, like everything else, will blow over? What if we're all wrong about this? What if the next prez rolls things back?
But then, I don't live in the States... For once, the USA is out-fascisming Germany.

[Cain]

I didn't start being politically conscious until the Bush/Kerry '04 and a little later, so my experience with these militia groups has been limited to wow, those guys at Waco were morons alright, but don't you think that was kind of extreme for tax evasion?

Yes, of course.  I don't think people should be burnt in their homes alive in almost any circumstance (except Billy Ray Cyrus).

Also I would say that Waco was an early and exceptional manifestation.  The later ones included the above named groups such as the Montana Freemen and the Michigan Militia.  For the most part, they curried a level of support that Koresh, with his particular brand of Christianity, could not.

And yes, the worrying thing is that that martial mentality has been normalized.  I see my friends joining Facebook groups like "If you're not behind our troops, feel free to stand in front of them" and think where have I seen this before?  Oh yeah, Cain's big list of fascist memes - pacifism = aiding and abetting the enemy.  OFUK.

Pretty much, yeah.  Ours aren't quite as bad....yet.  I do know for a fact that certain far-right groups organize the spamming of large UK messageboards (such as the BBC's Have Your Say and Daily Mail comment pages) in a similar attempt to infect mainstream discourse with their memes.  It doesn't seem to have carried over, politically, but our elections are oddly timed to say the best.

[Cain]

innocent question

isn't it a testament to the utter stupidity and shortsightedness of people who can see the looming disaster on the horizon, that they/we are not preparing (or even talking about preparing) an independent infrastructure/economy for distributing the goods, services and information that will be critical for maintaining any kind of survival (let alone resistance) when the shit really hits the fan?

Wouldn't matter.  Most of these groups rely on right-wing financiers to keep their groups together, for all their vaunted talk of spiritual (or even racial) brotherhood.  When the shit hits the fan, assuming these guys aren't the ones throwing the shit in the first place, they will break down real fast without that cash flow to appease their more predatory members, who might seize such a chance to attempt a takeover.

In reality, if things get really bad, I would look for two places as mutual support networks: extended families and churches.  They're about the most organic social groupings that exist, and the ones most likely to work together without the benefit of profit.  Very few militias are based around organized churches or coherent belief systems, and a crisis that they didn't instigate would likely exacerbate those differences.

[Golden Applesauce]

Organized religion starts looking a lot more attractive when it's the only source of organization.

[Cain]

True.

I'd be looking to profit from the chaos somehow, myself.  Both churches and families tend to have strict norms about undertaking certain activities which profiteering does not, and yet sometimes they need certain things that are otherwise unattainable.  If America was to go down the shitter, I'd be keeping an eye on the world situation.  If the EU, China, Russia etc (even Canada, maybe) all manage to keep their head above water, somehow, in such a situation, the person with access to resources from those places would be in a very strong position.

[Random Probability]

True.

I'd be looking to profit from the chaos somehow, myself.  Both churches and families tend to have strict norms about undertaking certain activities which profiteering does not, and yet sometimes they need certain things that are otherwise unattainable.  If America was to go down the shitter, I'd be keeping an eye on the world situation.  If the EU, China, Russia etc (even Canada, maybe) all manage to keep their head above water, somehow, in such a situation, the person with access to resources from those places would be in a very strong position.

I'm not entirely convinced that any one country (at least the major players) could survive the total meltdown of any other major player.  The move towards gobalization in the '90s has inextricably tied the economies of every western country together as is being demonstrated by the American made "mortgage crisis".  If America went tits up, the capital as well as the credit supporting pretty much everything would belly up with it.

But then again, I've always said:  "The dark ages are only a light switch away..."

[Jenne]

I have been wondering about this for some time, so thank you for writing about this, Cain.

Also, MP, you stated very well exactly the way I see the US going down the tubes.  If we go, we take a shitload of fuckers with us.  But diversifying interests seems a best-laid plan yet.

[Adios]

I have been wondering about this for some time, so thank you for writing about this, Cain.

Also, MP, you stated very well exactly the way I see the US has gone down the tubes.  If we go, we take a load of shitfuckers with us.  But diversifying interests seems a best-laid plan yet.

FIXXORED FOR LULZ.

[Cain]

True.

I'd be looking to profit from the chaos somehow, myself.  Both churches and families tend to have strict norms about undertaking certain activities which profiteering does not, and yet sometimes they need certain things that are otherwise unattainable.  If America was to go down the shitter, I'd be keeping an eye on the world situation.  If the EU, China, Russia etc (even Canada, maybe) all manage to keep their head above water, somehow, in such a situation, the person with access to resources from those places would be in a very strong position.

I'm not entirely convinced that any one country (at least the major players) could survive the total meltdown of any other major player.  The move towards gobalization in the '90s has inextricably tied the economies of every western country together as is being demonstrated by the American made "mortgage crisis".  If America went tits up, the capital as well as the credit supporting pretty much everything would belly up with it.

But then again, I've always said:  "The dark ages are only a light switch away..."

True.  At the moment I would say it is very unlikely.  But the Chinese in particular have often worried about their exposed economic flank and ability to handle shocks and I think both Russia and China may try, in various ways, to restructure their economy to take benefit of globalization while at the same time staving off negative world effects.

I'm not sure its even possible, but if it is, I would put (likely soon worthless) money on those two nations figuring it out.  And if not, they may invest in such a way that the chance is that they will be the ones to restructure themselves most quickly following any given disaster.  Cultural/ethnic homogenity and a history of powerful leaders taking charge after a quasi-Warring States period may come in useful here.