Political Steam Blowing

[(Shush!)]

Some americans are notoriously touchy about race while seeming to believe that they are the model of an integrated society, but maybe they'll vote for Obama cos he's not 100% black.  A completely black person wouldn't have a chance.

[Requia ☣]

I don't think race actually affects his chances.  Yes there are a lot of racist fucks out there (and the racists are of every color), but the white racist fucks will vote against him cause he's black, and the black/hispanic racist fucks will vote for him cause he's not 100% white.  The data from the primaries supports this too, Where Obama would get something along the lines of a 50% of the white vote, 60% of the black, or 40% of the white vote, and 70% of the black.

[The Good Reverend Roger]

Some americans are notoriously touchy about race while seeming to believe that they are the model of an integrated society, but maybe they'll vote for Obama cos he's not 100% black.  A completely black person wouldn't have a chance.

Define "completely black", please.  And then tell me how many "completely black" people are born in America every year.

[(Shush!)]

I take your point Sir, the word 'completely' was badly chosen.  Still, I'm sure you are bright enough to get my drift.  So, shall we say for the sake of this clarification,

'Completely black' =  'Looks as dark as a particularly dark Nigerian native - you know, the one who all his friends say - wow, you're very dark'.   

      As opposed to = 'Looks lighter skinned than some of my (completely!) white friends in the summer'.

e.g. If he Looked as dark as a particularly dark Nigerian native - you know, the one who all Nigerian his friends say - wow, you're very dark, he wouldn't stand a chance.

(It is possible that my point of view is incorrect - it has happened before when I've stated things that I have no business forming an opinion of due to a startling lack of even rudimentary knowledge and a shamefully narrow world view.)

[Cain]

I suspect it honestly doesn't matter.

As Mangrove pointed out a long time ago, its not like the racist rednecks are not going to go "hey, this fella is half-white, lets treat him with respect now".  In fact, they've been trying to use his whiteness as a reason as to why blacks should not vote for him, while at the same time putting out propaganda that he is a black supremacist.

Plus among similar parts of the population, mixed-race kids are just "as bad" as blacks.  Its the old purity deal - "white is teh bestest so even a drop of black blood dilutes teh superior Aryan/Anglo-Saxon race".

tl;dr, people who base their vote on identity politics are stupid.

[(Shush!)]

You are probably right about it not mattering.  I do think the rednecks will be less scared than if he was of totally black ancestry.  But as you say, they won't vote for him either way.  I suspect that opinion polls will be skewed toward Obama, giving him an inflated illusion of his popularity as  a proportion of the guilty white folk would like to think they don't care about race but when the time comes to actually cast their vote, the animal instinct to choose your own group will kick in and they'll pick the Really White Man.  [I am almost certainly wrong]   

I don't really think it matters who wins as far as the politics go.  But I enjoy racists (amongst others) being uncomfortable
- So VOTE FOR OBAMA 2008!

(I'm gonna shut up now cos I'm boring myself)

[The Good Reverend Roger]

e.g. If he Looked as dark as a particularly dark Nigerian native - you know, the one who all Nigerian his friends say - wow, you're very dark, he wouldn't stand a chance.

Um, yeah.  Your evidence supporting this little factoid?

[tyrannosaurus vex]

having a last name like "Obama," which sounds distinctly African, pretty much evens out any deficiency of melanin in his skin for people who might tend to see it that way. Throw in a middle name like Hussein, and your argument should be altogether moot. Being that it's America, the modern-day home of two-faced hypocritical altruism, his chances are low enough anyway without even getting into how Black he is.

But if Obama gets elected this year, I may have to reconsider my current opinion of how thoroughly misguided the American public is on the issue of race.

[Cain]

I wouldn't.

As some people are wont to point out, certain people will feel that electing Obama will be doing "their thing" to help fight racism, which is complete and utter rubbish.  Or they'll point to Obama as an example of how there is no longer any institutional or systemic racism within American society any more.  In short, he may make the problem worse by allowing people to deny there is racism going on, by pointing to a single individual who managed to avoid or overcome the problems many others still face. 

Using an individual event to apply to the whole is falling into the inductive logic fallacy.  While no doubt Obama as President would probably take a keen interest in problems of racism and discrimination, thats a policy issue unrelated to his skin colour.

[tyrannosaurus vex]

if he took too active a stance against racism, he could easily painted as a crusader against white people, too.

i don't think electing obama would immediately remove racism as a factor in american society, but it could point to the fact that race is no longer the ultimate issue for many people -- that there are people who, while maintaining racist views, are able to see that the issue of race is of a lower priority than other societal problems like the economy, the war, etc.

but my assumption for now is still that there are some lines Americans won't cross under any circumstances, race being one of them.

[Cain]

True, all good and valid points.  Its certainly less of an issue, and I would say doing things like ending the war and getting the Repubs out, full stop, are more important than worrying about those things at the moment.  I'm just thinking hypothetically, to the future, and basing it on my knowledge of the innate smarminess and complete lack of original thought that the commentariat have.

[Requia ☣]

It occurs to me that whatever Obama's race is, his background isolated him from the problems most black people face, he spent much of his childhood out of the country, avoiding the crap schools some poorer areas in the US have, and since his black parent was an immigrant, instead of a decendant of some poor smuck who died in a coton field, he dodged the cycle of poverty that legacy racism (basically, even if a black man/woman somehow goes their whole life without ever being discriminated against, they have a shit starting position because their parents, neighborhoods, schools, etc, all most definately used to be be discriminated against in the past) causes for most of the black population.

[(Shush!)]

TGRR, I apologise.  It seems you have an issue with my opinion, i can only prostrate myself at your feet and beg for mercy.  Maybe your 1 of the touchy americans i mentioned or maybe its something else, i don't know where you live.  I have no proof for any of my opinions, the things i can prove are what i like to call facts. I AM SO IMPRESSED WITH YOU - WILL YOU BE MY FRIEND.

[tyrannosaurus vex]

TGRR, I apologise.  It seems you have an issue with my opinion, i can only prostrate myself at your feet and beg for mercy.  Maybe your 1 of the touchy americans i mentioned or maybe its something else, i don't know where you live.  I have no proof for any of my opinions, the things i can prove are what i like to call facts. I AM SO IMPRESSED WITH YOU - WILL YOU BE MY FRIEND.

Compared with the other 500 people I've seen try to tell Roger off, this rates about a 1.5 out of 10.

[The Good Reverend Roger]

TGRR, I apologise.  It seems you have an issue with my opinion, i can only prostrate myself at your feet and beg for mercy.  Maybe your 1 of the touchy americans i mentioned or maybe its something else, i don't know where you live.  I have no proof for any of my opinions, the things i can prove are what i like to call facts. I AM SO IMPRESSED WITH YOU - WILL YOU BE MY FRIEND.

Whatever, alt.   

TGRR,
Has seen it all before.