What do you REALLY believe?

[Bebek Sincap Ratatosk]

Jesus was the waiter
at a little Tex-Mex diner
When it came to bringing water
there was never someone finer

He fed multitudes of people
with fish as taco filling
When a customer was poor
he would pray and split the billing.

Jesus was an artist
painting pictures from his head
Not with oils, inks or brushes
but with fingerpaints instead

His "Portrait of Myself"
was what really made him proud.
But when someone bought it
they renamed it "The Shroud".

Jesus was a Hippie,
with his every brain cell fried
when cops caught him a-dealing
they say he was crucified.

He spent 3 days in lockup
spent 3 nights as well
and when he finally got out
he said he survived hell!

People say all kinds of stuff
about Jesus' life
Some say he was a hero,
some say he had a wife

Some say he's non-existent
some say he's God himselves,
I say he works at the liquor store
stocking wine upon the shelves!

[MMIX]

ewww auto-canniboozlism ITT

[Rococo Modem Basilisk]

My personal opinion is he either didn't exist or he was just some poor schmuck who held up a protest banner one day and was promptly beaten to death in the street by a centurion who wasn't in the mood for any nonsense that day. Then a whole bunch of bog standard, done to death, myth and legend was applied to him by the guys who put his dumb ass up to waving the banner in the first place. The jesus story, to the best of my knowledge does not contain a single original element.

I concur. Most of the extraordinary claims about Jesus were made before about other "Sons of Gods". The Theraputes, Mithras, etc etc

If Jesus was real, he was very unoriginal.

I totally agree, but Cain's post was offering a different interpretation on the stuff Jesus is supposed to have said,so it doesn't matter whether Jesus was
1] real
2] God's son
3] a saucy sailor
4] an alien plant OR
5] a fucking cabbage

Don't matter whether he lived or died, was a swinger or a celibate, screwed Mary Magdalen or screwed in a lightbulb, It really just does not matter

It matters absolutely to his followers. They know nothing of philosophy. Superhuman powers is the only language they understand.

Jesus = Gods son and magical superninja with recover from dead, walk on water and transmutation superpowers.

If jesus had not these powers and you could somehow prove it, irrefutably*, christianity would collapse.

Anything christ is reported to have said in the bible (other than thou shalt/shalt not) is filtered out by the believer. It's just a set up to a punchline which is always along the lines of "Then Jesus dids't wave his hands, all mystical and shit, and lo a bunny didst appear from the hat"

That's the only important bit - the magical powers. Without them jesus would have no authority, therefore the guys he left in charge would have no authority, therefore they would not obey their masters.

*irrefutable proof is impossible in this situation since christians are programmed to ignore both irrefutable proof and simple logic. It's like trying to force an amputee to shake your hand.

This is the correct donkey that has been tied up, which no one has ridden. 

As an ex fundie, I concur with P3Nt's view... if it became, somehow, irrefutably obvious that the scriptures were in ANY WAY errant, it would destroy a number of different faiths (assuming we could get past their cognitive dissonance). For example, Jesus performed miracles for two reasons: First, and most important it showed that God was with Jesus, much like Moses coming to the Israelites after seeing the Bush. YHVH gave Moses magic powers to give himself leprosy and turn his walking stick into a snake. All of this was to provide direct evidence that this WAS God's representative on Earth. Secondly, Jesus whole life had to be a fulfillment of numerous 'prophecies' (or at least what later Church Fathers deemed to be prophecies) to prove that he was the Messiah.

Further, most Fundies hold the scripture in Peter sacrosanct: All Scripture Is Inspired of God and Beneficial for Teaching, Reproving, Setting Things Straight.. etc etc. I didn't quote it precisely. Anyway, this means that ANY 'error', exaggeration, hyperbole or tall tale in the Bible would mean either ALL SCRIPTURES are not inspired, or occasionally God inspired fiction, neither option would be acceptable to most of the believers. 

If it ever became 100% evident that Jesus was just a man, even just a man with good ideas... then Christianity as we know it would probably collapse. Christianity, unlike Judaism is a transcendental system. The Christian suffers now, for Glory later. They have faith, an "assured expectation of the things hoped for, though not yet beheld" (according to Paul). Most Christian faiths hold that when you die you go to heaven (or hell). This is based on literal interpretations of passages in the Christian Greek Scriptures, particularly regarding Jesus. If those passages are fraudulent, or meant as metaphor, then the hope for everlasting life in the Kingdom of God is suddenly in question.

If you're a Christian that's deep in the metaphysics of your belief system, Jesus must be more than a man for another reason. He MUST have been a completely PERFECT man. See, Adam and Eve were perfect humans until they sinned. According to scripture "The wages of sin are death" thus Adam and Eve were imperfect and condemned to die. Since they were imperfect, they could no longer create perfect children... all humans then become imperfect and doomed to die. YHVH makes a way out though. The very first prophecy in the Bible sets the stage for the entire Jewish, Muslim and Christian belief system... everything else in the Bible is in support of this theme.

15 And I will put enmity
       between you and the woman,
       and between your offspring [a] and hers;
       he will crush your head,
       and you will strike his heel."

Now, the savvy Bible Student understands that the 'serpent' here was a puppet under the control of Satan. Therefore, God was promising that one of the offspring of the woman would bruise the serpent/Satan in the head (death blow) while the serpent would bruise him only in the heel (minor inconvenience). Now, this is where stuff gets really whacked out, but it still requires supermadjickal Jesus.

Adam was a perfect man and he failed to follow God perfectly. His sin therefore had to be balanced. The only way to pay back (cause God is the Cosmic Justice of the Peace...) the blood of a perfect man, is with the blood of a perfect man because a perfect man would be the only one whose blood isn't already condemned. Jesus, being born of a virgin through super magical YHVH sperm, creates just such a being. A man (offspring of woman) who is perfect (cause he came directly from God, without imperfect humans mucking about in Mary's uterus). He remained without sin for 33 years and then died. Death is the cost of sin, If Jesus didn't sin, then the blood shed was not payment for his sins. Instead it became repayment for Adam's sin. It balanced the cosmic scales and YHVH got a blood sacrifice cause he's a bastard.

Even without the resurrection, the above has to be true in most Christian belief systems. If Jesus were just a man, or just a prophet, then he was a sinful human... and therefore not a equal payment for Adam's sin... therefore all humans would be condemned to die.

Many Christian belief systems must have faith that Jesus was WAY MORE than just a man.

I get the impression that most christians don't overthink it this much. This is theology stuff. I think a lot of them boil it down to "I'm going to heaven because Jesus is the son of God and I like him".

[ñͤͣ̄ͦ̌̑͗͊͛͂͗ ̸̨̨̣̺̼̣̜͙͈͕̮̊̈́̈͂͛̽͊ͭ̓͆ͅé ̰̓̓́ͯ́́͞]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IETvxCQAa1M

[MMIX]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IETvxCQAa1M

not available in UK

[Iason Ouabache]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IETvxCQAa1M

not available in UK

Consider yourself lucky.

[Sheered Völva]

Ya, okay. What I meant was that I was the only one that went with the Christianity, Islam, Judaism option. 

That's okay.  You can be a follower of the Abrahamic God, AND a Discordian.  We won't kill you for it.

The other Abrahamic followers probably will, though.

There's actually a group called Discordians for Jesus. They see Jesus as an anti-establishment rebel who completely mindfucked people (just one example--telling his followers who were completely oppossed to cannibalism to eat his body and drink his blood).

I was recently honored with the rights to use an interview with one of the original Erisians who believes in Jesus. It wil appear in the Operation Mindfuck issue of Intermittens. So you aren't the only Discordian for Jesus.   

[The Wizard]

Cool.

[The Good Reverend Roger]

Cool.

I was totally kidding.  We're gonna persecute the fuck out of you.

[Telarus]

 

[Elezar th Apostate]

I dunno.  This talk about Jesus at a discordian site, it just kinda put me off my breakfast.  WWED?

Elezar the Apostate

[The Good Reverend Roger]

I dunno.  This talk about Jesus at a discordian site, it just kinda put me off my breakfast.  WWED?

Elezar the Apostate

It is my firm belief that Jesus was either trolling, or was the best PR man EVER.

[Rococo Modem Basilisk]

I think Paul did most of the PR work.

[The Wizard]

We're gonna persecute the fuck out of you.

Not to sound cocky, but bring it. My religion has much more experience at oppression that yours does. We'll Inquisition your ass.

[Cramulus]

lol - since I mentioned it,
we got a second christian vote

Cramulus is guessing some people like being contrary