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Do you believe in a soul?

Started by The Dark Monk, November 07, 2008, 01:51:39 AM

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Suu

Quote from: Payne on November 07, 2008, 01:47:43 PM
Y'all are making James Brown cry.

James Brown: Godfather of Soul, and general A Soul.





This is soul I can believe in.

Quote from: East Coast Hustle on November 07, 2008, 11:27:41 AM
Quote from: Kai on November 07, 2008, 05:29:56 AM
No. When we kick it, we go back to the earth. Thats the way it should be anyway.

THIS.

Are you saying this as reincarnation? Or that our bodies are biodegradable and become dirt? Because I believe in both.

Yes, fuck you all, I believe in reincarnation.
Sovereign Episkopos-Princess Kaousuu; Esq., Battle Nun, Bene Gesserit.
Our Lady of Perpetual Confusion; 1st Church of Discordia

"Add a dab of lavender to milk, leave town with an orange, and pretend you're laughing at it."

AFK

I don't believe in a soul as defined by Christianity and other religions.  I don't believe there is this apparition that will float up to the heavens after I draw my last breath.  However, it's hard to not consider that there is a little something more to us then an assembly of biological functions.  I have this central locus of awareness, a manifestation of me, RWHN, that seems like it is unique to me.  That there is something behind my eyes driving me to be me.  I guess I would tend to think of this as a kind of energy or something, but at death, I imagine it being an energy that dissipates, and sort of evaporates into the world after I'm dead.  Kind of like it's part of some cycle similar to a water cycle. 

Or maybe I'm just high on caffeine right now.   
Cynicism is a blank check for failure.

Dysfunctional Cunt

Quote from: Suu on November 07, 2008, 04:06:54 PM
Quote from: East Coast Hustle on November 07, 2008, 11:27:41 AM
Quote from: Kai on November 07, 2008, 05:29:56 AM
No. When we kick it, we go back to the earth. Thats the way it should be anyway.

THIS.

Are you saying this as reincarnation? Or that our bodies are biodegradable and become dirt? Because I believe in both.

Yes, fuck you all, I believe in reincarnation.

I believe in reincarnation myself.  Whether it is my soul, or higher conscious, or spirit, or some floaty ball that survives my death, I don't know, but I believe some "essence" of my"SELF" survives and gets to try to do it right the next time. 

My body however, will be burnt to ashes and flushed down the toilet because all drains lead to the ocean right?

AFK

Quote from: Payne on November 07, 2008, 01:47:43 PM
Y'all are making James Brown cry.

James Brown: Godfather of Soul, and general A Soul.







Cynicism is a blank check for failure.

Elder Iptuous

If the primary 'evidence' of a 'soul' is the experience of self consciousness, then what do we make of people that have memory problems?
I was hearing this story about a fellow who had a problem with his memory (i believe it was on a radiolabs show) such that he had a perpetual sense of novelty.  He woke up every morning believing that he was fresh out of the box, brand new, just created.  He was drawing breath for the very first time.  He was seeing everything for the very first time.  He even kept a journal explaining all this, and why every other entry before this last one was false, and that this day was truly his first.
It seems that continuity of memory is integral to the concept of self and soul.  It strikes me that people don't make as much of a fuss about whether they existed before they were born, but it is the same story.....  Just not as much to worry about because that discontinuity is crossed, and every thing's ok?

Bu🤠ns

Quote from: Khara on November 07, 2008, 04:25:20 PM
Quote from: Suu on November 07, 2008, 04:06:54 PM
Quote from: East Coast Hustle on November 07, 2008, 11:27:41 AM
Quote from: Kai on November 07, 2008, 05:29:56 AM
No. When we kick it, we go back to the earth. Thats the way it should be anyway.

THIS.

Are you saying this as reincarnation? Or that our bodies are biodegradable and become dirt? Because I believe in both.

Yes, fuck you all, I believe in reincarnation.

I believe in reincarnation myself.  Whether it is my soul, or higher conscious, or spirit, or some floaty ball that survives my death, I don't know, but I believe some "essence" of my"SELF" survives and gets to try to do it right the next time. 

My body however, will be burnt to ashes and flushed down the toilet because all drains lead to the ocean right?
reincarnation only makes sense if we're all one whole SELF.  that way when individuals die and individuals birth there is only one perpetuation. i'm not saying it's 'true' or that i believe this, but to say my 'individual' self is reborn is just idle speculation.

Bebek Sincap Ratatosk

So, since we haven't had any concrete definitions yet, I'll make some observations.

In the Bible, particularly the Hebrew Scriptures, the word used for soul is "Nephesh". The root word that this is based on means 'to breathe' and it's translated, based on context, to everything from a living human, to beast, fish, himself, herself, etc etc.

In the Hebrew Scriptures, the Soul requires 'breath', that is, Soul meant a living being, NOT a supernatural entity. Of Adam it says:

the LORD God formed the man from the dust of the ground and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life, and the man became a living being.

"living being" is the NIV translation of nephesh.

And the LORD God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living soul.

King James says 'soul'. Note however, that the 'breath of life' is what made the soul.

So, yes, I 'believe' (well as close as possible) that we are living, breathing beings.

There are many other religious belief systems that have promoted the idea of some never dying entity that modern monkeys all lump as 'soul'. I would note, for example that the Greek concept of soul had a lot of connotation tying to your consciousness ie. 'psyche' living on, rather than some Being of Light or Spiritual Entity. Plato, I think first argued for the soul being eternal... and even then it wasn't a 'spiritual energy' but an eternal being made up of the mind, emotions and desires... constantly re-inhabiting new physical bodies.

So I would guess that the soul in the sense of 'Nephesh' is true in some sense.

Soul in the Platonic sense, I doubt has much basis in reality.

I think the idea that we are 'spiritual energy' requires a specific model for the symbols 'spiritual' and 'energy' to have any value.

I think the idea that we 'live on' is true in some sense, but I think it may have more to do with the effects of our actions living on, rather than some ethereal entity.

However, I will admit that I have had experiences which cause me to consider that there might be something of us that gets recycled, I doubt that its more than our ingredients, but I'm open to the possibility that it may be. I personally would particularly enjoy the platonic kind of soul.


- I don't see race. I just see cars going around in a circle.

"Back in my day, crazy meant something. Now everyone is crazy" - Charlie Manson

Cain

So if I hold my breath, do I lose my soul?


Elder Iptuous

Quote from: Cain on November 07, 2008, 05:03:23 PM
So if I hold my breath, do I lose my soul?
only one way to find out.....

Bebek Sincap Ratatosk

Quote from: Cain on November 07, 2008, 05:03:23 PM
So if I hold my breath, do I lose my soul?

If you hold it until you die, then according to the ancient Hebrews, "yes".  (Or whatever 'Yes' is in ancient Hebrew)
- I don't see race. I just see cars going around in a circle.

"Back in my day, crazy meant something. Now everyone is crazy" - Charlie Manson

Bu🤠ns

i thought the Ruach was the 'breath' (divine breath, etc) and the nephesh was more akin to soul.

Bebek Sincap Ratatosk

Quote from: Burns on November 07, 2008, 05:12:40 PM
i thought the Ruach was the 'breath' (divine breath, etc) and the nephesh was more akin to soul.

Ruach is more like breath or divine breath, correct. Nephesh is the 'breathing, living being'. So the Ruach is what made Adam become Nephesh, rather than his initial state as a pile of mud.

And the LORD God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life (Ruach); and man became a living soul(Nephesh).

Ruach also references YHVH's creative activity... so its the tool or the power which creates everything in Gen 1 and 2... as ruach gives nephesh life, Ruach (when tied to Jove) gives the Universe life.
- I don't see race. I just see cars going around in a circle.

"Back in my day, crazy meant something. Now everyone is crazy" - Charlie Manson

Sir Squid Diddimus

Quote from: Risus on November 07, 2008, 08:37:58 AM
Quote from: Squiddy on November 07, 2008, 06:19:43 AM
I really don't want to believe in souls and ghosts and all that nonsense, but a couple friends of mine caught one on video.

They were playing around with a new camera in the winter park cemetery/golf course (that's how we roll here) and actually caught a thing with legs and all walking in front of their camera and had no idea at the time why the auto focus was going wonky till they got it home and played it back.

Assholes  :argh!:

The whole idea of it just sounds so stupid, till you see it. Then you're all weirded out.

Again, reminds me of JDatE.  Creepy shadow people.

Are you gonna find it for us?

I searched my hard drive for it last night but it must have gotten lost somewhere when my computer was worked on. I'll have Mr Squid look through my old hard drive (where it should be) and see if it's on there. Otherwise I might have to try to get it from my friend again, which would take a while.
It's definitely worth looking at though. Weird.
(and i hate it when my shit gets lost  :argh!: )

Suu

A member of my 501st Garrison is on the home team for TAPS, and Wheezy (Brian) from the actual Ghost Hunters show is an inactive member of the Legion as well.

The fucking stories I've heard.  :eek:
Sovereign Episkopos-Princess Kaousuu; Esq., Battle Nun, Bene Gesserit.
Our Lady of Perpetual Confusion; 1st Church of Discordia

"Add a dab of lavender to milk, leave town with an orange, and pretend you're laughing at it."