Your body

[Nast]

now i wonder.
will he take another 45 minutes to come up with some long winded retort that bores the shit out of me?

I made dinner and caught a cold in the time he took to write that. What a blowhard!

[Mesozoic Mister Nigel]

My entire defense of the alleged crime of engaging Cartesian duality is "Huh. That's not what I was going for".

Again, maybe you should have thought about it some more before ranting about it.  Then, perhaps, your rant wouldn't have come across as ignorant and vapid NOISE.

I was actually kind of trying to walk a middle line, which is what RA objected to because I wasn't dualist ENOUGH. But I was trying to keep it fairly neutral and mostly in the realm of first-person parable because the wherefores behind our existence is kind of irrelevant to my point, which was that gender, as a separate factor from biological sex, is a social construct, and kind of a limiting one.

Except the "wherefores behind our existence" are extremely relevant to your point.

That's the whole problem.  You hand wave off the "wherefores behind our existence" with some superstitious malarkey, which is the only way you can arrive at your point.

Bullshit, you incompetent sack of shit. I evaded that den of snakes in order to avoid instantly turning off anyone who happens to have some sort of mystical religious notions about our existence.

I don't think that gender can be separated from biological sex. I think gender is a function of biology, and that only the particulars of gender are socially constructed.

So do I, you reading-comprehension-impaired fuckwit. THAT'S THE WHOLE POINT OF THE ESSAY WHICH YOU DIDN'T BOTHER TO READ BECAUSE YOU WERE SO HUNG UP ON CARTESIAN DUALITY, which is apparently so great a bugaboo for you that it turns your brain off.

Bloody obvious social studies rambling

[Mesozoic Mister Nigel]

now i wonder.
will he take another 45 minutes to come up with some long winded retort that bores the shit out of me?

No doubt he'll be at it all night. I hereby dub him Jefe.

[Dead Kennedy]

So, what's your excuse for insulting everyone else on the board while you were at it?

I don't believe that ever happened.  I suspect you have misread something, or are simply a jackass who can't be bothered to limit yourself to truthful statements, and are thus demanding that I defend myself from a hyperbolic straw men.

[Mesozoic Mister Nigel]

So, what's your excuse for insulting everyone else on the board while you were at it?

I don't believe that ever happened.  I suspect you have misread something, or are simply a jackass who can't be bothered to limit yourself to truthful statements, and are thus demanding that I defend myself from a hyperbolic straw men.

I think it was somewhere around where you declared yourself to be the smartest guy in the room, Jefe, and expressed sorrow that this kind of shit is being written on a Discordian board.

[Sir Squid Diddimus]

i wouldn't be bothered by it Nigel.
it's obvious what's going on here.
notice the response time, what's said and how it doesn't always fit with the original point.

[ñͤͣ̄ͦ̌̑͗͊͛͂͗ ̸̨̨̣̺̼̣̜͙͈͕̮̊̈́̈͂͛̽͊ͭ̓͆ͅé ̰̓̓́ͯ́́͞]

My entire defense of the alleged crime of engaging Cartesian duality is "Huh. That's not what I was going for".

Again, maybe you should have thought about it some more before ranting about it.  Then, perhaps, your rant wouldn't have come across as ignorant and vapid NOISE.

I was actually kind of trying to walk a middle line, which is what RA objected to because I wasn't dualist ENOUGH. But I was trying to keep it fairly neutral and mostly in the realm of first-person parable because the wherefores behind our existence is kind of irrelevant to my point, which was that gender, as a separate factor from biological sex, is a social construct, and kind of a limiting one.

Except the "wherefores behind our existence" are extremely relevant to your point.

That's the whole problem.  You hand wave off the "wherefores behind our existence" with some superstitious malarkey, which is the only way you can arrive at your point.

I don't think that gender can be separated from biological sex.  I think gender is a function of biology, and that only the particulars of gender are socially constructed.

That is to say that I think the the idea "Pink is for girls, blue is for boys." is socially constructed, but that the need to gender things is innate to human existence.  In many ways I think gender is like language: Every culture has its own language, but every culture has a language and a society cannot function without a language.  Likewise, I don't think that a society can function without gender roles, and I think that the idea that gender is entirely socially constructed had caused incredible damage to modern society.  I think it's caused a huge portion of society to become postively neurotic about gender roles.

I don't think rants like yours help.  I think you are an agent of the endarkening, that you are helping to pull the wool over people's eyes, using bullshit superstitious arguments to justify nonsensical positions that make people go crazy -- both by embracing the nonsense, and by resisting the nonsense.

There are basically three groups of people in modern world:

 There are men who are comfortable being men, and women comfortable being women, and they make up the largest group.  The people in this group rarely think about gender, they simply go with the flow and embrace what society expects of them, staking out some amount of individuality in the undisputed middle grounds.  These are the people who accept that masculine does not have to mean macho superman, and the feminine doesn't have to mean submissive doormat.

 There are men uncomfortable being men, and women uncomfortable being women, who become neurotic travesties,focusing all of their energy on their gender. They cut themselves off from the first group by insisting that gender is "only" a social construct, and acting as if being social constructed means that it's not necessary.  They call themselves genderqueer or other silly labels, and they waste all their energy fighting gender to no effect.

 Finally there are men and women who are terrified by the lack of clear gender roles, and so they cling desperately to ever more neurotic and tyrannical definitions of gender.  They cannot go with the flow.  The men become macho blowhards, the women submissive doormats, and they go bugnuts crazy trying to impose gender certainity on society.

Look at what has happened in the last thirty years since feminists first started advancing this theory of socially constructed gender.  Has gender gone away?  No, quite the opposite!

A good friend of mine, Jackson Katz, directed a film about masculinity called Tough Guise (trailer) in which he shows some of the changing images of feminity and masculinity over the last several decades.

There are three sets of images that stand out.  The first compares images of professional wrestlers with images of professional models.  Over the last few decades wrestlers have gotten larger and larger, with ever more stereotypical masculine features,while professional models, who have become thinner, more waifish, more delicate, more stereotypically feminine.

Another set of images compares Star Wars figures from 1977 to figures from 1997.  Han Solo is the figure.  The 1977 Kenner Han Solo action figure has a realistic masculine build, just like Harrison Ford.  The 1997 Han Solo has ridiculously exaggerated muscles -- he's buff like a wrestler.  Han Solo, one of the most iconic male images of the 70's, is not masculine enough for the kids of 1997.

The final set of images compares male leading actors in crime thrillers.  First is the poster for the Maltese Falcon: doughy, flabby and jowly Humprey Bogart, with his kind face and big puppy dog eyes holding a small snub nosed revolver at his side.  Next up is Clint Eastwood in Dirty Harry, tougher,leaner, meaner, scowling, a huge pistol held menacingly in his hand. The last image shows Sly Stallone in Cobra, huge oiled muscles, shades to block his eyes from showing emotion, scowling and holding a fucking machine gun in one hand.

What's going on?  My theory is that by attacking gender, feminists have provoked a defensive reaction from society to circle the wagons around the concept of gender and defend it, strengthen it, allow no questioning of it.  By challenging gender's right to exist, we have only made the problems associated with gender worse.

I actually have read Judith Butler, so I know just how sketchy and fact-free the argument in support of the "gender is socially constructed" idea is.  I know why you had to handwave off the "wherefores behind our existence" to make your point: because being mindful of those wherefores seriously undermines and challenges the validity of your point.

What damage specifically has been caused by this war on gender?

Establish the causal connection of feminism to exaggerated gender roles.

If biology determines gender than how do you account for people who are intersex?
Should we just put them in the ovens?

[Mesozoic Mister Nigel]

i wouldn't be bothered by it Nigel.
it's obvious what's going on here.
notice the response time, what's said and how it doesn't always fit with the original point.

Also, that he's totally trolling.

For one thing, nobody who was sincere would continuously cite a bunch of philosophy wankers.

[Thurnez Isa]

now i wonder.
will he take another 45 minutes to come up with some long winded retort that bores the shit out of me?

No doubt he'll be at it all night. I hereby dub him Jefe.

DONT DOUBT HIS INTELLECTUAL PROWESS

[Sir Squid Diddimus]

now i wonder.
will he take another 45 minutes to come up with some long winded retort that bores the shit out of me?

No doubt he'll be at it all night. I hereby dub him Jefe.

DONT DOUBT HIS INTELLECTUAL PROWESS

[Thurnez Isa]

HEY WE ARE TALKING ABOUT THE PERSON WHO DEDUCED HOW THE NAZIS WERE THE "LAST" CULTURE TO GLORIFY VIOLENCE
SRSLY THEY WERE

[Bu🤠ns]

  @ this thread.

i'm still wondering if Cain had received a response yet.

[Dead Kennedy]

I think it was somewhere around where you declared yourself to be the smartest guy in the room, Jefe, and expressed sorrow that this kind of shit is being written on a Discordian board.

So, basically what you're saying is that I was right, and it did never happen?

It is my opinion that I am possibly the smartest person on this board based on a few days of participation.  The horde of morons cheering each other on for their pathetic embrace of antiintellectualism, this Cult of Lowered Expectations that seems to thrive here, only strengthens that perception.  That does quite possibly make me an arrogant ass, but -- and this is important -- my high opinion of myself does constitute an insult against you, or anyone else on this board.

If you are insulted that I think I'm quite possibly smarter than you, then you are merely insecure.  That's really not my problem.  If you want me to lie and say I think someone else is smarter than I am, then that's your problem and I am not obligated  to denigrate myself just to make you feel better about yourself.

Also, that I find it sad to see Discordianism -- a philosophy I associate with clear thinking, new model agnosticism, and other enlightened ideas -- embraced by a groupof people sohungry forendarkenment.

Do you know what endarkenment is?  That's from Robert Anton Wilson (or was it Leary?). It's the opposite of enlightenment.  It's what Republicans preach.  It's what you preach.  It's what everyone here who thinks that knowing what you're talking about is lame, who thinks that referencing philosophers undermines one's arguments, who thinks acting like a brain-dead fucking idiot is cool, is engaged in.  It's the glorification of being small-minded and afraid of things you don't understand. It's the need to be coddled even when you're being a fucking moron.  It's the inability to own your ignorance without feeling shame.

That's you.  You're the endarkened.  You're not the Legion of Dynamic Discord -- there's nothing dynamic about your discord, it's not intentional noise, you're all just being noisy because you're like monkeys in a cage.  You can't rise above your own crappulance, because you ask nothing from yourselves but permission to be useless twits.

Your King, Fred Mertz

[Thurnez Isa]

@ this thread.

i'm still wondering if Cain had received a response yet.

I could almost guarantee
he wont....

[Thurnez Isa]

I think it was somewhere around where you declared yourself to be the smartest guy in the room, Jefe, and expressed sorrow that this kind of shit is being written on a Discordian board.

So, basically what you're saying is that I was right, and it did never happen?

It is my opinion that I am possibly the smartest person on this board based on a few days of participation.  The horde of morons cheering each other on for their pathetic embrace of antiintellectualism, this Cult of Lowered Expectations that seems to thrive here, only strengthens that perception.  That does quite possibly make me an arrogant ass, but -- and this is important -- my high opinion of myself does constitute an insult against you, or anyone else on this board.

If you are insulted that I think I'm quite possibly smarter than you, then you are merely insecure.  That's really not my problem.  If you want me to lie and say I think someone else is smarter than I am, then that's your problem and I am not obligated  to denigrate myself just to make you feel better about yourself.

Also, that I find it sad to see Discordianism -- a philosophy I associate with clear thinking, new model agnosticism, and other enlightened ideas -- embraced by a groupof people sohungry forendarkenment.

Do you know what endarkenment is?  That's from Robert Anton Wilson (or was it Leary?). It's the opposite of enlightenment.  It's what Republicans preach.  It's what you preach.  It's what everyone here who thinks that knowing what you're talking about is lame, who thinks that referencing philosophers undermines one's arguments, who thinks acting like a brain-dead fucking idiot is cool, is engaged in.  It's the glorification of being small-minded and afraid of things you don't understand. It's the need to be coddled even when you're being a fucking moron.  It's the inability to own your ignorance without feeling shame.

That's you.  You're the endarkened.  You're not the Legion of Dynamic Discord -- there's nothing dynamic about your discord, it's not intentional noise, you're all just being noisy because you're like monkeys in a cage.  You can't rise above your own crappulance, because you ask nothing from yourselves but permission to be useless twits.

Your King, Fred Mertz

whats that
sorry
I fell asleep between responses