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Plus, I Got Religion

Started by Mesozoic Mister Nigel, March 08, 2009, 01:18:16 AM

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LMNO

#165
March 11, 2009, 07:06:24 PM
Yeah, I want to know what the cult was. 


Also, I think what most people mean when they say, "I know more about xtianity, etc" is that they know biblical texts better than some xtians they know.  Like the full context if Isaiah 14, and all that.

Mesozoic Mister Nigel

#166
March 11, 2009, 07:16:33 PM
Welcome, potato! I'm honored that my rant inspired your first post. Glad you're here, and I like your name.
"I'm guessing it was January 2007, a meeting in Bethesda, we got a bag of bees and just started smashing them on the desk," Charles Wick said. "It was very complicated."

Bebek Sincap Ratatosk

#167
March 11, 2009, 07:28:53 PM
Quote from: potato on March 11, 2009, 06:53:09 PM
I appreciate your post, Nigel. oftentimes lately I find I'm reluctant to talk about religion at all because the mere mention of anything religious seems to just start a shitstorm of ridicule that makes me feel uncomfortable.

it's entirely possible that my discomfort is rooted in my uncertainty over the form of my "religion" or "spirituality" or whatever it would be labeled if I were to give it one, which I'd rather not. even using the word "beliefs" seems to be an invitation for people to criticize, advise, or ridicule, plus it reminds me too much of my mother's statement of her "beliefs" which in my estimation was deliberately vague so as to avoid having any kind of belief in anything.

I spent 20 years in a fundamentalist (and corrupt) cult. one day I realized I was insufferably critical of people (outsiders) who I would have actually wanted to have as friends, except that the rule-set I'd embraced made friendship impossible. that led me to question things I'd been too afraid to question (long story, although anyone who's been in a cult might have a clue about the fear of appearing to be a non-conformist) and eventually led to breaking away completely.

I'm more or less a spiritual agnostic at this point. I don't actually know what that entails from day to day.

all this has really led up to telling a story of an experience I had when I was in the cult. we were having statewide gathering/conference at a hotel and it just so happened that the athiests society was having one at the same time at the same hotel. both camps spent time examining displays and eavesdropping. the thing that struck me most was that there was essentially no difference in the materials presented or the fervor with which adherents embraced their position. the bumper stickers, the t-shirts, the books, the speakers... all the noise to get god and religion out of everything... it was itself a religion.

it struck me as ironic. it continues to both amuse and annoy me to this day.

also, a question for those who state they know more about christianity than their christian friends.... what is christianity? I don't really want you to answer me since I suspect it might be a derailment and I don't really care what you think it is, but the point I do want to make is there are as many flavors of christianity as there are flavors of ice cream, and familiarity with religious scriptures does not equate to familiarity with interpretation and practice across the various sects, so the statement of superior knowledge seems both arrogant and ignorant.

This is a good first post. I give you your first mittens, thusly:

:mittens:
- I don't see race. I just see cars going around in a circle.

"Back in my day, crazy meant something. Now everyone is crazy" - Charlie Manson

potato

#168
March 11, 2009, 11:26:15 PM
Quote from: Rev. What's-His-Name? on March 11, 2009, 06:55:12 PM
And welcome to the fold. 
thank you.
Quote from: P3nT4gR4m on March 11, 2009, 07:00:33 PM
Stories, stories and more stories, pls.
Liek, immediately, or I will be forced to flame you
all in good time. too many stories before dinner spoils the appetite.
Quote from: LMNO on March 11, 2009, 07:06:24 PM
Yeah, I want to know what the cult was. 
Also, I think what most people mean when they say, "I know more about xtianity, etc" is that they know biblical texts better than some xtians they know.  Like the full context if Isaiah 14, and all that.
perhaps that is what they mean, but what they're saying is they expect people to be as well-read as a theologian and that's just not practical for most people. if, culturally, sacred texts are entrusted to few, who spend the time reading and interpreting them for the flock, then it follows that the flock won't be as well-read as their spiritual leaders. that doesn't mean they (the flock) don't have the right to name themselves members of the flock... so maybe people should just say what they mean. I'm pretty sure I know a fuck of a lot more bible passages than most christians, but I know fuck-all when it comes to why they've chosen to interpret the writings the way they do.
Quote from: Nigel on March 11, 2009, 07:16:33 PM
Welcome, potato! I'm honored that my rant inspired your first post. Glad you're here, and I like your name.
thank you. potatoes spend most of their time underground and have many eyes.
Quote from: Ratatosk on March 11, 2009, 07:28:53 PM
This is a good first post. I give you your first mittens, thusly:
thank you. what are the mittens for?
everything I commit to print is protected by the copyright laws of the U.S. and I retain all rights, including rights to create derivative works, except where I have included reprinted content under the fair use provision, in which case the original author retains all rights, unless of course they've place their work in the public domain or under a CC license, in which case there are no restrictions on public domain works and CC works can be used under the specific license under which it has been distributed.

the above notice exists in case I accidentally ever say anything clever enough that someone wants to borrow, steal or otherwise use it in any printed form.

Urraco

#170
March 12, 2009, 12:07:02 AM
You can lead a whore to water, but you can't make her have sex with you. Maybe.
Spørk, børk? Pørk!

The Good Reverend Roger

#171
March 12, 2009, 01:35:35 AM
Quote from: Rev. What's-His-Name? on March 11, 2009, 06:55:12 PM
Yes, there are better things to have pissing matches over than who knows religion better than someone else.

Name one.
" It's just that Depeche Mode were a bunch of optimistic loveburgers."
- TGRR, shaming himself forever, 7/8/2017

"Billy, when I say that ethics is our number one priority and safety is also our number one priority, you should take that to mean exactly what I said. Also quality. That's our number one priority as well. Don't look at me that way, you're in the corporate world now and this is how it works."
- TGRR, raising the bar at work.

The Good Reverend Roger

#172
March 12, 2009, 01:36:18 AM
Quote from: LMNO on March 11, 2009, 12:32:25 PM
Well, it lasted 10 pages, at least.  Not a bad showing.

It's still going.  You CAN go off topic for a few posts without losing the thread, you know.
" It's just that Depeche Mode were a bunch of optimistic loveburgers."
- TGRR, shaming himself forever, 7/8/2017

"Billy, when I say that ethics is our number one priority and safety is also our number one priority, you should take that to mean exactly what I said. Also quality. That's our number one priority as well. Don't look at me that way, you're in the corporate world now and this is how it works."
- TGRR, raising the bar at work.

The Good Reverend Roger

#173
March 12, 2009, 01:37:00 AM
Quote from: Urraco el Faus aus Mí Luàn on March 12, 2009, 12:07:02 AM
You can lead a whore to water, but you can't make her have sex with you. Maybe.

I'm sure that sounded witty when you wrote it.   :kingmeh:
" It's just that Depeche Mode were a bunch of optimistic loveburgers."
- TGRR, shaming himself forever, 7/8/2017

"Billy, when I say that ethics is our number one priority and safety is also our number one priority, you should take that to mean exactly what I said. Also quality. That's our number one priority as well. Don't look at me that way, you're in the corporate world now and this is how it works."
- TGRR, raising the bar at work.

Jenne

#174
March 12, 2009, 02:36:20 AM
Quote from: The Good Reverend Roger on March 12, 2009, 01:37:00 AM
Quote from: Urraco el Faus aus Mí Luàn on March 12, 2009, 12:07:02 AM
You can lead a whore to water, but you can't make her have sex with you. Maybe.

I'm sure that sounded witty when you wrote it.   :kingmeh:


Yeah, I didn't get that one either.

The Good Reverend Roger

#175
March 12, 2009, 02:37:33 AM
Quote from: Jenne on March 12, 2009, 02:36:20 AM
Quote from: The Good Reverend Roger on March 12, 2009, 01:37:00 AM
Quote from: Urraco el Faus aus Mí Luàn on March 12, 2009, 12:07:02 AM
You can lead a whore to water, but you can't make her have sex with you. Maybe.

I'm sure that sounded witty when you wrote it.   :kingmeh:


Yeah, I didn't get that one either.

Sounds like we have another soundbite-bot.
" It's just that Depeche Mode were a bunch of optimistic loveburgers."
- TGRR, shaming himself forever, 7/8/2017

"Billy, when I say that ethics is our number one priority and safety is also our number one priority, you should take that to mean exactly what I said. Also quality. That's our number one priority as well. Don't look at me that way, you're in the corporate world now and this is how it works."
- TGRR, raising the bar at work.

Jenne

#176
March 12, 2009, 02:40:06 AM
Quote from: The Good Reverend Roger on March 12, 2009, 02:37:33 AM
Quote from: Jenne on March 12, 2009, 02:36:20 AM
Quote from: The Good Reverend Roger on March 12, 2009, 01:37:00 AM
Quote from: Urraco el Faus aus Mí Luàn on March 12, 2009, 12:07:02 AM
You can lead a whore to water, but you can't make her have sex with you. Maybe.

I'm sure that sounded witty when you wrote it.   :kingmeh:


Yeah, I didn't get that one either.

Sounds like we have another soundbite-bot.

One that's somewhat defective, too.

Mesozoic Mister Nigel

#177
March 12, 2009, 08:00:48 AM
Potato, I'm  glad you brought up the difference between being an adherent and being a scholar, although with some traditions I think there's a huge overlap. I've at times found myself discussing American indian traditions with anthropologists who expect me to know far more than I do about various tribes, to which my only answer is that one does not have to be a scholar of all things indian in order to be indian, any more than it's reasonable to expect every white person to be encompassingly familiar with all European cultures and traditions, or every black person to be a scholar of Africa. It would seem that being Christian might reasonably demand a fair depth of knowledge about the Bible, at least, but then again I think that there is a cultural Christianity as well, and if we are going to accept any other religious communities as a subculture, then Christianity can't really be excepted.
"I'm guessing it was January 2007, a meeting in Bethesda, we got a bag of bees and just started smashing them on the desk," Charles Wick said. "It was very complicated."

LMNO

#178
March 12, 2009, 01:07:09 PM
I'm not talking about playing "gotcha!" when someone says they're xtian, I'm talking about people who say, "because the bible says so", and then can't cite the passage, or even the right book.  I mean, that's about as bad as someone talking about physics and saying, "it's because of Quantum."

I mean, if you're going to use it as your primary source, you should have some passing knowledge of it.

Cain

#179
March 12, 2009, 02:37:02 PM
Its because the Bible is quantum.
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