Book Club: Angel Tech

[Bebek Sincap Ratatosk]

"Fourth Gear Social Intelligence is defined through the manner by which we relate with others."

Because our first three gears determine how we react to external stimuli, we review them briefly.  "1) First Gear is THE BODY. 2) Second Gear are BELIEFS. 3) Third Gear, THE INTELLECT."  Wait – Second Gear is "beliefs"?  I think I missed something.  I thought second gear was "territory" or "hierarchy" or something like that.  I'm not sure how "beliefs" tie in.

This is an example (I think) where AA mentions stuff in passing that he hasn't bothered to actually explain previously. In Prometheus Rising, RAW talks about how Strong Beliefs end up replacing Physical Territory in many instances of modern society. For example, some Christian responses to evolution appear to happen at the second circuit rather than the third or fourth. Some Atheists seem to function at the second circuit when it comes to the topic of religion. Unfortunately, AA doesn't really seem to discuss this, he just refers to it and its confusing.

Well, no time to discuss that because we're breaking 4th gear into three parts: "Socially, there are three major phases of personality development: 1) Big Kids (or Adolescents) 2) Adults and 3) The Process of Collectivization... The Big Kid phase, hereafter referred to as Adolescence, is essentially self-indulgent, egotistical and narcissistic due to its wild and experimental nature. This also seems to apply to any adolescent entity, be it a group, corporation, nation or spiritual movement... Characterized by high flux, adolescent phases often appear 'socially irresponsible'." The summation is a bit sophomoric, but I like how he applies it to groups and organizations... In a way, he is giving a nod to mass psychology... there is an implication, however, that if groups can work on Fourth Gear principles, perhaps the previous gears can be applied, as well.  Something to think about.

In other discussions of the system, its generally held that the circuits developed as social evolution developed. The third circuit was the point where Person A could use semantics and time binding to communicate something to Person B. So the fourth circuit is generally considered as the first major social circuit. However, I think this might be an artifact of the linear labels. It seems to me that while your imprints for 1st and 2nd circuit generally predate you social interactions (outside of Mom and Dad and siblings)... once you have the fourth circuit engaged, maybe it trickles down through the others.

We need only look at PD.com and occasionally see what might be called the second circuit group dynamic.  

He sort of bounces past the second part (Adults) by saying they are concerned with linear time due to the Death Realization.  Without explaining this further (really?  Linear time is the big idea for what it means to be an adult?), he goes straight on to Collectivization, which are things like political parties, religious groups, fetish clubs, and LARP-ing.  Of course, therein lies danger: "In time, the personalities of individual group members can tend to dissipate their unique and singular characteristics in favor of the more standardized, homogenous blend of that collective's lowest common denominator."  Which relates back to the point that if groups have a Fourth Gear, they may have lower Gear Settings that are necessary to have in order to "belong." 

Thankfully, it appears we may get some clarity.  The reason Adolescence is needed is to jump into as many social situations as possible, and seeing if people like us for whom we are, or for whom they want us to be.  We do this naturally, thought hormonal surges, and consciously; through it all, we make and break personal relationships.  "If friendship is only based in emotional support, ego-stroking or personal attraction, it falls apart whenever these conditions are withdrawn. Perhaps, a true friend is someone who, somehow, encourages us to be completely ourselves and occasionally challenges our "act" in order to touch our hearts. 'Opposition is Friendship.' - William Blake".

A.A. then takes an interesting stance, and seems to take the position that parts 2 and 3 of Gear Four are not that desirable.  He advises consciously prolonging Adolescence, and even comes up with a word for it so as to make us feel better: "Neoteny" (although you biology students might blanch at the term).  "Neoteny is catalyzed through a careful, non-judgmental study of adolescent characteristics and their acceptance and integration in a creative lifestyle. The spirit of experimentation so crucial to Adolescence necessitates a certain daring...Neoteny is dependent upon improvisatory skills of quick, in-the-moment adjustments to new information."  He then defines an ideal adulthood as a process of refining the Neoteny rather than abandoning it.  I tend to agree with him, but I do find it interesting when he says, "it can be approached consciously or as a robot for DNA. When we are ready to style our own domestic advance, we are more free to bypass the generic models passed down by DNA as our Ancestral Gestalt...that group-mind made up of generations of our genetic heritage."  Interesting because he seems to be establishing a battle between our minds and our genes.  Cue the "Cartesian Duality" headslap.

Yep, definately some "this is Good, this is Bad" here. I liked RAW's discussion of this concept better in PR. He said that biologically "Adult" means "Done growing" and as humans there's no reason to be 'done growing'. Generally though, I find AA to be less thoughtful that RAW about how he's laying out the argument. He tends to do a great job in conversation, but makes some leaps which are definitely getting in the way of his point.  But then, I don't think he claims that his book is Neutral. He is trying to push people a bit toward a more open worldview and so I can read his "Duality" from that perspective... its still annoying as hell though

Oooh.  It's time to talk about sex!  And imprinting!  And totally re-defining what the term "imprinting" means!  That is, your sexual tastes can be re-imprinted fairly easily. "The classic way to erase the old imprint and initiate a new one is in being celibate for about three months or more and then engaging sexually only under preferred conditions."  Anyone want to try this out and see if they can "turn gay" and back again?  Whoops, time to move along to something that isn't complete bullshit.  Let's move on to collectivization.

Yeah, I never figured out where he got that idea from. Leary certainly didn't think re-imprinting was that simple, neither did RAW (so that covers the others authors I've read that discuss the 8 circuit model). I mean, the whole "Leary is crazy psychedelic guy" was because he felt psychedelics were a necessary tool in re-imprinting. RAW's views included stuff like Tantra, but overall, abstaining from sex as the sole tool to re-imprint seems absurd to me.

After a brief acknowledgement that we are pack animals, and that to belong in a pack we need to follow certain game rules, we get to the crux of the matter: "Collectivization begins with sacrificing individual differences for the morality of a particular collective over ones sense of 'right and wrong'." So-called "cult" behavior, then, is simply a codified state of human nature.  Amusingly, A.A. teeters on the edge of his own trap, as his language tries to be fair to conformists-and non-conformists alike, but ultimately draws a circle around the cool kids: Others generate enough inner pressure so as not to feel obliged to conform to external sources. These are the "odd balls" unable to fit the mold of any collectively defined morality... those rare individuals who have chosen a greater solitude and, as a result, continue to run against the grain of collectively defined truths, while forging their paths to the beat of different drummers."

Ah, if only we could all be as free and enlightened as them.  We're in luck!  The next section teaches us how to fix our problems!

Again, this book should definitely not be seen as agnostic. AA has a view of what is best and promotes it. It seems a bit hypocritical in some areas of the book.

Excellent observations so far LMNO, I like it!

[Triple Zero]

I didn't read the book.

me neither but I'm gonna read LMNO's notes later on for sure.

[Kai]

Oooh.  It's time to talk about sex!  And imprinting!  And totally re-defining what the term "imprinting" means!  That is, your sexual tastes can be re-imprinted fairly easily. "The classic way to erase the old imprint and initiate a new one is in being celibate for about three months or more and then engaging sexually only under preferred conditions."  Anyone want to try this out and see if they can "turn gay" and back again?  Whoops, time to move along to something that isn't complete bullshit.  Let's move on to collectivization.

Just so you know, I was celibate for a year and a half. No masturbation, nothing. Due to the reimprinting that you think is so totally full of shit my sexual interests are completely different now than they were at one time.

Maybe it's just my mood right now but I want to punch you in the face. That aside, I like your commentary and I'm glad you're continuing.

[LMNO]

Y'know, I'm really liking this new side of your personality, Kai.



No troll.

[Bebek Sincap Ratatosk]

Oooh.  It's time to talk about sex!  And imprinting!  And totally re-defining what the term "imprinting" means!  That is, your sexual tastes can be re-imprinted fairly easily. "The classic way to erase the old imprint and initiate a new one is in being celibate for about three months or more and then engaging sexually only under preferred conditions."  Anyone want to try this out and see if they can "turn gay" and back again?  Whoops, time to move along to something that isn't complete bullshit.  Let's move on to collectivization.

Just so you know, I was celibate for a year and a half. No masturbation, nothing. Due to the reimprinting that you think is so totally full of shit my sexual interests are completely different now than they were at one time.

Maybe it's just my mood right now but I want to punch you in the face. That aside, I like your commentary and I'm glad you're continuing.

DAMN KAI! Looks like 4 wasn't the only circuit you poked at!

[Rococo Modem Basilisk]

Doesn't being celibate and engaging in sex only under certain conditions qualify as operant conditioning? It doesn't appear to correlate with the pre-Leary idea of 'imprinting' at all, to me, but obviously Leary extended the model out from identifying the mother and learning not to fuck siblings.

It seems quite likely to work, mind you. I am just unsure whether or not it qualifies as imprinting outside of the 8 circuit model.

[The Good Reverend Roger]

Oooh.  It's time to talk about sex!  And imprinting!  And totally re-defining what the term "imprinting" means!  That is, your sexual tastes can be re-imprinted fairly easily. "The classic way to erase the old imprint and initiate a new one is in being celibate for about three months or more and then engaging sexually only under preferred conditions."  Anyone want to try this out and see if they can "turn gay" and back again?  Whoops, time to move along to something that isn't complete bullshit.  Let's move on to collectivization.

Just so you know, I was celibate for a year and a half. No masturbation, nothing. Due to the reimprinting that you think is so totally full of shit my sexual interests are completely different now than they were at one time.

Maybe it's just my mood right now but I want to punch you in the face. That aside, I like your commentary and I'm glad you're continuing.

I kinda like this new Kai.

[Kai]

I mean, I'm not saying that I'm no longer bi, but the sort of people (regardless of sex/gender) and the sort of sexual activities I'm interested in have changed, very very different from what they were before. It works, though AA may be wrong about the length of time and the mindset required.

Y'know, I'm really liking this new side of your personality, Kai.

No troll.

DAMN KAI! Looks like 4 wasn't the only circuit you poked at!

Yeah, I've been working on setting boundaries, and not being a doormat. Seems to be turning out well. People treat me differently, better, with more respect for my personal space, both physical and psychological.

[The Good Reverend Roger]

Yeah, I've been working on setting boundaries, and not being a doormat. Seems to be turning out well. People treat me differently, better, with more respect for my personal space, both physical and psychological.

Plus, it feels good, sometimes.

[Kai]

Yeah, I've been working on setting boundaries, and not being a doormat. Seems to be turning out well. People treat me differently, better, with more respect for my personal space, both physical and psychological.

Plus, it feels good, sometimes.

On Saturday, I was coming back from the assistantship work to meet up with my parents who had driven down here for the weekend, a short visit. Being tired and hungry, unable to find their hotel and meet up, and just wanting to lay down for a while, I proceeded to drive around town speeding and screaming at the top of my lungs. After a few minutes of that, I felt a little better, and was finally able to find their hotel.

[Kai]

Doesn't being celibate and engaging in sex only under certain conditions qualify as operant conditioning? It doesn't appear to correlate with the pre-Leary idea of 'imprinting' at all, to me, but obviously Leary extended the model out from identifying the mother and learning not to fuck siblings.

It seems quite likely to work, mind you. I am just unsure whether or not it qualifies as imprinting outside of the 8 circuit model.

I'm using the words imprinting and reimprinting to refer to whatever this conditioning is thats going on. Is that okay with you Enki, or should I be pedantic about it?

[The Good Reverend Roger]

Yeah, I've been working on setting boundaries, and not being a doormat. Seems to be turning out well. People treat me differently, better, with more respect for my personal space, both physical and psychological.

Plus, it feels good, sometimes.

On Saturday, I was coming back from the assistantship work to meet up with my parents who had driven down here for the weekend, a short visit. Being tired and hungry, unable to find their hotel and meet up, and just wanting to lay down for a while, I proceeded to drive around town speeding and screaming at the top of my lungs. After a few minutes of that, I felt a little better, and was finally able to find their hotel.

That usually works pretty well.  Unless you get hauled over and beaten by cops for being a terrorist.

[Rococo Modem Basilisk]

Doesn't being celibate and engaging in sex only under certain conditions qualify as operant conditioning? It doesn't appear to correlate with the pre-Leary idea of 'imprinting' at all, to me, but obviously Leary extended the model out from identifying the mother and learning not to fuck siblings.

It seems quite likely to work, mind you. I am just unsure whether or not it qualifies as imprinting outside of the 8 circuit model.

I'm using the words imprinting and reimprinting to refer to whatever this conditioning is thats going on. Is that okay with you Enki, or should I be pedantic about it?

I'm okay as long as we identify which definitions we are using.

[The Good Reverend Roger]

Doesn't being celibate and engaging in sex only under certain conditions qualify as operant conditioning? It doesn't appear to correlate with the pre-Leary idea of 'imprinting' at all, to me, but obviously Leary extended the model out from identifying the mother and learning not to fuck siblings.

It seems quite likely to work, mind you. I am just unsure whether or not it qualifies as imprinting outside of the 8 circuit model.

I'm using the words imprinting and reimprinting to refer to whatever this conditioning is thats going on. Is that okay with you Enki, or should I be pedantic about it?

I'm okay as long as we identify which definitions we are using.

It's okay, anyway.  You don't have the chops to tell Kai what is and is not acceptable.

[Kai]

Yeah, I've been working on setting boundaries, and not being a doormat. Seems to be turning out well. People treat me differently, better, with more respect for my personal space, both physical and psychological.

Plus, it feels good, sometimes.

On Saturday, I was coming back from the assistantship work to meet up with my parents who had driven down here for the weekend, a short visit. Being tired and hungry, unable to find their hotel and meet up, and just wanting to lay down for a while, I proceeded to drive around town speeding and screaming at the top of my lungs. After a few minutes of that, I felt a little better, and was finally able to find their hotel.

That usually works pretty well.  Unless you get hauled over and beaten by cops for being a terrorist.

I had the windows rolled up.

It echoed better.