Skeptics and dismissiveness.

[Bebek Sincap Ratatosk]

hmm....
if this is, in fact, the case, why the discrepancy?
what's the difference?

NEVER FUCKING PRAY.

You don't know what is listening.

i actually had a dream about just this a few nights ago:

begin dream description/
i was helping some way-too-drunk guy walk down the street of my neighborhood to get him to my house to safety.  it was particularly difficult because he was stumbling drunk, it was dark night, and its on a particularly steep hill in my neighborhood.  i looked up to the sky and prayed for help.  as i am a pantheist, my prayers are just, sort-of, generalized things to the universe as a whole. (which is odd, now that i think about it, since i direct them 'up' when thats silly in the context....) next thing i know, theres a fuckin UFO that lands behind me.  (oddly it was made out of brick and was about the size of a McMansion type house)  The luminous grey alien that steps out indicates that he's here to answer my call for help like he's the fucking AAA.  i excitedly wave him off with what i figure must be a universal 'my bad' look on my face.  he seemed annoyed as he left....  i dragged the drunk guys ass to the house by myself after that....
/dream description

Damn, thats better than my dream last night... I don't mind flying around in the TARDIS, but why did it look like the Shower Tent from Pennsic?! 

[Template]

HYPOTHESES:
"POWER OF PRAYER" = LEANING INTO A CRUTCH.
RITUAL = INVESTMENT OF EFFORT TOWARDS DEFINED GOAL.

i actually had a dream about just this a few nights ago:

begin dream description/
i was helping some way-too-drunk guy walk down the street of my neighborhood to get him to my house to safety.  it was particularly difficult because he was stumbling drunk, it was dark night, and its on a particularly steep hill in my neighborhood.  i looked up to the sky and prayed for help.  as i am a pantheist, my prayers are just, sort-of, generalized things to the universe as a whole. (which is odd, now that i think about it, since i direct them 'up' when thats silly in the context....) next thing i know, theres a fuckin UFO that lands behind me.  (oddly it was made out of brick and was about the size of a McMansion type house)  The luminous grey alien that steps out indicates that he's here to answer my call for help like he's the fucking AAA.  i excitedly wave him off with what i figure must be a universal 'my bad' look on my face.  he seemed annoyed as he left....  i dragged the drunk guys ass to the house by myself after that....
/dream description

bold
Conditioned action.  Also, up is very relative, very personal.  Without gravity, there is no 'up'.  Seem to remember that weightlessness/free-fall on its own has induced [quasi-]religious experiences.

italic
If Universe can hear your prayers, you might as well make them clear and detailed.  Also it's good practice to know what you want/intend, and state it.  Asking for help to get the guy home, though, sounds about right in this scenario.

Also, for not accepting offers of help.  Don't be so ornery IRL

[Elder Iptuous]

HYPOTHESES:
"POWER OF PRAYER" = LEANING INTO A CRUTCH.
RITUAL = INVESTMENT OF EFFORT TOWARDS DEFINED GOAL.

hmmm.
i'm still not seeing it.

'i'm going to perform this surgery/give you this pill/etc.  it will work'
result: it works

'i'm going to perform this ritual/prayer/etc.  it will work'
result: no effect/deleterious effect


ahh... there was a thing i read saying there is a negative placebo effect, or 'nocebo' effect, where a patient will be statistically worse off if they believe the treatment will not work.  perhaps the prayer study subject didn't actually believe..... or the scientific nature of the study raised doubt?
or perhaps the study was simply done by someone antagonistic to religiosity and the results are suspect?

[Template]

HYPOTHESES:
"POWER OF PRAYER" = LEANING INTO A CRUTCH.
RITUAL = INVESTMENT OF EFFORT TOWARDS DEFINED GOAL.

hmmm.
i'm still not seeing it.

'i'm going to perform this surgery/give you this pill/etc.  it will work'
result: it works

'i'm going to perform this ritual/prayer/etc.  it will work'
result: no effect/deleterious effect


ahh... there was a thing i read saying there is a negative placebo effect, or 'nocebo' effect, where a patient will be statistically worse off if they believe the treatment will not work.  perhaps the prayer study subject didn't actually believe..... or the scientific nature of the study raised doubt?
or perhaps the study was simply done by someone antagonistic to religiosity and the results are suspect?

Question of participation.  I meant mostly to summarize prior posts, there.  Even if one's participation in a ritual (pill/surgery) is mostly passive, one will see oneself as investing in the work, presumably.

Prayer in whatever experimental setup is like saying, "Look out for the invisible check I mailed you.  It's in an invisible envelope."