Antilibertarianism

[BabylonHoruv]

How do we get both rights and services?  In my opinion by devolving as much government function to a local level as possible, and by holding the local fucks accountable (because we actually can) 

[Vene]

How do we get both rights and services?  In my opinion by devolving as much government function to a local level as possible, and by holding the local fucks accountable (because we actually can) 

Congratulations, interracial marriage is now illegal in the south. To a certain extent, you need a strong central gov't to keep the local ones in line.

[President Television]

You know, the Doktor was right about political discussion. I ask for just one thread without libertarianism, and not only do I get libertarian arguments, I also get shoehorned as a liberal.

I'm sure the lot of you will be glad to know that I've come up with my own solution: Nuke em all. Let God sort it out. I'm done with politics.

[Requia ☣]

You know, the Doktor was right about political discussion. I ask for just one thread without libertarianism, and not only do I get libertarian arguments, I also get shoehorned as a liberal.

I'm sure the lot of you will be glad to know that I've come up with my own solution: Nuke em all. Let God sort it out. I'm done with politics.

TITCM

[Doktor Howl]

You know, the Doktor was right about political discussion. I ask for just one thread without libertarianism, and not only do I get libertarian arguments, I also get shoehorned as a liberal.

I'm sure the lot of you will be glad to know that I've come up with my own solution: Nuke em all. Let God sort it out. I'm done with politics.

I knew this was going to end badly.  You can't discuss politics here anywhere without this sort of shit happening.

[Juana]

How do we get both rights and services?  In my opinion by devolving as much government function to a local level as possible, and by holding the local fucks accountable (because we actually can) 

Congratulations, interracial marriage is now illegal in the south. To a certain extent, you need a strong central gov't to keep the local ones in line.

You need one to a big damn extent. Otherwise you end up with sunset towns and lynchings all over again.

[Doktor Howl]

How do we get both rights and services?  In my opinion by devolving as much government function to a local level as possible, and by holding the local fucks accountable (because we actually can) 

Let's discuss a solution in this thread. Without the anti-government libertarian crap, if you please. The problem is not that the system exists, but that its design is flawed and the employees are corrupt and incompetent.

[Doktor Howl]

How do we get both rights and services?  In my opinion by devolving as much government function to a local level as possible, and by holding the local fucks accountable (because we actually can) 

Congratulations, interracial marriage is now illegal in the south. To a certain extent, you need a strong central gov't to keep the local ones in line.

You need one to a big damn extent. Otherwise you end up with sunset towns and lynchings all over again.

No, no, Local governments are always best.  Like Jasper, Texas.

Or the entire state of Arizona.

Yeah.

[Juana]

\
Problem: We are losing our rights.
Problem: More than one entity wants to take them away.
Problem: We like our services, though.

Let's discuss a solution in this thread. Without the anti-government libertarian crap, if you please. The problem is not that the system exists, but that its design is flawed and the employees are corrupt and incompetent.

Absolutely demand reform and don't let up until it's done and being enforced. Campaign donation reforms to get corporate claws out of the government, reform lobbies, and reforms and purging of corrupt employees, to start with. The problem here is, is that we'd need massive, long term support to do that and that's never going to happen.

[Requia ☣]

For an actual answer from me:

The real problem with any system of government you propose is that people suck, and the kind of people who want to be in charge, suck more.

We've tried a bunch of different ideas at how to pick the guy in charge, and the pretty much all suck at picking people I'd want to be in charge, but democracy sucks a hell of a lot less than say, monarchy, or picking the guy who can call the most soldiers to fight for him.

Any solution that actually has a better way to pick leaders that suck less is worth considering, but solutions that rely on different policies, but with the same assholes running the show, aren't going to fix anything.

[President Television]

If the political system corrupts everybody who goes through it, I'm wondering what the merits might be of a completely random leader selection process that is repeated every couple years or so. Maybe something like jury duty. I mean, the general public does contain all sorts of schmucks that should probably never be in power, but at least the results should be entertaining.

Wait, why am I even posting this?

[Doktor Howl]

If the political system corrupts everybody who goes through it, I'm wondering what the merits might be of a completely random leader selection process that is repeated every couple years or so. Maybe something like jury duty. I mean, the general public does contain all sorts of schmucks that should probably never be in power, but at least the results should be entertaining.

Wait, why am I even posting this?

Fucking junkie.

Dok,
Can quit any time he wants.

[Elder Iptuous]

yes.
a random draft of leadership with the threat of being eaten alive if the fickle masses do not approve of their action.
even if it doesn't work for policy, we'd put a dent in overpopulation....

[Mesozoic Mister Nigel]

If the political system corrupts everybody who goes through it, I'm wondering what the merits might be of a completely random leader selection process that is repeated every couple years or so. Maybe something like jury duty. I mean, the general public does contain all sorts of schmucks that should probably never be in power, but at least the results should be entertaining.

Wait, why am I even posting this?

Oh my god

Focus group governance

I love it!

[Golden Applesauce]

A few disconnected thoughts:

• People who feel most passionately about an issue are more likely to vote relative to that issue, and indeed more likely to vote at all.
• The successful strategy to get any given measure passed (or defeated) is to get the people all worked up about it, to the level of "this is a struggle for survival/freedom/way of life/core values" and demonizing the opposition as the Other.
• The above environment, with everyone on every side convinced that this is an existential struggle, is not conducive to compromise, reasonable solutions, or social stability.
• People don't vote for politicians, they vote for who they perceive politicians to be.  So it's just as effective to get better branding, advertising, and public image management as it is to actually get a better class of politician, and the former can be accomplished with money, while the latter takes real character, which is much harder to come by.
• Branding, advertising, and public image management make a candidate more electable, but not better at drafting and passing good laws.