Author Topic: E-Democracy  (Read 95846 times)

Adios

  • Deserved It
  • ****
  • Posts: 11707
    • View Profile
Re: E-Democracy
« Reply #195 on: July 22, 2010, 12:24:00 am »
I am dodging nothing. You are the one ignoring the computer illiteracy of millions. The current system offers these people a better opportunity than your proposed system.

Sure you're dodging it.  You've got plenty of criticism, but repeatedly fail to come up with one suggestion with regards how an E-Democracy system could provide greater opportunities for participation to the computer illiterate, than the one I've described.

You say it's possible, you chastise me for it, yet when I ask you to describe how it could be improved upon - you've got nothing.


You seem to be operating under the impression that I am in full support of E-Democracy. Wrong assumption.

Captain Utopia

  • Social Justice Warrior
  • Deserved It
  • ****
  • Posts: 2818
  • Futurologue de Prétention
    • View Profile
Re: E-Democracy
« Reply #196 on: July 22, 2010, 12:26:57 am »
I don't think that's his position.  CU mentioned that people who didn't have access to the technology would be able to access it with libraries and other free services. As for voting away the rule of law, I think he was just ceding that, if enough people banded together to change the law, they could make any change they liked.  And, as far as I am aware that is, in theory, true - although unlikely since it's obviously not smart to abandon rule of law.

That gave me a hairball.

Okay - is there any form of E-Democracy that wouldn't give you a hairball?

So I guess the answer is "no" then.  Moving swiftly on.



Adios

  • Deserved It
  • ****
  • Posts: 11707
    • View Profile
Re: E-Democracy
« Reply #197 on: July 22, 2010, 12:27:38 am »
I don't think that's his position.  CU mentioned that people who didn't have access to the technology would be able to access it with libraries and other free services. As for voting away the rule of law, I think he was just ceding that, if enough people banded together to change the law, they could make any change they liked.  And, as far as I am aware that is, in theory, true - although unlikely since it's obviously not smart to abandon rule of law.

That gave me a hairball.

Okay - is there any form of E-Democracy that wouldn't give you a hairball?

So I guess the answer is "no" then.  Moving swiftly on.




Do not put words in my mouth sonny.

Jasper

  • Deserved It
  • ****
  • Posts: 15897
  • Pull-Start Enema Wasteland
    • View Profile
Re: E-Democracy
« Reply #198 on: July 22, 2010, 12:34:03 am »
That's...evasive.

Is there any form of E-Democracy that you'd be interested in or not?

It looks like one type that I was interested in was basically an online parliament.  I'd like to see that get used by congress.  It'd be like C-Span on the internet.

Adios

  • Deserved It
  • ****
  • Posts: 11707
    • View Profile
Re: E-Democracy
« Reply #199 on: July 22, 2010, 12:35:48 am »
That's...evasive.

Is there any form of E-Democracy that you'd be interested in or not?

It looks like one type that I was interested in was basically an online parliament.  I'd like to see that get used by congress.  It'd be like C-Span on the internet.

Only one that would and could account for those who are not up to date on technology. Otherwise no.

Adios

  • Deserved It
  • ****
  • Posts: 11707
    • View Profile
Re: E-Democracy
« Reply #200 on: July 22, 2010, 12:36:56 am »
Plain enough?

Adios

  • Deserved It
  • ****
  • Posts: 11707
    • View Profile
Re: E-Democracy
« Reply #201 on: July 22, 2010, 12:41:14 am »
It's my wifes 49th birthday and I am going to spend time with her now.

Captain Utopia

  • Social Justice Warrior
  • Deserved It
  • ****
  • Posts: 2818
  • Futurologue de Prétention
    • View Profile
Re: E-Democracy
« Reply #202 on: July 22, 2010, 12:42:20 am »
The virtual paraliment seems like an interesting idea.  It reminds me of Ender's Game.  Remember the forums that Ender's siblings talked on to influence politics?  It seems like this is that thing.

But, like the book, I don't see a thing like that working directly with citizens.  It would be too noisy.

Yeah, this is why I expect social networking and specialisation will play a part in selective filtering.  Take slashdot as an example of a busy forum.  I never comment there because, well, what's the point?  But if I had an easy way to see people in my circle of friends were commenting on, then I'd probably join in too.  Add to that list certain people who I'm interested in but don't know personally.  If I have more time to spare I'll expand my filter list to friends of friends.

I have no interest in what some random shmuck has to say, and no time to evaluate it, but I've got more chance of stumbling across it if I can easily view content which is "liked" by my friends of friends of friends, etc.  I might even make a new friend.

I don't think a network like this would be "the" answer, but I think it might form part of it by cutting out the stuff which is noise to me and signal to someone else.

Jasper

  • Deserved It
  • ****
  • Posts: 15897
  • Pull-Start Enema Wasteland
    • View Profile
Re: E-Democracy
« Reply #203 on: July 22, 2010, 12:43:13 am »
Yeah.  Sorry if I'm being a nuisance about that.

Idea!  What about a representative virtual parliament where you vote the old fashioned way for people you want to represent you on an online congress type deal?  That way, the elected reps could easily keep track of who voted for them, and easily set up direct polls for them to see where they're at.   Low tech people wouldn't have as close an eye on things as others, so the site could also have a television channel where events are reported and discussed, and viewers could call in to voice concerns or participate in polls.

Doktor Howl

  • Slayer of Spam Bots
  • One-Armed Jizz Moppers
  • Deserved It
  • **
  • Posts: 36986
  • Horrible Bastard
    • View Profile
Re: E-Democracy
« Reply #204 on: July 22, 2010, 12:52:21 am »
That's...evasive.

Is there any form of E-Democracy that you'd be interested in or not?


Not me.  Good old fashioned breaking down and sinking in the swamp democracy suits me just fine.
Molon Lube

Captain Utopia

  • Social Justice Warrior
  • Deserved It
  • ****
  • Posts: 2818
  • Futurologue de Prétention
    • View Profile
Re: E-Democracy
« Reply #205 on: July 22, 2010, 12:58:59 am »
That's...evasive.

Is there any form of E-Democracy that you'd be interested in or not?

It looks like one type that I was interested in was basically an online parliament.  I'd like to see that get used by congress.  It'd be like C-Span on the internet.

Only one that would and could account for those who are not up to date on technology. Otherwise no.

Name one practical way that a system of E-Democracy could do that, to an extent greater than that I've already mentioned.

If someone is not up to date on technology, then they'll either have to learn how to use the technology, or get a friend or social worker to help them.  If they manage to identify an individual who represents a satisfactory portion of their personal agenda, perhaps via the town-crier or telegram, then they could appoint that individual as their proxy vote, and in doing so, find themselves with better representation than they currently have.

Doktor Howl

  • Slayer of Spam Bots
  • One-Armed Jizz Moppers
  • Deserved It
  • **
  • Posts: 36986
  • Horrible Bastard
    • View Profile
Re: E-Democracy
« Reply #206 on: July 22, 2010, 12:59:56 am »
That's...evasive.

Is there any form of E-Democracy that you'd be interested in or not?

It looks like one type that I was interested in was basically an online parliament.  I'd like to see that get used by congress.  It'd be like C-Span on the internet.

Only one that would and could account for those who are not up to date on technology. Otherwise no.

Name one practical way that a system of E-Democracy could do that, to an extent greater than that I've already mentioned.

If someone is not up to date on technology, then they'll either have to learn how to use the technology, or get a friend or social worker to help them.  If they manage to identify an individual who represents a satisfactory portion of their personal agenda, perhaps via the town-crier  telegram, then they could appoint that individual as their proxy vote, and in doing so, find themselves with better representation than they currently have.

Mennonites don't get to vote!  WOOOOOO!
Molon Lube

Jasper

  • Deserved It
  • ****
  • Posts: 15897
  • Pull-Start Enema Wasteland
    • View Profile
Re: E-Democracy
« Reply #207 on: July 22, 2010, 01:02:30 am »
Well, nobody was going to stand up for them anyway. :lulz:

Captain Utopia

  • Social Justice Warrior
  • Deserved It
  • ****
  • Posts: 2818
  • Futurologue de Prétention
    • View Profile
Re: E-Democracy
« Reply #208 on: July 22, 2010, 01:05:24 am »
Oh come on - you identify a suitable proxy, and you find a way to input it into the system.

If you've got documentation enough to prove that you're eligible to vote, then it should be a simple matter to find a social worker who can do the logging on and casting-of-votes for you.



Doktor Howl

  • Slayer of Spam Bots
  • One-Armed Jizz Moppers
  • Deserved It
  • **
  • Posts: 36986
  • Horrible Bastard
    • View Profile
Re: E-Democracy
« Reply #209 on: July 22, 2010, 01:06:16 am »
Oh come on - you identify a suitable proxy, and you find a way to input it into the system.

If you've got documentation enough to prove that you're eligible to vote, then it should be a simple matter to find a social worker who can do the logging on and casting-of-votes for you.




Or we can just stick with the system where they just ride their :hosrie: to the post office and vote.
Molon Lube