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Thinking about Gabbard in general, my animal instinct is to flatten my ears against my head, roll my eyes up till the whites show, bare my teeth, and trill like a cicada stuck in a Commodore 64.

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Psychedelics question

Started by Dalek, August 13, 2010, 09:52:54 AM

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BadBeast

Quote from: Doktor Howl on August 13, 2010, 07:21:30 PM
BB, I want to steal that (with attribution) for the horror texts.
No problem Dok. People need to know about this shit.
"We need a plane for Bombing, Strafing, Assault and Battery, Interception, Ground Support, and Reconaissance,
NOT JUST A "FAIR WEATHER FIGHTER"!

"I kinda like him. It's like he sees inside my soul" ~ Nigel


Whoever puts their hand on me to govern me, is a usurper, and a tyrant, and I declare them my enemy!

"And when the clouds obscure the moon, and normal service is resumed. It wont. Mean. A. Thing"
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zpkCJDYxH-4

Doktor Howl

Quote from: DALEKK on August 13, 2010, 07:21:55 PM
I know I can control myself really well, so addiction is not a problem.

Every cocaine addict I ever knew started off saying that.
Molon Lube

Doktor Howl

Quote from: BadBeast on August 13, 2010, 07:23:59 PM
Quote from: Doktor Howl on August 13, 2010, 07:21:30 PM
BB, I want to steal that (with attribution) for the horror texts.
No problem Dok. People need to know about this shit.

Please to copy into my fear, loathing, and horror thread.
Molon Lube

BadBeast

Quote from: Dr. Vrtig0 on August 13, 2010, 07:17:55 PM
QuoteWhat self-respecting hippie hasnt read Fear and Loathing,
or atleast seen the movie for the love of God.

Of course I'm a HST fan..  just didn't get your reference.

damn shame the way he decided to leave the planet.   :sad:
Sorry Lads, that wasn't The Fear™ I was referring to.
"We need a plane for Bombing, Strafing, Assault and Battery, Interception, Ground Support, and Reconaissance,
NOT JUST A "FAIR WEATHER FIGHTER"!

"I kinda like him. It's like he sees inside my soul" ~ Nigel


Whoever puts their hand on me to govern me, is a usurper, and a tyrant, and I declare them my enemy!

"And when the clouds obscure the moon, and normal service is resumed. It wont. Mean. A. Thing"
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zpkCJDYxH-4

Dalek

Well, I'm not really interested in the effects of cocain, speed, heroin and meth. I know what the effects are and I don't find them really interesting. I know a lot of people who had the will not to get addicted to E and still can't stop smoking pot daily, while this is not a problem for me, as I haven't gotten high since april. After the first two times I got drunk, and after analysing the shit I was doing I just stopped. I have strong enough will to do sports every single day and I've quit doing everything I wanted to quit doing so I don't think I'll get addicted from experimenting.

Doktor Howl

Quote from: DALEKK on August 13, 2010, 07:28:14 PM
Well, I'm not really interested in the effects of cocain, speed, heroin and meth. I know what the effects are and I don't find them really interesting. I know a lot of people who had the will not to get addicted to E and still can't stop smoking pot daily, while this is not a problem for me, as I haven't gotten high since april. After the first two times I got drunk, and after analysing the shit I was doing I just stopped. I have strong enough will to do sports every single day and I've quit doing everything I wanted to quit doing so I don't think I'll get addicted from experimenting.

My comment was intended to illustrate that addiction and willpower are totally unrelated.  People with high willpower may resist indulging in an addiction, but that doesn't mean they aren't addicted.
Molon Lube

BadBeast

Quote from: Doktor Howl on August 13, 2010, 07:24:35 PM
Quote from: BadBeast on August 13, 2010, 07:23:59 PM
Quote from: Doktor Howl on August 13, 2010, 07:21:30 PM
BB, I want to steal that (with attribution) for the horror texts.
No problem Dok. People need to know about this shit.
Done.

Please to copy into my fear, loathing, and horror thread.
Done.
"We need a plane for Bombing, Strafing, Assault and Battery, Interception, Ground Support, and Reconaissance,
NOT JUST A "FAIR WEATHER FIGHTER"!

"I kinda like him. It's like he sees inside my soul" ~ Nigel


Whoever puts their hand on me to govern me, is a usurper, and a tyrant, and I declare them my enemy!

"And when the clouds obscure the moon, and normal service is resumed. It wont. Mean. A. Thing"
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zpkCJDYxH-4

Disco Pickle

QuoteIf your spine was crumbling to powder, you might do the same thing.

conceded.
"Events in the past may be roughly divided into those which probably never happened and those which do not matter." --William Ralph Inge

"sometimes someone confesses a sin in order to take credit for it." -- John Von Neumann

Disco Pickle

QuoteMy comment was intended to illustrate that addiction and willpower are totally unrelated.  People with high willpower may resist indulging in an addiction, but that doesn't mean they aren't addicted.

The good Dok speaks truth here.

Addiction is your brain craving a chemical you gave it and then took away.

It's got shit all to do with will power.  Will power comes in when you recognize the potential you're becoming addicted and to something and stop doing it. 

Addicted brains can recover, depending on the substance, and return to normal before addiction function but the potential for relapse is much more heightened once an addiction has been established.
"Events in the past may be roughly divided into those which probably never happened and those which do not matter." --William Ralph Inge

"sometimes someone confesses a sin in order to take credit for it." -- John Von Neumann

Doktor Howl

Quote from: Dr. Vrtig0 on August 13, 2010, 07:35:03 PM
QuoteMy comment was intended to illustrate that addiction and willpower are totally unrelated.  People with high willpower may resist indulging in an addiction, but that doesn't mean they aren't addicted.

The good Dok speaks truth here.

Addiction is your brain craving a chemical you gave it and then took away.

It's got shit all to do with will power.  Will power comes in when you recognize the potential you're becoming addicted and to something and stop doing it. 

Addicted brains can recover, depending on the substance, and return to normal before addiction function but the potential for relapse is much more heightened once an addiction has been established.

As I understand it, addiction is caused by neural pathways being formed associated with the substance involved.  You can kick the habit, and the pathway becomes dormant.  The moment you use it again, the pathway opens up as if it had never been closed, and you're hooked again.

That's why many smokers (myself included) quit for a year or more, then have one smoke, and the next day they're buying a pack.
Molon Lube

Disco Pickle

Quote
As I understand it, addiction is caused by neural pathways being formed associated with the substance involved.  You can kick the habit, and the pathway becomes dormant.  The moment you use it again, the pathway opens up as if it had never been closed, and you're hooked again.

That's why many smokers (myself included) quit for a year or more, then have one smoke, and the next day they're buying a pack.

my understanding as well, thank you for succinctly explaining it.

I grew up with addicts, both parents, and my mother died for her addiction.

To say I spent some time studying it to find out what hell caused it would be an understatement.  I've spent collective years on the subject and it forms a large portion of my home library.
"Events in the past may be roughly divided into those which probably never happened and those which do not matter." --William Ralph Inge

"sometimes someone confesses a sin in order to take credit for it." -- John Von Neumann

Iron Sulfide

#56
Haven't we hashed this topic out, many many times?

Also:

Quote from: BadBeast on August 13, 2010, 07:20:10 PM
The Fear™ has a different face for everyone, but it is unmistakeable when it hits you. Something starts to creep in around the edges of your Trip, then takes it over, hits you like a steamroller, and leaves you in a place where everything is decaying, and the air has a different, greasy feel to it.

There is a lingering, all pervading smell, a little like an electrical fire, but as familiar as your own sweat. It instills a nagging feeling of extremely close danger, but never quite close enough to give you anything to work with. The quality of the light is all fucked up, the colours seem to be very flat, and thin, except for the blues, which seem to be alive and somehow have a livid violet blue/black harmonic that makes you think of the edges of a deep, badly infected wound.

You can't tell if the air is full of invisible, choking, smoke, and you feel the beginnings of a panic fluttering in your chest. You are suddenly struck by the idea that there is something very, very wrong. You stop what you are doing, and start a mental check to see if you are functioning properly. You are aware of every autonomous function, breathing, heartbeat, bloodflow, etc, and you feel as if you must somehow transfer the control to your foremind, because if you let them go back to automatic, you are likely to forget to keep them going, and die from a lazy heart, or forgetting you need to breath, and asphyxiating.

You take three or four really deep breathes in quick succesion anyway, just in case you had to, but this makes the blood rush in your ears, and your heart beat faster. Everything suddenly ramps up a notch or two. You feel, rather than hear a thundering noise in the distance, it beats like a huge, slow, deep drum, driving everything with a vast timeless beat.

The Panic in your chest gets bigger, and you feel it's fluttery fingers moving up to your throat now, the rushing in your ears is almost deafening and all your perception seems to be building, and building, trapped and looking for a way out, it feels like a tidal wave about to crash over through, and out of your head, all at the same time, (which, you notice as an afterthought, is no longer a constant, but rather ambiguous) Then the panic moves up, and across your face like a blush, and spreads around your head, you are aware of a tiny tiny little white spot, at the centre of everything.

Your bursting, panic stricken mind focuses on this aperture that suddenly unifies all creation, and the light gets bigger, and impossibly bright, just as the wave crashes over you, and it's suddenly like a thousand silent trumpets are blowing all at once, right next to your head, and the pain, and pressure is unbearable, and something has got to give in a moment, and you know that something's going to be you!

But you suddenly find some reserve of will, and start to fight it, with every drop of essence that is you. You seem to be getting away, for a second or two as well, and then whatever it was that you were, snaps away like an elastic band snaps, and you are aware of nothing but the light, no sound, or colour, or texture, just this Holocaust of light, so bright it shines right through you like a breeze cuts through the mist. Matter is suddenly gone. Does not matter, need not be.
You are a point of stillness, the fulcrum at which everything balances, and you feel an instant of relief, before The Fear™ Finally hits you. Rolls over you like a wave of foul, gloopy caramel coloured  :fnord:  and you start to be afraid.
You thought you knew what Fear was, knew how to ride it until it dropped away to nothing much at all.

You realise that you were very wrong indeed.  :aaaah: This thing, The Fear™ is going to ride you, consume you, digest you, and shit you out, like you were nothing! It will go on forever, and you have no hope at all of escaping it's icy clutch. You also know that deep down, you have always known this. And so it takes you.  :scared:

That's just the build up, but you start to get the idea. I wont elaborate any further, because of the spoilers,
but once it gets you, you will never ever be the same. Your life is bisected into two parts. Before, and After.

So now, just because you know The Fear™ is there, don't let it put you off what can be a delightfully fun time. It doesn't get you every time, and it probably won't the first time. Some people never seem to get it at all.
But it doesn't pay to get complacent. It's there, it's real, and it will eventually make itself known to you. To all of us. Eventually. So good luck, and be sure to enjoy your Trip. Everything will be fine.  :wink:    Probably.        

True story: first time I tripped on mushrooms, I went to this place. I was on a post-christian gnostic kick at the time and experienced landed in Hell. Then, after a while, I experienced Purgatory, and eventually Heaven. The funny thing is, they were all the same as the real world, they just...seemed different.
Ya' stupid Yank.

AFK

Quote from: Dr. Vrtig0 on August 13, 2010, 07:35:03 PM
Addicted brains can recover, depending on the substance, and return to normal before addiction function but the potential for relapse is much more heightened once an addiction has been established.

Sorry, this is not accurate.  Significant brain damage can occur through drug addiction that is never completely recovered.  This is especially true when drug use starts in the crucial developmental years of adolescence.  Again, this is why the later you wait to start using drugs the "better".  There are certain brain functions that once you lose them or severely diminish their capacities, you won't get them back.  
Cynicism is a blank check for failure.

Doktor Howl

Quote from: Rev. What's-His-Name? on August 13, 2010, 07:48:25 PM
Quote from: Dr. Vrtig0 on August 13, 2010, 07:35:03 PM
Addicted brains can recover, depending on the substance, and return to normal before addiction function but the potential for relapse is much more heightened once an addiction has been established.

Sorry, this is not accurate.  Significant brain damage can occur through drug addiction that is never completely recovered.  This is especially true when drug use starts in the crucial developmental years of adolescence.  Again, this is why the later you wait to start using drugs the "better".  There are certain brain functions that once you lose them or severely diminish their capacities, you won't get them back.  

He did qualify it (though not as well as you did).
Molon Lube

AFK

Yeah, I see.  Sorry, I'm just being particular about this because this thread started with a real person (who I'm assuming is fairly young) expressing a real interest in experimenting with drugs and I want to make sure he clearly understands the possible implications of the choice he may or may not make. 
Cynicism is a blank check for failure.