Author Topic: DM/Player Ownage  (Read 21068 times)

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Re: DM/Player Ownage
« Reply #120 on: April 16, 2012, 04:02:59 pm »
I always thought the flanking rules implied that a character was constantly moving around and looking around in the middle of battle, they just stay within the same general 5x5 area. That's how you get a dodge bonus or dexterity bonus to AC; the character's always looking out for threats. Flanking them forces them to divide their attention, weakening their defenses.
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Re: DM/Player Ownage
« Reply #121 on: April 16, 2012, 05:21:00 pm »
I always thought the flanking rules implied that a character was constantly moving around and looking around in the middle of battle, they just stay within the same general 5x5 area. That's how you get a dodge bonus or dexterity bonus to AC; the character's always looking out for threats. Flanking them forces them to divide their attention, weakening their defenses.

Yeah, that's how it was rationalized in my 3.0 PHB.

Still it's an interesting and reasonable variation, hence I asked how it affected combat.

Also because I already expected it would affect it in more ways than I'd expect ;-)

Let's see, it means you can sneak behind enemies. It means you can deliver a touch spell from behind without risk. It means if you have sneaked behind an enemy and they move away, they move out of your threatened square and you get to make an AoO. I suppose it changes the whole moving dynamics of a combat situation. As I said, I'd have to play it to get a better grasp of it.
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Re: DM/Player Ownage
« Reply #122 on: April 16, 2012, 05:27:05 pm »
Trip:
http://paizo.com/gameMastery/itemPacks/v5748btpy872f

The crit and fumble decks are decks of cards that you draw when you get a crit or fumble (obviously). Not actually in the "rules".  :wink:

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Re: DM/Player Ownage
« Reply #123 on: April 16, 2012, 06:19:27 pm »
Trip:
http://paizo.com/gameMastery/itemPacks/v5748btpy872f

The crit and fumble decks are decks of cards that you draw when you get a crit or fumble (obviously). Not actually in the "rules".  :wink:

http://paizo.com/products/btpy89mn?GameMastery-Critical-Fumble-Deck

Here's the fumble deck, too.
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Re: DM/Player Ownage
« Reply #124 on: May 08, 2012, 09:30:18 pm »
I like playing chaotic neutral  :sad:

But then again, I can play it to actual type, and not "I'm a loony/I can do anything I want".  I also find it amazing how many people think CN/any evil alignement means "sticking it to the other players constantly".  Sure, if you rolled 3 on INT and WIS, maybe.  Even evil people are going to make exceptions for their buddies, it's just good roleplaying to remember that.  It also makes for a terrible playing experience.

I'm especially amazed by people who think Chaotic Evil means "be a complete monster".  You can play a smart, suave, urbane and sophisticated CE evil character who doesn't giggle while slitting people's throats or eating their eyes, you know.  Jonathan Teatime from The Hogfather comes to mind.  Or Marlo Stanfield from The Wire.

The other problem is, of course, people don't realise alignment is meant to give flavour to a character, not define their every action.

You play as Professor Quirrell?

 :thumb:

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Re: DM/Player Ownage
« Reply #125 on: May 08, 2012, 09:42:36 pm »
No, because I don't have a group  :sad:

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Re: DM/Player Ownage
« Reply #126 on: February 02, 2017, 06:53:53 pm »
Then after the fight he rolled up random loot.

 :lulz:

Where do these people come from?
Michigan, apparently.

1.  He didn't have the loot done BEFORE the game?  That's just being a lazy DM.

2.  Average loot per encounter per APL times the number of encounters = total GP.  The DM then buys the items he wants running around in his campaign, then buys non-coin loot, then places the items and loot in appropriate places.  This is so you don't have a guy running around with, for example, infinite potions of greater magic fang CL20 at level 3.

ETA: The total average loot for a 4 person party going from level 1 to level 2 should be about 3600 GP.

Roger, would you mind breaking down #2 a little bit more for a dumb guy?
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Re: DM/Player Ownage
« Reply #127 on: February 02, 2017, 07:16:58 pm »
Then after the fight he rolled up random loot.

 :lulz:

Where do these people come from?
Michigan, apparently.

1.  He didn't have the loot done BEFORE the game?  That's just being a lazy DM.

2.  Average loot per encounter per APL times the number of encounters = total GP.  The DM then buys the items he wants running around in his campaign, then buys non-coin loot, then places the items and loot in appropriate places.  This is so you don't have a guy running around with, for example, infinite potions of greater magic fang CL20 at level 3.

ETA: The total average loot for a 4 person party going from level 1 to level 2 should be about 3600 GP.

Roger, would you mind breaking down #2 a little bit more for a dumb guy?

Roger will give you a really well detailed and explained explaining, but:
You need to figure out how much total gp value you want in game per average party level.
Then you use that gp to buy the cool shit YOU the gm want in your game. Note this can get wonky if you beyond the hardcover books. High techweapons do funny things.
Then you distribute said fat loots as you wish.
OR
You go to the handy dandy http://paizo.com/pathfinderRPG/prd/coreRulebook/gamemastering.html and go to "Table: Treasure Values per Encounter" and follow this advice:
Quote
Table: Treasure Values per Encounter lists the amount of treasure each encounter should award based on the average level of the PCs and the speed of the campaign's XP progression (slow, medium, or fast). Easy encounters should award treasure one level lower than the PCs' average level. Challenging, hard, and epic encounters should award treasure one, two, or three levels higher than the PCs' average level, respectively. If you are running a low-fantasy game, cut these values in half. If you are running a high-fantasy game, double these values.

Encounters against NPCs typically award three times the treasure a monster-based encounter awards, due to NPC gear. To compensate, make sure the PCs face off against a pair of additional encounters that award little in the way of treasure. Animals, plants, constructs, mindless undead, oozes, and traps are great "low treasure" encounters. Alternatively, if the PCs face a number of creatures with little or no treasure, they should have the opportunity to acquire a number of significantly more valuable objects sometime in the near future to make up for the imbalance. As a general rule, PCs should not own any magic item worth more than half their total character wealth, so make sure to check before awarding expensive magic items.

And then use that to figure out how much gp value each average encounter should give and the total number of average encounters per level, which should be 12-15, and find the product of them to get your total budget and buy sweet epics to distribute throughout the encounters.

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Re: DM/Player Ownage
« Reply #128 on: February 02, 2017, 11:51:32 pm »
Thanks DC! Very helpful. Clearly this is shit I should already know, but I've been a little cavalier with my treasure so far. That ends now.
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Re: DM/Player Ownage
« Reply #129 on: February 03, 2017, 12:15:29 am »
Thanks DC! Very helpful. Clearly this is shit I should already know, but I've been a little cavalier with my treasure so far. That ends now.

You're not wrong, but like Roger said, as long everybody, including you, have fun, you're probably doing alright.

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Re: DM/Player Ownage
« Reply #130 on: February 03, 2017, 07:17:30 am »
Then after the fight he rolled up random loot.

 :lulz:

Where do these people come from?
Michigan, apparently.

1.  He didn't have the loot done BEFORE the game?  That's just being a lazy DM.

2.  Average loot per encounter per APL times the number of encounters = total GP.  The DM then buys the items he wants running around in his campaign, then buys non-coin loot, then places the items and loot in appropriate places.  This is so you don't have a guy running around with, for example, infinite potions of greater magic fang CL20 at level 3.

ETA: The total average loot for a 4 person party going from level 1 to level 2 should be about 3600 GP.

Roger, would you mind breaking down #2 a little bit more for a dumb guy?

Okay, you set up your encounters.  NPCs get equipped out of table 14-9 of the core rule book, this does not count as loot.

Then just make a list of encounters   Consult table 12-5, and use the appropriate column (left hand column for fast advancement experience, middle for middle, and right for slow).

Assuming medium, then, each encounter for a 3rd level party should be worth 800GP, assuming the average encounter is appropriate to the characters' levels.  Add up the number of encounters and multiply by 800 GP.  That's the total loot.  Then you go hit the magic item tables and buy the items you want in your campaign with up to half of that loot.  The other half should be 1/4 art work, 1/4 gems, and 1/2 coinage.  NOTE:  this doesn't have to be spread out evenly.  It can be the phat loot after the boss encounter, some might even be "unguarded" (har har har), etc. 

Assuming 14 encounters being enough to level a party up (less at 1st level), that means that you have 11,200 GP to hand out between the party making 3rd and making 4th (larger parties are accounted for by adjusting the APL by +1 on the loot charts as well as the encounter tables.)  Means:

7000 GP in magic items.  Total.
3500 GP in cash.
1750 in art work (jewelry, tapestries, paintings, etc)
1750 in gems

Also, don't just tell them how much art & gems are worth.  If nobody took appraise as a skill, then you can just smile at them as they sell the good stuff for pennies on the dollar.

Note that this system relies on the PCs having access to a large enough town for them to purchase level-appropriate magic items.  If they aren't,  goose up the magic a bit and back off on the gems.   But still have part of the treasure be a bigass statue or painting they have to lug around.  Because.

ETA:  Also remember that cursed items do not count as loot and should be placed according to your hatred of the players and all that is right and good about the world, and that if they don't beat the DC to identify the item by 10 or more, it comes up as a beneficial item.
« Last Edit: February 03, 2017, 07:21:20 am by The Good Reverend Roger »
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Re: DM/Player Ownage
« Reply #131 on: February 03, 2017, 02:07:09 pm »
You are an absolute doll. Thank you so much.
“Soon all of us will have special names” — Professor Brian O’Blivion

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"Do I contradict myself? Very well, then I contradict myself, I am large, I contain multitudes" — Walt Whitman

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Re: DM/Player Ownage
« Reply #132 on: February 03, 2017, 03:14:29 pm »
I had my two worse players get royally pissed about the paucity of easily carted or obvious lucre. :lulz: "What's that you feel like you don't have enough wealth by level? I am so sorry you had no desire to cart the obviously valuable components of magical constructs."

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Re: DM/Player Ownage
« Reply #133 on: February 04, 2017, 04:39:34 am »
I had my two worse players get royally pissed about the paucity of easily carted or obvious lucre. :lulz: "What's that you feel like you don't have enough wealth by level? I am so sorry you had no desire to cart the obviously valuable components of magical constructs."

Fun fact:  The last homebrew campaign I had, there was this 300 pound statue in the dungeon near this dinky ass town.  I hadn't even assigned it a value, but the PCs appraised it - unskilled, nobody ever learns - and decided it was a priceless artwork, like David.  They hauled it back to town, and found that the village had no interest in it, even if they could have afforded it.  One guy offered them a pig for it, but the party hauled the statue 60 miles to a large town.  Using an ox cart.  which attracted bandits.  which further convinced them that it was valuable.

It was basically the elven version of a garden gnome. 

They still had it at the end of the campaign.

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Re: DM/Player Ownage
« Reply #134 on: February 04, 2017, 10:18:10 am »
Wow.  As a rogue, you already have a ridiculous amount of skill points (8+INT, wasnt it?), I always dropped a few into Appraise.

If I'm going to be stealing shit, you better bet I'm going to get paid what it's worth.  And if I'm going to be stealing entire hordes of treasure, I want to know what's worth the most so I don't end up hauling a garden gnome by oxcart on the off chance it's worth a few bob.