GraffitiGASM (an optional side mission for posterGASM)

[Phox]

Sorry, but as an unreal thinker and a very real graffiti writer I think this GASM sucks.

Tagger, or artist?

It's irrelevant. But, like Epi said, it's not a good discussion to get into. I'll just stick by my statement that graffiti sucks.

I fully support covering some ugly graffiti with posters, however, those residing in the Americas might consider watching "Sin Nombre" before you do something extremely stupid.

This is a good point, if the movie is the one about Mexican gangs? I have not seen the film, so I am not sure what you are implying exactly, but I'm taking it to mean that messing with gang graffiti could be a bad move? For my part, I don't need to worry, since there is neither much graffiti nor much gang activity in my areas of operation. However, something to consider for others.

[Triple Zero]

Sorry, but as an unreal thinker and a very real graffiti writer I think this GASM sucks.

Uh, I think the OP was pretty clear in saying to put up posters over the butt-ugly scribbly tags, you know, the crap that's just a 5-10 second job with a marker or spray-can.

So, I don't see what your problem is? Do you seriously think that sort of trashy defacements--which BTW have a scientifically proven effect on criminality and even affect moral judgement of passers-by negatively--should somehow be protected over the Holy Discordian Sacrament of Postering Awesome Mindfuckery?

I think we all agree that pretty graffiti is pretty. And if it's a colourful piece that somebody obviously put a lot of work in--even if it's just a word--I don't think anybody here would deface that.

[LMNO]

I think some people are implying that those quick "scribble" tags are often gang-related territorial markers, and to deface or cover them up signals that you're invading their turf and want to fight them.  And if they catch you doing it, they will have no hesitations about beating the crap out of you or, more simply, shooting you.

[AFK]

Yeah, I don't think any GASM is worth getting a slug in your back. 

[Triple Zero]

I think some people are implying that those quick "scribble" tags are often gang-related territorial markers, and to deface or cover them up signals that you're invading their turf and want to fight them.  And if they catch you doing it, they will have no hesitations about beating the crap out of you or, more simply, shooting you.

Is that what Dalekk was implying? Cause it doesn't sound like it?


But I agree about taking care when you got gangs in your area. Similarly if that is the case you should take care walking dark streets at night, as well.

[Lies]

Yeah, I don't think any GASM is worth getting a slug in your back. 

Yeah, I don't think any GASM is worth getting a slug in your back. 

No risk, no glory, you pansies. 

[ñͤͣ̄ͦ̌̑͗͊͛͂͗ ̸̨̨̣̺̼̣̜͙͈͕̮̊̈́̈͂͛̽͊ͭ̓͆ͅé ̰̓̓́ͯ́́͞]

But I agree about taking care when you got gangs in your area. Similarly if that is the case you should take care walking dark streets at night, as well.

That's not remotely similar. Covering a tag is deliberately asking for a fight.

Yeah, I don't think any GASM is worth getting a slug in your back. 

Yeah, I don't think any GASM is worth getting a slug in your back. 

No risk, no glory, you pansies. 

True.

All I'm saying is that anyone considering doing this should know the shit they're stepping into may be far deeper than they realize.

[Lies]

But I agree about taking care when you got gangs in your area. Similarly if that is the case you should take care walking dark streets at night, as well.

That's not remotely similar. Covering a tag is deliberately asking for a fight.

Yeah, I don't think any GASM is worth getting a slug in your back. 

Yeah, I don't think any GASM is worth getting a slug in your back. 

No risk, no glory, you pansies. 

True.

All I'm saying is that anyone considering doing this should know the shit they're stepping into may be far deeper than they realize.

Yes, this is true. Realise there is the potential to piss off gangs. Also realise, if you do it right, there is the potential to CONVERT them. And make them realise they're doing it wrong.

[Triple Zero]

But I agree about taking care when you got gangs in your area. Similarly if that is the case you should take care walking dark streets at night, as well.

That's not remotely similar. Covering a tag is deliberately asking for a fight.

Well, you shouldn't do that either then, eh?

[Lies]

But I agree about taking care when you got gangs in your area. Similarly if that is the case you should take care walking dark streets at night, as well.

That's not remotely similar. Covering a tag is deliberately asking for a fight.

In any case, I think if you're smart about this all, you'll be able to avoid fights and create a whole new type of chaos.
Personally, I'm not too worried about pissing off a punch of teenagers with ego issues, at least, not here in Australia, if anything, I'm pretty sure I could talk them into doing it themselves if they ever "catch" me.

[Cramulus]

your mileage may vary. a lot of the tags in my suburban hometown are 20+ years old, and there isn't any gang activity.

postergasm is, in essence, a way to participate in the dialogue of our urban landscape. postergasm and graffiti have a lot in common, they are both ways of transforming a space into something that organically reflects the people which live there.

I see no problem with people who want to take back their neighborhood from garbage tags and indecipherable scribbles. It's a funny way to undermine the people "cleaning up" the neighborhood too, who may prefer to see a silly slogan to a tag. Public spaces are nobody's territory - they're not owned by the city sanitation department , the graffiti writers, or us poster kids. We may modify these spaces, but our changes will be impermanent. Such is the nature of an organic public space.

What's most interesting to me is trip's point about how graffiti and crime are related to each other. Imagine it going the other way... what if you were in a neighborhood where EVERYBODY postered? what kinds of behaviors might be encouraged instead of crime? food for thought

[Triple Zero]

Actually, according to the research (carried out by the University of Groningen--but I think the link about it was posted here as well), a bit that I left out is that it seems to be the general "feeling of disorder" somewhat, the results are really interesting, but if your posters look like trash or "feel" criminal, they'd probably have the same effect. For instance, litter or discarded flyers had a similar effect. And, unfortunately, due to the common perception of graffiti in general, people don't really distinguish between 10-second "tags" and the really colourful complicated big wall urban typography, which, I presume, most of us would agree can be a lot prettier than just a dead wall.

On the other hand, it's all about the feeling it provokes.

It's like the big average of tiny subconscious feelings of hundreds of passers-by. So no use complaining they react "wrong" to something (pretty graffiti) because they don't "understand", because understanding takes no part in it. You are communicating with a part of the Machine, not people. And it's a dumb beast, and it can't be better.

However, I would guess that the "lost cat" poster variations might have a very different effect. I mean, actual "lost cat" posters might convey a sort of warm feeling of neighbourhoodness/connectedness? Maybe? Or does it just tell people "this is an area where pets get lost / under a car"?

I think if you subvert a certain theme, like a "lost cat" poster, you don't really change the "averaged subconscious reaction" of the crowd, so to say.

Similarly, subverted "official" looking posters again have a different effect. Also depending on their location of course. A random alley would be rather out of place.

(And also, Cram! You're online again, got my PM?)

[Placid Dingo]

Also, on Lies point, in Aus most 'gang tags' are more prone to be a bunch of muddle headed binge drinking dickheads who are quite likely still of school age, not the local cocaine distribution network. So there's some cultural differences there.

Like, the Bra Boys will bash people sure, but it's not even close to messing with say, Bloods or Crips. So far as I'm aware.

Also, 000, do you have a link? I'm familiar with the experiment but would love to see it again. As far as I remember it wasn't so much 'moral judgement is affected' as much as 'when people see rules being broken, they are more likely to break other rules'. I accept the general finding though. IIRC, along with graffiti, the put bikes on a 'no bikes' section, and found more people ignored a 'stay off the grass' sign.

[Lies]

your mileage may vary. a lot of the tags in my suburban hometown are 20+ years old, and there isn't any gang activity.

Yeah, that's what I'm thinking as well, a lot of the tags I know are around are just old tags that no ones bothered to clean up, I'm sure the few that are "in use" are the rarer ones anyway.

[Lies]

Actually, according to the research (carried out by the University of Groningen--but I think the link about it was posted here as well), a bit that I left out is that it seems to be the general "feeling of disorder" somewhat, the results are really interesting, but if your posters look like trash or "feel" criminal, they'd probably have the same effect. For instance, litter or discarded flyers had a similar effect. And, unfortunately, due to the common perception of graffiti in general, people don't really distinguish between 10-second "tags" and the really colourful complicated big wall urban typography, which, I presume, most of us would agree can be a lot prettier than just a dead wall.

On the other hand, it's all about the feeling it provokes.

It's like the big average of tiny subconscious feelings of hundreds of passers-by. So no use complaining they react "wrong" to something (pretty graffiti) because they don't "understand", because understanding takes no part in it. You are communicating with a part of the Machine, not people. And it's a dumb beast, and it can't be better.

However, I would guess that the "lost cat" poster variations might have a very different effect. I mean, actual "lost cat" posters might convey a sort of warm feeling of neighbourhoodness/connectedness? Maybe? Or does it just tell people "this is an area where pets get lost / under a car"?

I think if you subvert a certain theme, like a "lost cat" poster, you don't really change the "averaged subconscious reaction" of the crowd, so to say.

Similarly, subverted "official" looking posters again have a different effect. Also depending on their location of course. A random alley would be rather out of place.

(And also, Cram! You're online again, got my PM?)

My favourite posters to put up are TGRR's Sermons, the "You are not free" type posters, the "lost cat" posters and such.
Also, I made a poster out of Crams Julian Assange is not the target rant on 23ae.

Also, I've got a gang to help me poster now, so like, it's not as if I'm alone in my efforts just in case some random asshole does notice us fucking with his tags.

Also, what Placid Dingo said.

So yeah. I declare graffitigasm an officially awesome idea, if I do say so myself.