Author Topic: Italy to ban plastic bags  (Read 34419 times)

the last yatto

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Re: Italy to ban plastic bags
« Reply #480 on: January 08, 2011, 03:35:52 pm »
There has subsequently been a decrease in soil erosion caused by over-farming and an overall decline in the use of pesticides and fertilizers.

A decrease from what level?  How bad was it?

I mean, I know Kansas and Nebraska are both deserts now, but besides that.   :lulz:

But according to that link, your argument is that we're bad people because we're constantly improving our farming techniques, or bad because we aren't utterly perfect?

Didn't heavy use of fertilizers that corn requires fuck up the Mississippi river basin, where they have a small country size dead zone now, that stays until the hurricane season?
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Re: Italy to ban plastic bags
« Reply #481 on: January 08, 2011, 03:39:52 pm »
lots of stuff

Also on top of this many people in the humanitarian aid industry are insufferable pricks who'd have you believe they're pure angels for helping the benighted heathen, acting towards the people they are supposed to be helping with such a condescending attitude even thorough-going Victorian imperialists would likely be appalled.

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Re: Italy to ban plastic bags
« Reply #482 on: January 08, 2011, 03:41:55 pm »
lots of stuff

Also on top of this many people in the humanitarian aid industry are insufferable pricks who'd have you believe they're pure angels for helping the benighted heathen, acting towards the people they are supposed to be helping with such a condescending attitude even thorough-going Victorian imperialists would likely be appalled.

I have met such.

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Re: Italy to ban plastic bags
« Reply #483 on: January 08, 2011, 03:50:01 pm »
Yeah, they're unfortunately common. 

Anyway, the point I was getting back to was underconsumption in Africa is due to political reasons, especially the corrupted institutions present in many African countries and strongman Presidents who can do what they like.  Currently, such conditions do not prevail in liberal democracies, though they have made use of these methods abroad (Fallujah in 2004, Gaza currently).  If the African continent were to have more similar conditions to other liberal democracies over the world, I have no doubt their consumption would quickly reach comparable levels, and there would definitely be a greater capacity for production than present (or, at least, the current production levels would be maintained minus the ongoing theft and destruction detailed in earlier posts).

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Re: Italy to ban plastic bags
« Reply #484 on: January 08, 2011, 03:55:50 pm »
Yeah, they're unfortunately common. 

Anyway, the point I was getting back to was underconsumption in Africa is due to political reasons, especially the corrupted institutions present in many African countries and strongman Presidents who can do what they like.  Currently, such conditions do not prevail in liberal democracies, though they have made use of these methods abroad (Fallujah in 2004, Gaza currently).  If the African continent were to have more similar conditions to other liberal democracies over the world, I have no doubt their consumption would quickly reach comparable levels, and there would definitely be a greater capacity for production than present (or, at least, the current production levels would be maintained minus the ongoing theft and destruction detailed in earlier posts).

For some reason I forgot about food being used to control people. It really works better than religion because when people are starving they tend to get pissed at {god}.

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Re: Italy to ban plastic bags
« Reply #485 on: January 08, 2011, 04:11:21 pm »
It's an unfortunately common tactic.  Food security is actually a quite popular subject of study among Human Security scholars.

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Re: Italy to ban plastic bags
« Reply #486 on: January 08, 2011, 04:31:06 pm »
My personal favorite horror story is the Creole Pig.

Basically, the creole pig was naturally adapted to Haiti's environment, diseases, etc.  It was cheap to keep on top of it.  The US, along with the Haitian government, said they were susceptible to a disease and ordered a culling.  They killed off all these pigs and replaced them with the breeds used in the US.

The new pigs had a more stringent feeding schedule, weren't resistant to local climate or diseases, and were fed grains imported from the US.  Locals stared calling them something like "prince-au-quatre-pied" (princes on four feet, roughly).

That's a trend that continues, not necessarily as blatantly.  With subsidized crops imported from the US, it's cheaper for a lot of Haitians to buy what we grow here than it is to buy what's grown by their own farmers on their own land.  Lucky for us, that means farmers can make a living growing something like sugar cane instead of worrying about something pesky like feeding their local population.

Food systems - SUPERFUCKED.
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Re: Italy to ban plastic bags
« Reply #487 on: January 08, 2011, 04:39:33 pm »
Playing with ecosystems is always a dangerous game.  Hell, Australia has two very well known horror stories about that: Cane Toads and European Rabbits.  And yeah, crop subsidies by the EU and USA have a lot to do with third world choices in farming, simply because they allow western nations to sell food so cheaply.

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Re: Italy to ban plastic bags
« Reply #488 on: January 08, 2011, 04:42:00 pm »
Playing with ecosystems is always a dangerous game.  Hell, Australia has two very well known horror stories about that: Cane Toads and European Rabbits.  And yeah, crop subsidies by the EU and USA have a lot to do with third world choices in farming, simply because they allow western nations to sell food so cheaply.

Ask Florida about walking catfish.

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Re: Italy to ban plastic bags
« Reply #489 on: January 09, 2011, 04:09:52 am »
Playing with ecosystems is always a dangerous game.  Hell, Australia has two very well known horror stories about that: Cane Toads and European Rabbits.  And yeah, crop subsidies by the EU and USA have a lot to do with third world choices in farming, simply because they allow western nations to sell food so cheaply.

Ask Florida about walking catfish.

If I see a fish walking, I will shoot it until my pistol is empty.

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Re: Italy to ban plastic bags
« Reply #490 on: April 08, 2019, 03:47:33 am »
It's catching, in Austin, places simply will NOT give you a bag, if you didn't come in with some re-usable cloth bag you will be told to kindly get fucked, twice, you might get lucky and they might sell you a cloth bag, or they just might have a paper bag to sell you, yet.. seeing it in action, I don't think it's a bad thing.