WHORE

[WretchedChan]

FYI WretchedChan is NAVKAT..........

Good news....bad news. Bad news I'm getting a divorce. Good news...if you could call it that (trying to be positive), is that I have discovered she (NAVKAT), slept with a Earl Scioneaux III of New Orleans on on of her many trips to New Orleans, and made out with at least two men other of which I know who he is.... (he's on this site)....and wont be happy when he sees this. This all happened From at least April to present. I say this because things will be said about me I'm sure. Some if not all might be true. But I don't give a fuck, and her constant "worry" about her apperance on the web. This is for all of you on here that hate her.

The following are posts on a website where she used a different screen name. Its her....as those of you familiar with her rants and style will see. Ive got other proof it was posted from her computer.....but I've got a pending divorce. Got screen shots if you care to see them.....

This will be a long post so save it before its deleted. ENJOY! (Let the NEGS flow)

Stargazer23, female, bi-curious, live on the Gulf Coast in semi-large, conservative city.

I'm not using my real name to protect myself and others.

New to poly and just "came out" to myself about four years ago with the help of a friend and "mentor" I call "Rockstar."

I'm working my way out of a marriage to a man who can not accept me and with whom things have become abusive and mistrustful, despite my attempts at honesty. This is a complex and heartwrenching divorce--I still love this man a lot and at one point, considered him my Best Friend. We had a good thing for a while but the reality of my identity put me in the awful position of choosing between "rocking the boat" or cheating.

All of my needs simply can not be satisfied for life by one person. I don't even find that concept to be reasonable anymore.

I have a son not of this marriage and a need to be pragmatic, smart, clean and discreet.

I want to find a primary with whom I can have a secure, open, committed, safe relationship. I would like to eventually have another child or adopt with such person.

I am libertarian (lowercase L). I value respect for liberty above all else. I prefer honesty to lies but lies to oppression. Don't make me choose.

I have enough love in my heart for the entire world and I don't think I could live with someone who didn't as well.
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Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: South of the Mason-Dixon
Posts: 30
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I kinda dig the ironic "slut" moniker...it's just the earnest use of the word "whore" on behalf of family and enemies that stings.

I've been meaning to read that book since I saw it on Coke Talk. It's about time I pick it up, methinks.
__________________
"Although the most acute judges of the witches and even the witches themselves, were convinced of the guilt of witchery, the guilt nevertheless was non-existent. It is thus with all guilt."
-Friedrich Nietzsche

How can you claim to love someone with all your heart if you can't stand to let them love with all of theirs?
-me
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This.

Granted, both of us are in situations that make anything truly solid prohibitive at the moment but I'd like to feel at least comfortable enough to exchange small murmurings of infatuation and hopefulness for some future...something or another. The two times I had the nerve to say something to the effect of "You know, I kinda miss you right now," reciprocation was not expressed. Both times were over chat and his reaction was to respond with a emote.

However, whenever I find myself with free time to drive to town, he seems nothing short of elated. He seems to make room for me in his plans, even if it's last minute and the time we actually spend together feels magical to me...he just never actually initiates plans and when it's over, it seems like it's off his radar entirely (Granted, he has a very busy radar).

We have a friendship level of care and regard for one another that transcends any relationship type stuff. He has always been honest with me, has never lied and has never tried to manipulate me into anything. He has never displayed anything other than utmost respect for my choices and I his.

It's frustrating. I don't want any kind of commitment to some plan of action or another because that simply can't happen right now. I just want to feel like I'm important and like I'm on his mind. I want to feel wanted instead of "out of sight, out of mind."

I feel spooked by this enough to back off and push it away to focus on other things.

Am I overthinking this?
__________________
"Although the most acute judges of the witches and even the witches themselves, were convinced of the guilt of witchery, the guilt nevertheless was non-existent. It is thus with all guilt."
-Friedrich Nietzsche

How can you claim to love someone with all your heart if you can't stand to let them love with all of theirs?
-me
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Oh wow. Update since last time I visited here...

I actually did back off for a while and started focusing on two other men...as well as a couple of brief "makeout" flings that were just fun fluff.

The first man was also very passive with me and I came to find out he simply wasn't interested in me in any serious sense.

The second was (and still is) completely enamoured with me. He's sweet, extremely expressive and romantic and very bright. Two problems:
1. His life is sort of a mess right now and I am in no position (nor am I interested) to "rescue" him. I get the feeling he's looking to me to kick his ass, set him straight and motivate him. Not my style. I don't kick asses.

2. He says he understands my needs to have a completely open relationship but I'm sure he really can't deal with it. I see the edges of possessiveness in his personality and while he's willing to let me do whatever I need to if I'll just give him a chance, I can tell that the idea of me loving other men hurts him...or will.

The truth is: I keep coming back to the man for whom this thread was started because he makes the most sense to me. We laugh constantly when we're together. He influences me in positive ways, we are each others' cheerleaders. I feel safe, sane, happy, likable and wanted with him. We have discussions that range from the profound to the inane--all of them riveting. I feel like I get through to him too--like it's not all me being affected/inspired. He just feels right in a very healthy, cerebral way and I don't want to miss out because I pushed him away out of some lame fear silliness.

We have many of the same political beliefs and he is also a self-identified polyamorous...though recent chats have revealed that his ideal lifestyle is different than mine: He wants plural marriage/relationship with all parties being equal. I crave having a primary relationship that's solid with the liberty to love others interchangeably, but keeping the primary as the priority focus/best friend/teammate/cohort.

We recently spent some time together and after a related-but-still-casual/hypothetical discussion wherein he mentioned that he's willing to compromise, I finally felt comfortable asking for more. I tripped over my words a lot but I managed to spit the main idea out. He says he needs time to think about my request/proposal and I believe him. I believe he won't keep me hanging, but will get back to me when he feels ready.

Our time together lately feels more intimate and connected than ever so I'm not terribly worried. I am starting to melt out of some of my armor.

I have a feeling this will be discussed this weekend when I see him again. I'm ready and willing to respect and accept whatever he concludes...even if it's not in my favor.
__________________
"Although the most acute judges of the witches and even the witches themselves, were convinced of the guilt of witchery, the guilt nevertheless was non-existent. It is thus with all guilt."
-Friedrich Nietzsche

How can you claim to love someone with all your heart if you can't stand to let them love with all of theirs?
-me
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I guess that would place me in kind of a hybrid school (I almost never fit completely in a category, anyway) I'm mostly okay with letting things be chill, but eventually, I have questions and trying to ignore them just makes me feel like my head's going to pop.

I dig the trust/respect/honesty/open communication thing. I need to be able to feel like I can speak freely and be safe from judgment (I do). Now that I've put it out there and been reassured of a few things, I feel like I can chill.

I'm like: tell me what's up now so we can get it over with and move on to the fun stuff.
__________________
"Although the most acute judges of the witches and even the witches themselves, were convinced of the guilt of witchery, the guilt nevertheless was non-existent. It is thus with all guilt."
-Friedrich Nietzsche

How can you claim to love someone with all your heart if you can't stand to let them love with all of theirs?
-me

This worked out badly. I tried to gently bring it up again and flubbed it up. I admitted feelings of loooooove for him and he ended the relationship entirely...to spare my feelings. I'm slightly annoyed at this because I previously believed we had a friendship-love founded on mutual respect and honesty. I don't need a "white knight" protecting and policing the scene so I don't get hurt. I can handle myself, thankyouverymuch, and I would have appreciated the opportunity to come to any conclusions about what I can and can not "handle" on my own.
He broke my heart.

It sucked.

I'm over it and we're still friends.

His loss, I'm so damned easy to please. I would have been good for him and he me. We would have made quite a team.


I've already begun to look elsewhere; I just don't allow myself to stay heartbroken for long. I've met a really sexy, smart, successful gentleman at a tubing/camping event this past weekend. We had hot makeout time in the hottub and we have plans to see each other again in a few weeks.

I've also got another lovely boy simmering "out there." I'm amusing myself. He knows it. We have quite the little tête-à-tête going back and forth on text.

Love it.

I spent Friday evening dancing and making out with boys (and a girl) to get my catharsis on and my heart in good spirits. It worked.

Ethical slut? Hell yes.
__________________
"Although the most acute judges of the witches and even the witches themselves, were convinced of the guilt of witchery, the guilt nevertheless was non-existent. It is thus with all guilt."
-Friedrich Nietzsche

How can you claim to love someone with all your heart if you can't stand to let them love with all of theirs?
-me

SHES TALKING ABOUT EARL IN THIS NEXT ONE....

I have just been through my first poly/poly "breakup." I talked a little about it here: http://www.polyamory.com/forum/showthread.php?t=8772 This is SOOOO relevant to me right now.

To sum: We'd been on and off for about three years but I didn't start feeling serious about him until about January of this year and didn't let myself succumb until like Feb. In March, we established a "fluid bond" and just a few weeks ago, I asked for primary status which he'd initially stated was "workable" but that he didn't want to "make any promises he couldn't keep." Later, when asked (and after I admitted to being in love with him) he became defensive to my trying to "nail him down." Next day, he ended the relationship abruptly. There was no compromise. It was not open to discussion for him. I asked for something he couldn't give and it was O-V-E-R. Period.

He was pretty kool about letting me process and ask questions for the first night (and I was exhaustive about needing questions answered). I felt at the time like it was so sudden: I went into the discussion pretty secure in thinking we were going to work something out that made us both happy. I went home early, empty-handed, utterly dejected and wondering what the eff just happened. That night, I called and he let me me agonize over it for almost 2 hours. (I even tried to "work it out" with him so we could move on and continue the relationship. *gag*).

The next day started out okay but I pissed him off by pushing too hard for some facetime with him. He remained annoyed at me for a couple days.

Day four, I established as my "catharsis day." I wrote him an exhaustive letter that was gut-wrenchingly honest about my feelings on basically everything. I told myself before I clicked "send" that this would be the last time I would allow myself to bring it up with him ever again and that I'd better get it all out of my system. Then, I made plans to go out and work my problems out on the dancefloor.

Best thing I ever did. I feel 90% back to normal. That is to say: I have moved on, gotten over it and do not feel any agony over it. I feel ready to find others to love wholeheartedly and with no reservation (but then, we are always open to that possibility, anyway, right?) and we have had lunch and talked since (he brought it up this time, not me) and we're still friends.

The one thing I left out of the letter: How I think it's utter bullshit that he broke it off "to spare my feelings" and because he didn't want to "take a gamble with the friendship." These very reasons in and of themselves have done some damage to the friendship. The "spare my feelings" bit flies in the face of the mutual respect/trust thing I thought we had because I have never needed or wanted to be protected from "getting hurt" and I honestly believed we were transcendent of such nonsense.

The "taking a gamble" thing is trash because I feel that:
1. It's too late for that. We already made the decision buy the ticket and take the ride. You don't get to jump off in the middle and tuck n roll your way out the very first time you run into a snag without retaining some scratches.
2. The way he did it gave me zero say in the matter. My input was a zero factor. My willingness to talk it out, compromise and meet him halfway meant nothing. He made up his mind and executed and nothing I had to say was going to sway him at all.

That remaining 10% sprouts from this and from my own regrets about how I handled asking for what I wanted.

I feel some reservations and discomfort about him now. It's not overwhelming--we have always laughed a lot and agreed on a lot and I still feel like we'd make an awesome team in some fashion--but it's there. I can not get out of my head how he just decided to axe me so swiftly and easily and can not help but find his stated motives dubious. I can never tell him these things because they would only serve to cause more damage when all I really want is to generate positivity for both of us.

I know he wants the same so...

All-in-all, I'm happy with how I handled it. Not perfect but it worked out.
__________________
"Although the most acute judges of the witches and even the witches themselves, were convinced of the guilt of witchery, the guilt nevertheless was non-existent. It is thus with all guilt."
-Friedrich Nietzsche

How can you claim to love someone with all your heart if you can't stand to let them love with all of theirs?
-me

[WretchedChan]

Post-post-script:

This whole thing turned bad. We basically had a conversation wherein he "mission creeped" the original cause of the breakup into something involving perceived manipulation on my part.

I have never, ever done anything to warrant this. He is clearly making mountains out of non-existent molehills, puts me in the defensive role over them and when I try to clarify/explain, has decided that it doesn't matter what I say, as far as he's concerned, my intent was to manipulate.

The original cause of the breakup: I asked to negotiate primary status and admitted to love for him. He said he was protecting me from heartbreak by ending intimacy with me.

What the situation has morphed into: 1. I (according to him) imposed an ultimatum in the first place (in honesty: I did recoil in pain when he said "no" to primary and was ready at first to end the relationship but after taking a couple hours to consider it calmly, I chilled out and was happy to work it out). And 2. the next day, I said something he took entirely the wrong way. I worded it very poorly and without clarification, I can agree that it probably sounded pretty awful. I basically gave him the impression that I was stating that seeing him was the only thing keeping me from becoming unhinged.

Any attempt at clarification has failed. He simply will not see my side and stubbornly insists that's what I was trying to do.

I am starting to believe there's some motive for his believing this but I don't know what it could be. It's just ridiculous: in 4 years, I've never given any reason for him to doubt my credibility, nor have I failed to admit a wrong or be accountable for a mistake. Now I'm a manipulator and a liar? I don't understand.

I know my heart and I know my intent and it's not fair that I've been tried, convicted and dismissed. He never asked what I meant before making this judgment call, he simply told me that he's very adept at recognizing manipulation because he's been trained in spotting it (in a fashion) and that this is just plain what I did. Period.

I can't imagine why someone would cling so firmly to this unless there was some personal reason. And the craziest part is that I've met many of his prior S/Os and many of them are not as straightforward, candid, rational and willing to compromise as I have been.

Maybe I'm supposed to see that I've been jettisoned as both lover and friend and when I didn't make that easy by being a bitch and giving him a reason to dismiss me, he had to make one up?

Or maybe I really am nuts.

Either way, I don't understand why someone who insists I tried to manipulate them would still want to be my friend. It makes no sense: "You're a sneaky, self-serving person who tries to get what she wants by using underhanded tactics...but we can still be pals?" Really?
__________________
"Although the most acute judges of the witches and even the witches themselves, were convinced of the guilt of witchery, the guilt nevertheless was non-existent. It is thus with all guilt."
-Friedrich Nietzsche

How can you claim to love someone with all your heart if you can't stand to let them love with all of theirs?
-me
Last edited by stargazer23; 06-20-2011 at 03:03 AM.
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This weekend, I spent time at a party/electronic music event and had planned on meeting one of my interests there. We've been texting like crazy for weeks now and it was finally a good chance to talk in a little more one-on-one way over drinks in a casual setting

He showed up an hour or so after I did and we sat down together and started to talk over drinks. At one point we started kissing and things felt really really good.

Things were going well until I told point blank that I'm poly...and something in his face changed. The tone went instantly from being sort of intimate and sweet to him being sort of hyper. He suddenly turned UBER excitable and silly and jokey. Then he sort of...pulled from me. He got very social and distracted and sort of stopped paying attention to me in favor of other friends. I figured I'd just let him greet his friends and come back to him later so I drifted off for awhile.

When I found him again, I tried to break the ice by kissing him again but it was weird, felt dark. Not warm like before. He became sort of...rude. He made some innuendo-type jokes that made me feel a little demeaned. Then he flat out told me: "Don't worry about me, I'm undateable. But that's okay, you are too, right? I mean, that's what you are, you don't want to commit to anybody right?"

I tried to explain that he had it wrong, that's not what that means at all. Tried to explain, explain, explain... I asked him "Why are you acting like this all the sudden?"

He said "Like what? I act like this all the time. Don't worry about me, let's just be friends, okay?"

Ouch.

I'm doin it wrong.
__________________
"Although the most acute judges of the witches and even the witches themselves, were convinced of the guilt of witchery, the guilt nevertheless was non-existent. It is thus with all guilt."
-Friedrich Nietzsche

How can you claim to love someone with all your heart if you can't stand to let them love with all of theirs?
-me






FUCK THE MAN>>>>>>


FREEDOM OF INFORMATION!

[Nephew Twiddleton]

So wait:

FYI WretchedChan is NAVKAT..........

Good news....bad news. Bad news I'm getting a divorce. Good news...if you could call it that (trying to be positive), is that I have discovered she (NAVKAT), slept with a Earl Scioneaux III of New Orleans on on of her many trips to New Orleans, and made out with at least two men other of which I know who he is....

So.... are you Navcat or not?

Because if you're not, spreading her business up here is kinda douchey and not really any of our business, nor is it relevant to her posting here.

Also, tl;dr;nmfba (not my fucking business anyway)

[Dysfunctional Cunt]

So wait:

FYI WretchedChan is NAVKAT..........

Good news....bad news. Bad news I'm getting a divorce. Good news...if you could call it that (trying to be positive), is that I have discovered she (NAVKAT), slept with a Earl Scioneaux III of New Orleans on on of her many trips to New Orleans, and made out with at least two men other of which I know who he is....

So.... are you Navcat or not?

Because if you're not, spreading her business up here is kinda douchey and not really any of our business, nor is it relevant to her posting here.

Also, tl;dr;nmfba (not my fucking business anyway)

I have to agree with Twid here.  WTF?  I didn't read much past where I don't know if you are talking about yourself in the 3rd person or if you aren't NAVCAT and are  putting her life online which, I agree with Twid is not cool.

[Nephew Twiddleton]

So wait:

FYI WretchedChan is NAVKAT..........

Good news....bad news. Bad news I'm getting a divorce. Good news...if you could call it that (trying to be positive), is that I have discovered she (NAVKAT), slept with a Earl Scioneaux III of New Orleans on on of her many trips to New Orleans, and made out with at least two men other of which I know who he is....

So.... are you Navcat or not?

Because if you're not, spreading her business up here is kinda douchey and not really any of our business, nor is it relevant to her posting here.

Also, tl;dr;nmfba (not my fucking business anyway)

I have to agree with Twid here.  WTF?  I didn't read much past where I don't know if you are talking about yourself in the 3rd person or if you aren't NAVCAT and are  putting her life online which, I agree with Twid is not cool.

If it is NavCat, somehow gone nuts and referring to herself in the third person, I might plod through this to see what's going on. Might.

But until then, I'm not reading this. And if it's not NavCat, I don't want to hear anything they have to say. People break up, get over it.

[Salty]

If this is some asshole airing out navkat's laundry, dirty or not, than this asshole can go fuck herself blind. Also, IF this isn't navkat but is instead some asshole (which, admittedly, would free me of some confusion) that asshole can also shove any proof she as up her ass so hard she chokes on it.

Would someone care to clarify? Elucidate us, please.

[Salty]

Ok i read that, like, three times.
2 things.

1: WAT
2: Why is this in OKM?
(follow up question: Or anywhere?)

But mostly #1.

[Nephew Twiddleton]

I'm just as confused as you dude.

[Eater of Clowns]

Didn't read.  Reported to moderator.

There've been quite a few posters, myself included, who have had to deal with bullshit like you're trying to pull right now.

Get fucked.

[Salty]

It seems an awful lot like someone is stalking navkat and is posting her "dirty laundry" (I'm using quotes because I could not find what it was exactly in those posts that made anybody a whore, for example: No one was paid to have sex. I may have missed something).

But that couldn't be because nobody is that much of a stupid asshole.

Aww, I know what you guys are gonna say next...

[Nephew Twiddleton]

Didn't read.  Reported to moderator.

There've been quite a few posters, myself included, who have had to deal with bullshit like you're trying to pull right now.

Get fucked.

Good call dude.

Twid,
Forgot we had that button.

[Pæs]

This thread is now about how Navcat is awesome. Unless the navcat moniker is all 'OP is me' that shit is tl;dr.

Know who is awesome, guys?  Navcat.

[Nephew Twiddleton]

You know what? I always hated her avatar, but now, I suddenly like it.

Hear that douchbag?

I LIKE NAVKAT MORE AS A RESULT OF THIS THREAD.

MISSION UNACCOMPLISHED.

[Nephew Twiddleton]

This thread is now about how Navcat is awesome. Unless the navcat moniker is all 'OP is me' that shit is tl;dr.

Know who is awesome, guys?  Navcat.

You know, as far as my memory goes back, NavKat's always been a good shit.

[Payne]

It's an instruction to troll http://www.polyamory.com/forum

OBEY YOUR MASTERS