Hollywood Must Be Destroyed

[Prelate Diogenes Shandor]

I believe you also mentioned something about not buying first hand music. This suggests that you are somehow getting your music without giving the artist their due. If youre buying a used cd cool. Otherwise second hand seems to indicate piracy.

The implication was supposed to be to buy secondhand. I shall make that explicit.

[The Good Reverend Roger]

This manifesto is supposed to be more directed to the people who already have some inclination to make their own free stuff purely to express themselves to get off their asses and do it.

Okay, but you're going to need more than just AKK to make a difference.

[Prelate Diogenes Shandor]

I believe you also mentioned something about not buying first hand music. This suggests that you are somehow getting your music without giving the artist their due. If youre buying a used cd cool. Otherwise second hand seems to indicate piracy.

The implication was supposed to be to buy secondhand. I shall make that explicit.

Ok, I've fixed it.

[The Good Reverend Roger]

I believe you also mentioned something about not buying first hand music. This suggests that you are somehow getting your music without giving the artist their due. If youre buying a used cd cool. Otherwise second hand seems to indicate piracy.

The implication was supposed to be to buy secondhand. I shall make that explicit.

You're still fucking the artist, but at least you're supporting a brick & mortar store Ebay.

[AFK]

There is still an implication here that any artist that is considered "mainstream" is part of the problem and needs to be punished.  Just to put that into perspective, that would mean a band like Sonic Youth, who have been a major label recording artist.  Now, anyone who knows anything about Thurston Moore and the Youth would know that they don't exactly fit into the same mold as a band like Metallica that's bitched and moaned about Napster, et al.  But they signed with a major label, in part, to cast a wider net with their music and get more people into what the art they are producing. 

I dunno, this seems rather akin to an idea of being pissed off about the War in Iraq and spitting on the soldiers to punish the lawmakers that put them in the dessert.  Entertainers deserve to be paid and supported like any other person working and creating a product in the USA.  "Destroying Hollywood" isn't going to accomplish what you think it will accomplish, and you'll be taking out a whole host of hard-working Americans while the Fat Cats remain fat. 

[The Good Reverend Roger]

There is still an implication here that any artist that is considered "mainstream" is part of the problem and needs to be punished.

With the exception of James Hetfield¹, I'm with you on this one.  Being good at what you do is no reason to be punished.




¹  His whining makes me want bad things to happen to him.  And his cat.

[AFK]

You'll get no argument from me there. 

[Q. G. Pennyworth]

There is still an implication here that any artist that is considered "mainstream" is part of the problem and needs to be punished.  Just to put that into perspective, that would mean a band like Sonic Youth, who have been a major label recording artist.  Now, anyone who knows anything about Thurston Moore and the Youth would know that they don't exactly fit into the same mold as a band like Metallica that's bitched and moaned about Napster, et al.  But they signed with a major label, in part, to cast a wider net with their music and get more people into what the art they are producing. 

I dunno, this seems rather akin to an idea of being pissed off about the War in Iraq and spitting on the soldiers to punish the lawmakers that put them in the dessert.  Entertainers deserve to be paid and supported like any other person working and creating a product in the USA.  "Destroying Hollywood" isn't going to accomplish what you think it will accomplish, and you'll be taking out a whole host of hard-working Americans while the Fat Cats remain fat.

Whether a band deserves to be compensated for their artistic efforts or not I think is pretty well agreed upon ITT (yes, they fucking do). Choosing not to purchase from any label would just be the most intellectually sound way of trying to get at what the original goal here kind of was (to punish the machine that is distributing content and also being dickholes). While that in theory could hurt some artists who are already on labels, that does not prevent artists from leaving labels to go the independent distribution route, nor does it constitute theft in any meaningful sense (unless you are then pirating their music instead of doing without).
Alternatively, I could see trying to convince people to pirate everything and then mail $20 to the artists directly, but a) people are dicks and wouldn't mail it in and b) that's a shitty way of doing things to begin with.

[Nephew Twiddleton]

That concept gave me a chuckle.

Include the sound engineer on that bad idea too though. Thats a lot of work too.

[kingyak]

A little nit-picky, I realize, but a boycott on any artist that signs with a label is also too broad. There are a lot of small labels that are not part of the problem and who treat their artists fairly and are actually fulfilling the useful role of handling a lot of the day-to-day business and promotion stuff that the artist can't handle themselves (John Prine's Oh Boy! Records comes to mind, but I'm sure there are a lot more). By boycotting all labels, you'd actually hurt labels who are doing what they're supposed to be doing. A real movement against the entertainment industry would require identifying the players that are causing a problem as well as the ones who are acting in good faith and educating people on which labels should and should not be supported. Otherwise, you're more likely to destroy a lot of good labels without doing any significant damage to the bad (on the off chance you destroy the bad labels along with the good, you're just creating a vacuum that will be filled with new and equally bad players). Of course, that kind of thing would require actual legwork and research and isn't nearly as cool as shouting "BURN IT DOWN!"

[The Good Reverend Roger]

A little nit-picky, I realize, but a boycott on any artist that signs with a label is also too broad. There are a lot of small labels that are not part of the problem and who treat their artists fairly and are actually fulfilling the useful role of handling a lot of the day-to-day business and promotion stuff that the artist can't handle themselves (John Prine's Oh Boy! Records comes to mind, but I'm sure there are a lot more). By boycotting all labels, you'd actually hurt labels who are doing what they're supposed to be doing. A real movement against the entertainment industry would require identifying the players that are causing a problem as well as the ones who are acting in good faith and educating people on which labels should and should not be supported. Otherwise, you're more likely to destroy a lot of good labels without doing any significant damage to the bad (on the off chance you destroy the bad labels along with the good, you're just creating a vacuum that will be filled with new and equally bad players). Of course, that kind of thing would require actual legwork and research and isn't nearly as cool as shouting "BURN IT DOWN!"

Now you've done it.  You've brought NUANCE into it, and that means PDS might have to THINK, instead of getting his KNEE JERK on, which is - at least in his mind - less likely to get him laid with hipster/trustafarian chicks.

[Freeky]

Lol, "Can't kill the king without capturing a few pawns."

Tell me, PDS, how are you any different from people who rationalize bad shit by saying "You can't make an omelette without breaking a few eggs"?  I am somehow relating this saying to children dying in horrible, violent ways, but I don't know what particular thing I heard this about.

[Mesozoic Mister Nigel]

I haven't traced all of the big four to their umbrella corps, but it looks like they may all be owned by the big five information corporations... which would make it not entirely unlikely that this is really about controlling information on the internet. The big five already (for all practical purposes) own the airwaves and print, so it makes sense that the internet would be their next bid.

One of them is Disney.

Just saying.

Yep. Another one traces back to Comcast.

SOPA and PIPA have nothing to do with copyright protection. They have to do with media control.

Actually, I've got the current list at the house.  I'll be happy to post it when I get home.

Please do!

[Mesozoic Mister Nigel]

Lol, "Can't kill the king without capturing a few pawns."

Tell me, PDS, how are you any different from people who rationalize bad shit by saying "You can't make an omelette without breaking a few eggs"?  I am somehow relating this saying to children dying in horrible, violent ways, but I don't know what particular thing I heard this about.

But didn't Iraq show us that collateral damage is hunky dory?

[Freeky]

Lol, "Can't kill the king without capturing a few pawns."

Tell me, PDS, how are you any different from people who rationalize bad shit by saying "You can't make an omelette without breaking a few eggs"?  I am somehow relating this saying to children dying in horrible, violent ways, but I don't know what particular thing I heard this about.

But didn't Iraq show us that collateral damage is hunky dory?

:foam: