A curiosity about the South, for people who live here

[The Good Reverend Roger]

There was a controversy a couple months ago about a girl in Georgia wearing a prom dress made out of a Confederate flag.
Funny thing is, it turned all racial, angry cultural, and "You're suppressing my rights!" When it simply did not fit the prom dress/tuxedo category that was required at the prom XD

How did it not meet the criteria?

[The Dark Monk]

It was in Tennessee, sorry about that.

Apparently it was too casual and "racey". She was also told months before-hand since the school had racism issues that it wouldn't be allowed.

Tennesean.com:

School officials said a teacher warned Edwards about two months ago that the dress might not be acceptable. The teacher, who served as prom sponsor, expressed concern and suggested to Edwards in February that she should clear the idea with the principal, but Edwards did not do so, said Eddie Pruett, director of schools for the Gibson County School System.




By Janice Broach


MEMPHIS, TN - (WMC-TV) – A Mid-South teen is banned from prom for wearing a dress that resembles a confederate battle flag.

"It wasn't done to offend anybody," Texanna Edwards explained of her dress. "It was done just for the sole fact that I just wanted a rebel flag dress because I thought it was cool."

But the principal at Gibson High in West Tennessee did not think it was cool.  Edwards, a senior at the school, tried to wear the dress that she helped design to the prom Saturday night.  She also wore a rebel flag necklace.

"He told us y'all have to leave because the dress is inappropriate," Edwards said.

Texanna, who plans to become a veterinarian, said she almost cried, "I felt like it but I was more mad."

Edit due to additional thought:
It seems to be the whole thing was blown out of proportion due to the fact "She simply thought it was cool." when she was, again, warned in advance. It doesn't seem like rights suppression to me, more of "I don't believe it is appropriate, don't wear it."

[I_Kicked_Kennedy]

I'm trying to think of some way of modifying a classic quote into something pertaining to the current state of political idiocy. Here's the quote:

"Your liberty to swing your fist ends where my nose begins."

Simply, I am sick of idiot yokels doing something absolutely abhorrent, and claiming their rights have been infringed upon. Like the confederate flag dress, or when a church organizes a "let's piss on the grave of some little girl that died of AIDS" rally, and when the public (rightfully so) says "Hell no" they cry and scream "Waaaaaahhhhh. You're infringing upon my first amendment rights! Waaaaaahhhhh...."

[The Good Reverend Roger]

She was also told months before-hand since the school had racism issues that it wouldn't be allowed.

Then it is supression of free expression.

Again, protected speech/expression is not there for popular or appropriate expression.

[The Good Reverend Roger]

Simply, I am sick of idiot yokels doing something absolutely abhorrent, and claiming their rights have been infringed upon. Like the confederate flag dress, or when a church organizes a "let's piss on the grave of some little girl that died of AIDS" rally, and when the public (rightfully so) says "Hell no" they cry and scream "Waaaaaahhhhh. You're infringing upon my first amendment rights! Waaaaaahhhhh...."

Then move to North Korea.  They don't allow that sort of shit.

[Cain]

I've noticed a lot of Army surplus stores in Prague seem to have the Confederate flag flying.

Then again, it could just be the case that, over here, it's a flag people don't initially recognise, and so makes them curious, rather than some quaint Czech expression of support for slave-owning aristocrats.

[The Dark Monk]

She was also told months before-hand since the school had racism issues that it wouldn't be allowed.

Then it is supression of free expression.

Again, protected speech/expression is not there for popular or appropriate expression.

The Tennessee Department of Education Office of Civil Rights (TOCR) is charged with the responsibility of investigating, ensuring and enforcing compliance with Title VI of the Civil Rights Act of 1964, 42 U.S.C. §2000d, and Title IX of the Education Amendments of 1972, 20 U.S.C §1681, against ALL Local Education Agencies as defined in the Case Resolution and Investigation Manual. Title VI prohibits discrimination or harassment based on race, color or national origin in all programs or activities receiving federal financial assistance, and Title IX prohibits discrimination or harassment based on sex in all programs or activities receiving federal financial assistance.

Herein lies the problem, should someone find this racist, they answer to this. Their rights based on the Civil Rights Act ensures against racism as a whole. As such, it clashes with the freedom of expression, and since it is a state school and the state has a budget from the government which is federal it complicates things.

The responsibility for K-12 education rests with the states under the Constitution. There is also a compelling national interest in the quality of the nation's public schools. Therefore, the federal government, through the legislative process, provides assistance to the states and schools in an effort to supplement, not supplant, state support. The primary source of federal K-12 support began in 1965 with the enactment of the Elementary and Secondary Education Act (ESEA).

Since people also sue over every little thing they can, that also wastes money through the school hiring lawyers, wastes people's time on something simply not worth it.  Depending on who you talk to, it is a suppression of rights on one or the other side, as that too people have the right to not feel harassed or endangered in school or work. This too, has within itself an issue, of "Does everyone think this is okay?" which is a risk of destroying funding for the rest of the children there. They have to tiptoe around the feelings of the parents and children who go there. From what I see, there is no stomping on the legal rights of anyone at all, though the law favors in tiers. How this became a non-stomp is this one reason: This symbol is used as an identifier in the public eye as racism.
You are correct that it is a suppression of  what some would feel as human rights, however not American rights. It almost seems that as a whole the situation screwed itself. An overblown media centered on ''Change your dress." "No."

This is how I understand it, though I do remember something about you working in law enforcement, if I am wrong please correct me.

[The Good Reverend Roger]

You are correct that it is a suppression of  what some would feel as human rights, however not American rights.

That right there is a stinking load of bullshit.  I suggest you give amendment IX a quick read.

And there is a difference between denying someone their civil rights, and wearing something provocative.  Wearing a confederate flag may be a hallmark of a hick, but it is not "harrassment".  Civil rights work both ways, or they don't exist.

[tyrannosaurus vex]

The Confederate flag also is not inherently synonymous with racism or slavery. It can also express a general distrust of authority, a willingness to rebel against what one sees as overbearing government, or a desire to decorate one's orange '69 Charger and escape the grasp of clumsy law enforcement.

[The Dark Monk]

http://www.firstamendmentschools.org/freedoms/faq.aspx?id=12826

May a school punish a student for wearing Confederate flag attire?

It depends on whether the school officials can reasonably forecast that the wearing of the Confederate flag will lead to a substantial disruption of the school environment. In one decision, a court rejected a student's First Amendment right to wear a Confederate flag jacket because the school officials had cited "several incidents of racial tension." According to the court, "school officials are not required to wait until disorder or invasion occurs" but only need "the existence of facts which might reasonably lead school officials to forecast substantial disruption."

Since the school before had racial issues, this court ruling applies. Thus upholding the schools judgements, it is flimsy though as there have been courts upholding and banishing decisions like these as they come up, as seen here:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tinker_v._Des_Moines_Independent_Community_School_District

[The Good Reverend Roger]

The Confederate flag also is not inherently synonymous with racism or slavery. It can also express a general distrust of authority, a willingness to rebel against what one sees as overbearing government, or a desire to decorate one's orange '69 Charger and escape the grasp of clumsy law enforcement.

Actually, I think it is indeed a symbol of a system that endorsed racism and slavery.  But that doesn't mean it can't be displayed.

[The Good Reverend Roger]

http://www.firstamendmentschools.org/freedoms/faq.aspx?id=12826

May a school punish a student for wearing Confederate flag attire?

It depends on whether the school officials can reasonably forecast that the wearing of the Confederate flag will lead to a substantial disruption of the school environment. In one decision, a court rejected a student's First Amendment right to wear a Confederate flag jacket because the school officials had cited "several incidents of racial tension." According to the court, "school officials are not required to wait until disorder or invasion occurs" but only need "the existence of facts which might reasonably lead school officials to forecast substantial disruption."

Since the school before had racial issues, this court ruling applies. Thus upholding the schools judgements, it is flimsy though as there have been courts upholding and banishing decisions like these as they come up, as seen here:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tinker_v._Des_Moines_Independent_Community_School_District

Yeah, that's great.  But the decisions of the court system has not always reflected the cause of civil rights, and in this case it doesn't.  We are not discussing the law or the interpretations of that law, but the actual civil liberties involved, which is an entirely separate thing. 

Seriously, asking people to accept the decisions of the US government as the standard for civil liberties is just plain silly.

[tyrannosaurus vex]

The Confederate flag also is not inherently synonymous with racism or slavery. It can also express a general distrust of authority, a willingness to rebel against what one sees as overbearing government, or a desire to decorate one's orange '69 Charger and escape the grasp of clumsy law enforcement.

Actually, I think it is indeed a symbol of a system that endorsed racism and slavery.  But that doesn't mean it can't be displayed.

Alas, as with Nazi uniforms, the Confederate flag looks cool but it's impossible to divorce it from it's morally corrupt origins. I dream of a parallel universe where the bad guys always wear jeans and t-shirts, and the good guys get to look cool.

[The Dark Monk]

I disagree but I have also been up for 24 hours, and it's time to hit the sack after feeding little girl :P

I do wish to discuss the 9th amendment however, sometime soon ^.^ I quite enjoy this 
I missed PD.

Also I bring up "Obscenity" for later in case we discuss more on this so I remember where I'm at LOL

[The Good Reverend Roger]

The Confederate flag also is not inherently synonymous with racism or slavery. It can also express a general distrust of authority, a willingness to rebel against what one sees as overbearing government, or a desire to decorate one's orange '69 Charger and escape the grasp of clumsy law enforcement.

Actually, I think it is indeed a symbol of a system that endorsed racism and slavery.  But that doesn't mean it can't be displayed.

Alas, as with Nazi uniforms, the Confederate flag looks cool but it's impossible to divorce it from it's morally corrupt origins. I dream of a parallel universe where the bad guys always wear jeans and t-shirts, and the good guys get to look cool.

Yeah, one of the many crimes of 20th century fascism is that they ruined the snappy black uniform forever.