The Porn Princess Rant, Re-Written

[Ayotollah of Ass]

Mine is not a puritan bias at all, and more of a socialist worker's rights bias, and a feminist bias. If there is no dire financial need, someone is a hardcore exhibitionist and really wants to film themselves fucking and has agency to do this or anything else to make money, then I'm cool with it. I'm just pretty sure this example is pretty unicorn-like, and do not wish for my money or revenue generated from advertising related to my usage of free sites to further the exploitative parts of the industry.  If I ever watch anything like that I want to be 100% sure that the performers have agency and that there is genuine enthusiastic consent. If you add to the serious lack of focus on genuine female pleasure in a majority of porn to the too often racist and misogynistic attitudes in the films then I'm out.

What I don't want to be complicit in is this kind of event. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lara_Roxx, who in a double anal scene caught HIV after being in porn for 2 months.

What is also unicorn-like are these kinds of requirements for exploitation, and what makes it special is its sex. Are you as concerned about your local corporation's management serious lack of focus on their employees enjoying their work? Probably not, because sex work is different. Are you as concerned about health care providers, law enforcement, etc. getting HIV through needlestick injuries - and have this same standard that this should NEVER happen? It wouldn't make sense. But, why does it make sense here rather than some basic common sense protocol for preventing transmission? No, instead, the solution is how about we just try abstinence. You don't really NEED to have sex, after all. That dog's not going to hunt.

The bottom line is that human sexuality is filled with all kinds of dark, horry desires. And while there's a place for feminist critique, the place for it isn't in evaluating other people's kink or trying to fence it in so that its safe. It's never going to be safe.

So you're only going to address the individual components, and ignore the social aspects entirely?

If you want to offer up a social theory about the negative effects of pornography, I'm all ears. But, this thread thus far, unless I missed something, didn't have much of one. I think my comment above gets to my first thoughts on the matter. Social control of an individual's sexuality, beyond the kinds of obvious things such as consent and getting more into the realm of feminist critique of allowing or disallowing certain desires as approved or not approved, is not generally something I'd want to endorse.

Everything turns some part of you into a commidity.  A carpenter sells his skills.  A scientist sells his knowledge.  Prostitutes and porn stars sell their own persons.

As long as it isn't something "special", then that's great. One of my objections here is that it often is treated as special. Commodify a woman's work at the check out counter? Great. As soon as she decides to make some money by lifting her skirt and making her vagina the center of her work rather than her arms, then it's all sisters of the world unite. Maybe this is right, but I'm not a woman. So, maybe there's a lot going on here I don't understand.

[Dildo Argentino]

Ayotollah, let me state that to my ears you sound like sense.

Everything turns some part of you into a commidity.  A carpenter sells his skills.  A scientist sells his knowledge.  Prostitutes and porn stars sell their own persons.

As a prostitute (a frontal lobe prostitute, FLP for short) I protest. We never sell our persons, only capacities, competencies, and our time.

The people who sell their persons are the persons who are taken in by pernicious ideology (there's a great variety of flavours on offer) and decide to let go of their lives so that others may take hold of it for them. You know the old adage about giving up freedom for security and not deserving either? That's selling your person. A bit of honest prostitution is not.

[LMNO]

I'd just like to point out that non-sexual employment tends to be vastly different than sexual employment, not just because of social mores; there are fundamentally different physical and chemical forces at play, because of the biology of sex.  Sex as a job simply doesn't equate to installing kitchens or entering data as a job, because of the endocrine cascade that sex produces.

[The Good Reverend Roger]

As a prostitute (a frontal lobe prostitute, FLP for short) I protest.

A what?

[Dildo Argentino]

I'd just like to point out that non-sexual employment tends to be vastly different than sexual employment, not just because of social mores; there are fundamentally different physical and chemical forces at play, because of the biology of sex.  Sex as a job simply doesn't equate to installing kitchens or entering data as a job, because of the endocrine cascade that sex produces.

Yes, but on the other hand it is not fundamentally different (in that way, I mean) to acting or dancing or the circus or making music (the performing arts) as forms of earning money: all of those, if they are any good, involve tremendous hormonal cascades in the performer as well.

[Verbal Mike]

I'd just like to point out that non-sexual employment tends to be vastly different than sexual employment, not just because of social mores; there are fundamentally different physical and chemical forces at play, because of the biology of sex.  Sex as a job simply doesn't equate to installing kitchens or entering data as a job, because of the endocrine cascade that sex produces.

THIS.

[The Good Reverend Roger]

I'd just like to point out that non-sexual employment tends to be vastly different than sexual employment, not just because of social mores; there are fundamentally different physical and chemical forces at play, because of the biology of sex.  Sex as a job simply doesn't equate to installing kitchens or entering data as a job, because of the endocrine cascade that sex produces.

Yes, but on the other hand it is not fundamentally different (in that way, I mean) to acting or dancing or the circus or making music (the performing arts) as forms of earning money: all of those, if they are any good, involve tremendous hormonal cascades in the performer as well.

So, wait.  A musician and a prostitute have the same job stress?

[LMNO]

I'd just like to point out that non-sexual employment tends to be vastly different than sexual employment, not just because of social mores; there are fundamentally different physical and chemical forces at play, because of the biology of sex.  Sex as a job simply doesn't equate to installing kitchens or entering data as a job, because of the endocrine cascade that sex produces.

Yes, but on the other hand it is not fundamentally different (in that way, I mean) to acting or dancing or the circus or making music (the performing arts) as forms of earning money: all of those, if they are any good, involve tremendous hormonal cascades in the performer as well.

Um.  No.  I mean, yes there are emotions generated during performance, but no, you can't compare it to sex.

[Freeky]

As a prostitute (a frontal lobe prostitute, FLP for short) I protest.

A what?

[Dildo Argentino]

As a prostitute (a frontal lobe prostitute, FLP for short) I protest.

A what?

Well I'm a freelance translator. Anyone, provided they pay appropriately, can push their shit through my brain. If they push English, it comes out Hungarian. If they push Hungarian, it comes out in English. Some (few) kinks, such as Heavy Legal^TM, and Ultra Heavy Science^TM and anything written by a handful of Hungarian celebs/politicos I don't do, but sufficient reward will tempt me to research new areas of kink in order to be able to work them. I say that's prostitution. And genitals may get called private parts, but the brain is actually closer to the core of the individual, I think.

[The Good Reverend Roger]

As a prostitute (a frontal lobe prostitute, FLP for short) I protest.

A what?

Well I'm a freelance translator. Anyone, provided they pay appropriately, can push their shit through my brain. If they push English, it comes out Hungarian. If they push Hungarian, it comes out in English. Some (few) kinks, such as Heavy Legal^TM, and Ultra Heavy Science^TM and anything written by a handful of Hungarian celebs/politicos I don't do, but sufficient reward will tempt me to research new areas of kink in order to be able to work them. I say that's prostitution. And genitals may get called private parts, but the brain is actually closer to the core of the individual, I think.

And you are equating this with a job requiring you to have sex with people that disgust you?

Very nice.

[Verbal Mike]

I've worked in translation, and I find the comparison offensive in its tastelessness and trivialization of something you and I have not personally experienced, holist.

[Dildo Argentino]

I'd just like to point out that non-sexual employment tends to be vastly different than sexual employment, not just because of social mores; there are fundamentally different physical and chemical forces at play, because of the biology of sex.  Sex as a job simply doesn't equate to installing kitchens or entering data as a job, because of the endocrine cascade that sex produces.

Yes, but on the other hand it is not fundamentally different (in that way, I mean) to acting or dancing or the circus or making music (the performing arts) as forms of earning money: all of those, if they are any good, involve tremendous hormonal cascades in the performer as well.

So, wait.  A musician and a prostitute have the same job stress?

Well that's I think an overly simplistic question and of course I am not saying that. But I think there is overlap. And I am pretty certain that some prostitutes (I've known a few, not as a punter I hasten to add) and some porn actresses (a few years after we split up, my first ever girlfriend dabbled for a few months, got out of the financial tight spot and quit, said she knew many others who did this) have significantly less job stress than many working musicians. I am also (just to make it clear) totally clear on the fact the exploitation in the sex industry can be quite heavy. Though I am sure you can think of examples of exploitation in the music business being also quite brutal.

[Freeky]

So, aiding communication between parties who would otherwise be unable to trade ideas = selling yourself as a dildo / fleshlight.


Wow. Great job, skippy.

[Dildo Argentino]

I've worked in translation, and I find the comparison offensive in its tastelessness and trivialization of something you and I have not personally experienced, holist.

Have you made a living and supported a large family on translation for seventeen years without any even marginally better possibilities, offers? I am sorry to have caused offence. And of course it is entirely possible to work in translation without it being prostitution. The way I am in this business, is nothing short of hiring out a precious body part to any solvent dick I don't find TOO offensive.