Unlimited "Guns, Fuck Yeah!" Thread

[AFK]

This thread is to celebrate the glory of American Gun Culture.  Because, Fuck Yeah, Guns!


What's a great Gun Show without a little accidental discharge?

http://usnews.nbcnews.com/_news/2013/01/19/16603029-three-accidentally-shot-at-north-carolina-gun-show-police-say?lite

[AFK]

In the US, gun deaths will top motor vehicle deaths in 2015.  Fuck Yeah Guns!


http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2012-12-19/american-gun-deaths-to-exceed-traffic-fatalities-by-2015.html

[AFK]

"The fall in traffic deaths resulted from safer vehicles, restricted privileges for young drivers and seat-belt and other laws, he said."


Wait, hold the phone!  Is he saying that policy changes brought down motor vehicle deaths??  HOLY FUCK!!!

[AFK]

87 gun deaths a day in the US.  A day!


http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2012/07/24/87-gun-deaths-a-day-why-the-colorado-shooting-is-tragically-unsurprising.html
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[/size]Guns...Fuck! ....yeah

[Mesozoic Mister Nigel]

I think it's fairly obvious that policy changes could act to reduce gun deaths... my guess is that you're preaching to the choir here, Reverend.

[AFK]

No, my friends, we don't have a problem at all with guns.  The NRA is right.  The Republican gun nuts are right.  The Democrat gun nuts are right.  Nope.  Everything is fine.  We don't need policy change.  We don't need gun control.  Everything is goddamned fine. 


87 deaths a day?  Psh!  They're all wrong people anyways.  We can just breed new ones.  Yeah, sure, we've made driving cars safer, but there's nothing in the Constitution about the right to bear Fords.  You touch our guns it's like you are exhuming the Founding Fathers and taking a big ole dump on their faces. 


You know what, fuck The Constitution, no really.  It was written by old men running around with goddamned muskets.  You weren't going to mow down 20 kids with a musket unless you sedated them and tied them to fucking trees.  The 2nd Amendment wasn't for morons with too much money and too few chromosomes to turn their basement into a goddamned armory.  It wasn't for half-cocked 22 year olds to wander around with rapid fire death machines. 


We absolutely have every right to limit citizen's access to these contraptions.  No one is actually going to, much less propose, taking everyone's guns away.  But for Christ's sake, you don't need military grade weapons, you just fucking don't. 


And it just becomes too precious when we are here in America on our pedestal looking at the awful savages over in the Middle East, all hungry for violence and terror...when we are killing 87 people a goddamned day with our unquestioning, unyielding, worship of the gun.  It's time for shit to change, it's LONG been time for shit to change. 


Of course no one will ever get serious about it.  Both sides of the aisle are completely morally compromised when it comes to this.  The D's will clutch their guns just as tightly as the R's.  The D's will offer weaksauce bullshit to appease the dupes in their party.  And it will work. 


And another 87 people will die tomorrow.

[East Coast Hustle]

Thing is, none of the guns used in the recent school shootings or other mass shootings were military grade weapons.

Military rifles have a fire selection feature that allows the user to toggle between single shot semi-auto and full-auto, sometimes with an intermediate 3 round burst option. While it is technically legal in some cases to own fully automatic weaponry, it's HIGHLY regulated, extremely rare, and buying the stuff on the black market is VERY expensive (and comes with a fair amount of risk of being the subject of a sting operation). The reality is, a semi-automatic .223 rifle isn't a very powerful or dangerous thing, as guns go, and it isn't made any more dangerous by being painted black or being outfitted with a pistol grip or folding stock. That just makes it a varmint rifle for people with small penis complexes. The reality is, most hunting rifles are MUCH more powerful and even the ones that are bolt or lever-action can still be fired fast enough in familiar hands to do plenty of damage. And strictly in terms of fucking up the inner workings of another human, none of those compare to a shotgun and those don't even have to be aimed to be lethal. And yet nobody is talking about banning hunting rifles or shotguns. Just "assault" rifles, a category which seems to be determined purely on cosmetics.

Now, I'm not a raving gun nut. I am a gun owner. And frankly, I don't really care if the guns I own are legal or not. I'm also in favor of finding a way to reduce crime. I think any reasonable person would say they're in favor of that. I could be persuaded to engage in a constructive dialogue about gun control, and I could see myself being willing to vote for some gun control measures were a persuasive argument made for me to do so. I'm not one of those people who comes from a position of flat-out DON'T TOUCH MUH GUNS! but, and this is a very big "but", only if said dialogue comes from a rational position and that includes people who are anti-gun as well as people who are pro-gun. If you don't know anything ABOUT guns, you're coming from a position of fear and ignorance, and that's no place to be issuing policy from. So much of the gun-control dialogue I hear being bandied about displays a shocking lack of knowledge about the very subject people have firmly made up their minds about.

Also, and this is the real issue, if all the money that was spent on lobbying and bullshit on both sides of the gun-control aisle went instead to fund mental health research and treatment in this country, we might not be feeling such a pressing need to have this debate.

[East Coast Hustle]

And that point is made fairly frequently, it seems, and everybody says "YEAH THAT'S TOTALLY TRUE ITS MENTAL HEALTH THATS THE REAL ISSUE HERE" and then goes back to screeching about hurr dur dur guns.

[East Coast Hustle]

87 gun deaths a day in the US.  A day!


http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2012/07/24/87-gun-deaths-a-day-why-the-colorado-shooting-is-tragically-unsurprising.html
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[/size]Guns...Fuck! ....yeah

Does that number include suicides? Because it seems like that would be a very relevant distinction in the context of this discussion.

[AFK]

And that point is made fairly frequently, it seems, and everybody says "YEAH THAT'S TOTALLY TRUE ITS MENTAL HEALTH THATS THE REAL ISSUE HERE" and then goes back to screeching about hurr dur dur guns.

The problem with mental health in America is actually two-fold.  Yes, funding certainly is inadequate.  But along with that you have the stigma of mental health.  So you can increase funding and access to services, but if the stigma is still there, it won't matter because people won't come forward to seek those services.


Which illustrates why it is not an either/or situation.  We should be working to address gun access AND mental health access. 

[LMNO]

Ok, I don't have the study in front of me, and I'm on my phone so my Google Fu sucks, but:

There is a study that showed, and I suppose this is common sense when you think about it, people who have a gun in their home have a significantly higher probability of shooting their friends and family than an intruder. Which means if you have a gun in your home, you're probably going to shoot an innocent person.

Which, from a strictly statistical rationalist perspective, means that people would be much better off, on average, if they didn't have a gun in the house.

[Mesozoic Mister Nigel]

Everything you said above, and not just mental health, but general healthcare and economic health, as well.

[The Good Reverend Roger]

Lots of shit is dangerous in a free society.  Hell, the idea of the 4th amendment is dangerous.  It all boils down to a choice between authoritarianism and the perceived safety if promises, or a free and open society which is by nature dangerous.  I support the latter, for two reasons:  First, the safety promised by authoritarianism is illusory at best, and second, safety isn't particularly healthy for primate brains.  It's not what we're geared for...And in a society in which the safety Nazis pretty much run everything, I like the idea of keeping at least this sort of danger around.

[Mesozoic Mister Nigel]

All of you.

I really feel like this is a "yes" situation.

[AFK]

Lots of shit is dangerous in a free society.  Hell, the idea of the 4th amendment is dangerous.  It all boils down to a choice between authoritarianism and the perceived safety if promises, or a free and open society which is by nature dangerous.  I support the latter, for two reasons:  First, the safety promised by authoritarianism is illusory at best, and second, safety isn't particularly healthy for primate brains.  It's not what we're geared for...And in a society in which the safety Nazis pretty much run everything, I like the idea of keeping at least this sort of danger around.

I don't, especially when it results 6 year olds gunned down in schools.  I draw the line there.  Something has to change, if it means less freedom for gun owners, I'm perfectly fine with that.