Author Topic: Redemption  (Read 27011 times)

Pope Pixie Pickle

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Re: Redemption
« Reply #45 on: April 18, 2013, 05:00:58 pm »
It's not even a trigger thing. I mean, it severely squicks me out and I'm sure my past experiences, as well as being a parent, contribute to that, but also, I think that it's also generally a thing that you don't drop graphic, specific, and gratuitous descriptions of grotesque violence into a conversation because it tends to elicit a negative response from most people.

Navkat, if these things are in your head and you can't keep yourself from saying them, get counseling, because you will alienate people by blurting them out inappropriately.

The more you know.

Yea, I mean I have a particular trigger. If I'm wanred about it, I can brush it off. if it's properly foreshadowed in movies or books etc I can cope. Random images of domestic violence will stick in my head for HOURS. Case in point- Watched Alien with my feminist group, absolutely fine. Fried Green Tomatoes without being warned. Nope.

I wasn't sure if Nigel gets triggered by stuff like that, but she definitely gets uncomfortable, and yanno, you cannot tell these things, so it's best if you don't want to cause someone emotional distress of some kind to modify your language if you actually give a shit about other peoples feelings (My personal view, YMMV). And just because you can cope with that shit, doesn't mean that in future you won't, and that what you think about dealing with trauma applies to everyone. It doesn't.

The Good Reverend Roger

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Re: Redemption
« Reply #46 on: April 18, 2013, 05:05:33 pm »
I get the urge to educate and yell at them.

Those are mutually exclusive activities.  Just saying.
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- TGRR, raising the bar at work.

Pope Pixie Pickle

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Re: Redemption
« Reply #47 on: April 18, 2013, 05:07:21 pm »
I get the urge to educate and yell at them.

Those are mutually exclusive activities.  Just saying.

i attempt to educate, and if that fails, well I yelled.

navkat

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Re: Redemption
« Reply #48 on: April 18, 2013, 05:14:18 pm »
You can feel free to be forever "that chick who's NSFW because she talks about baby rape".

I mean, seriously Navkat, you taking the victim stance because for some reason you don't understand why that's socially unacceptable is kind of pathetic.

Right. Because that's what I'm notorious for.

And now I'm claiming victimhood and I'm kind of pathetic. Boy, my list of crimes and repugnant traits seem to have no ceiling. I never know what horrible things I'll discover about myself next.

Hey, did you ever think 1. I have my own "dark feelings" about the issue? or 2. There was a reason (aside from some frivolous act of literary dadaism) I made the choice to be specific/graphic?

And, I can't help but notice that you didn't bother to respond to my post until someone else chimed in to reinforce what I said, which tells me a lot about how much you give a flying fuck about my feelings.

Does it really? Did it occur to you that I may have tried to swallow it, back off and quietly ignore it for several days until it was opened back up for me to be reprimanded a second and a third time?

Nah. Couldn't be that. My response was totally about disrespecting you. How pathetic.

It's not even a trigger thing. I mean, it severely squicks me out and I'm sure my past experiences, as well as being a parent, contribute to that, but also, I think that it's also generally a thing that you don't drop graphic, specific, and gratuitous descriptions of grotesque violence into a conversation because it tends to elicit a negative response from most people.

Navkat, if these things are in your head and you can't keep yourself from saying them, get counseling, because you will alienate people by blurting them out inappropriately.

The more you know.

Funny, I didn't find it gratuitous. The idea touches some pretty dark shit in my head also. There was a very deliberate reason why I chose to let that little monster take a shit on the coffee table.

My only regret is that it was too much for people and therefore, ineffective at communicating my point.

I just wanted to make that clear in case someone it tempted to lecture me about how ineffective it was at communicating my point.

You are free to return to calling me a horrible person now.

Mesozoic Mister Nigel

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Re: Redemption
« Reply #49 on: April 18, 2013, 05:26:00 pm »
"Quietly backing off" is pretty much the same thing as "ignoring it until it goes away". Not responding is, in fact, disrespectful, regardless of how you want to spin it. It sends a pretty clear message that you don't give a shit and that my feelings and opinions are not important enough to merit a response. If that's not the message you intended to send, you might reconsider your approach.

The monsters inside your head are not my problem. If you can't control yourself, then I won't read your posts. Thanks for letting me know that's what I need to do.



Im guessing it was January 2007, a meeting in Bethesda, we got a bag of bees and just started smashing them on the desk, Charles Wick said. It was very complicated.


Mesozoic Mister Nigel

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Re: Redemption
« Reply #50 on: April 18, 2013, 05:28:37 pm »

And now I'm claiming victimhood and I'm kind of pathetic. Boy, my list of crimes and repugnant traits seem to have no ceiling. I never know what horrible things I'll discover about myself next.

Quote
You are free to return to calling me a horrible person now.

FYI, this is what I was referring to. It's very blown out of proportion to the actual criticism, and it reeks of black-and-white thinking.
Im guessing it was January 2007, a meeting in Bethesda, we got a bag of bees and just started smashing them on the desk, Charles Wick said. It was very complicated.


The Good Reverend Roger

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Re: Redemption
« Reply #51 on: April 18, 2013, 05:32:19 pm »
My only regret is that it was too much for people and therefore, ineffective at communicating my point.

Read that to yourself just one more time, please.
" It's just that Depeche Mode were a bunch of optimistic loveburgers."
- TGRR, shaming himself forever, 7/8/2017

 "Billy, when I say that ethics is our number one priority and safety is also our number one priority, you should take that to mean exactly what I said. Also quality. That's our number one priority as well. Don't look at me that way, you're in the corporate world now and this is how it works."
- TGRR, raising the bar at work.

navkat

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Re: Redemption
« Reply #52 on: April 18, 2013, 06:22:24 pm »
"Quietly backing off" is pretty much the same thing as "ignoring it until it goes away". Not responding is, in fact, disrespectful, regardless of how you want to spin it. It sends a pretty clear message that you don't give a shit and that my feelings and opinions are not important enough to merit a response. If that's not the message you intended to send, you might reconsider your approach.

The monsters inside your head are not my problem. If you can't control yourself, then I won't read your posts. Thanks for letting me know that's what I need to do.

Now I'm spinning shit. I'm a liar too! And no matter what I say about my thought process, your perception of my feelings takes precedence.

I'm sorry but I dealt with all that "If you don't chase me to find out what's wrong, it's because you don't respect me! YES IT IS!" hissy fit bullshit from my mom as a kid. It's a losing battle. Every. Single. Time. If you choose to perceive my letting it drop as an act of disrespect, I'm sorry for your self-induced experience of having been slighted. Can't help ya.


And now I'm claiming victimhood and I'm kind of pathetic. Boy, my list of crimes and repugnant traits seem to have no ceiling. I never know what horrible things I'll discover about myself next.

Quote
You are free to return to calling me a horrible person now.

FYI, this is what I was referring to. It's very blown out of proportion to the actual criticism, and it reeks of black-and-white thinking.


And this smacks of irresponsible psychoanalysis of friends, family and lovers in a biased and self-proclaimed state of having been offended. A cardinal sin and we both know it. I'm taking the same College-level Psych classes as you so...

And another thing (and this goes for everyone) I do not come here to be fucking reminded or scolded about what kind of treatment I need--mental, medical or otherwise. Everyone on here has put their personal shit out there at some point or another so don't give me that crap about how I "brought it upon myself" because my shit's uniquely public now. I'm not one to take my ball and go home (in the 6 or so years I've been here, I've only been tempted once and Faust crushed that) but if this becomes a hell where I am poked and prodded and discredited because people are taking liberty and license with regards to my mental diagnoses, (this includes personality disorders, eating disorders, abuse victim mentality, PTSD,stockholm syndrome or whatever other diagnosis du jour you want to point to something I said as evidence to support) my continuing to post here will be fruitless and unpleasant and possibly even toxic and counterproductive to my IRL struggle to find harmony and wellness. After you're all done sticking labels on me, I need to go home, peel them off and go about the business of discovering what's really broken and what's working just fine.

If you think I'm fucking unhinged, feel free to hit that ignore button.


My only regret is that it was too much for people and therefore, ineffective at communicating my point.

Read that to yourself just one more time, please.

Yeah, got that.

Pope Pixie Pickle

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Re: Redemption
« Reply #53 on: April 18, 2013, 06:25:07 pm »
I was just asking for you to consider having some empathy, but hey.

Mesozoic Mister Nigel

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Re: Redemption
« Reply #54 on: April 18, 2013, 06:39:03 pm »
"Quietly backing off" is pretty much the same thing as "ignoring it until it goes away". Not responding is, in fact, disrespectful, regardless of how you want to spin it. It sends a pretty clear message that you don't give a shit and that my feelings and opinions are not important enough to merit a response. If that's not the message you intended to send, you might reconsider your approach.

The monsters inside your head are not my problem. If you can't control yourself, then I won't read your posts. Thanks for letting me know that's what I need to do.

Now I'm spinning shit. I'm a liar too! And no matter what I say about my thought process, your perception of my feelings takes precedence.

I'm sorry but I dealt with all that "If you don't chase me to find out what's wrong, it's because you don't respect me! YES IT IS!" hissy fit bullshit from my mom as a kid. It's a losing battle. Every. Single. Time. If you choose to perceive my letting it drop as an act of disrespect, I'm sorry for your self-induced experience of having been slighted. Can't help ya.


And now I'm claiming victimhood and I'm kind of pathetic. Boy, my list of crimes and repugnant traits seem to have no ceiling. I never know what horrible things I'll discover about myself next.

Quote
You are free to return to calling me a horrible person now.

FYI, this is what I was referring to. It's very blown out of proportion to the actual criticism, and it reeks of black-and-white thinking.


And this smacks of irresponsible psychoanalysis of friends, family and lovers in a biased and self-proclaimed state of having been offended. A cardinal sin and we both know it. I'm taking the same College-level Psych classes as you so...

And another thing (and this goes for everyone) I do not come here to be fucking reminded or scolded about what kind of treatment I need--mental, medical or otherwise. Everyone on here has put their personal shit out there at some point or another so don't give me that crap about how I "brought it upon myself" because my shit's uniquely public now. I'm not one to take my ball and go home (in the 6 or so years I've been here, I've only been tempted once and Faust crushed that) but if this becomes a hell where I am poked and prodded and discredited because people are taking liberty and license with regards to my mental diagnoses, (this includes personality disorders, eating disorders, abuse victim mentality, PTSD,stockholm syndrome or whatever other diagnosis du jour you want to point to something I said as evidence to support) my continuing to post here will be fruitless and unpleasant and possibly even toxic and counterproductive to my IRL struggle to find harmony and wellness. After you're all done sticking labels on me, I need to go home, peel them off and go about the business of discovering what's really broken and what's working just fine.

If you think I'm fucking unhinged, feel free to hit that ignore button.


My only regret is that it was too much for people and therefore, ineffective at communicating my point.

Read that to yourself just one more time, please.

Yeah, got that.

Done.
Im guessing it was January 2007, a meeting in Bethesda, we got a bag of bees and just started smashing them on the desk, Charles Wick said. It was very complicated.


The Good Reverend Roger

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Re: Redemption
« Reply #55 on: April 18, 2013, 06:43:54 pm »
And another thing (and this goes for everyone) I do not come here to be fucking reminded or scolded about what kind of treatment I need--mental, medical or otherwise.

But please consider that other people don't come here to read graphic descriptions of awful shit happening to small children, especially without warning and outside of the general context of the thread.

It's not a free speech issue.  Your post has not been erased or edited.  Free speech applies to both sides of a conversation, and people expressing dismay and/or disgust at a post that was deliberately written to evoke such feelings is also free speech.

I don't know what the purpose of the original shock piece was.  I don't understand why you're surprised at the reaction.  In general terms, you shat in the punchbowl.  This got peoples' attention, but getting their attention and getting your point across are two entirely different steps in communication.  In this case, getting peoples' attention was done so in a manner that was 169% guaranteed to not allow your point to go across.

If I were to walk into a party and loudly start talking about child rape, I imagine I'd get the same results.  In fact, I can't imagine any other result.  And getting pissed off at that result makes no sense at all, because A) you initiated it, and B) no other response was possible.

If you need to shit in the punchbowl, nobody is going to stop you.  If you insist on being pissed off by the reaction to that, though, you're in the wrong.  It's just that simple.  You don't get to be offensive without having people become offended.  It's not their fault, it's yours.
" It's just that Depeche Mode were a bunch of optimistic loveburgers."
- TGRR, shaming himself forever, 7/8/2017

 "Billy, when I say that ethics is our number one priority and safety is also our number one priority, you should take that to mean exactly what I said. Also quality. That's our number one priority as well. Don't look at me that way, you're in the corporate world now and this is how it works."
- TGRR, raising the bar at work.

LMNO

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Re: Redemption
« Reply #56 on: April 18, 2013, 06:50:41 pm »
It appears that she was trying to set the bar really high as to what constitues forgiveness and redemption.  However, the following paragraph was about a politician's acts of contrition, and Nav believed it wasn't enough.

The two are fairly incongruent, and really never made the connection between the two subjects.  If there was a valid parallel to make, or if it was part of a cohesive theme, I could easily (well, not easily) make a case for it.  But I'm really not seeing the connection. 

I'm willing to talk it though further, and in PMs, if you want, Nav.

Cain

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Re: Redemption
« Reply #57 on: April 18, 2013, 06:54:28 pm »
This thread is now about whether Navkat can be redeemed in the eyes on the PD social community.

How meta.

The Good Reverend Roger

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Re: Redemption
« Reply #58 on: April 18, 2013, 06:56:13 pm »
It appears that she was trying to set the bar really high as to what constitues forgiveness and redemption. 

Using the term "child rapists" would have sufficed for that.  It's not like people don't understand the implications of that in the abstract, and the conversation was abstract in nature.

" It's just that Depeche Mode were a bunch of optimistic loveburgers."
- TGRR, shaming himself forever, 7/8/2017

 "Billy, when I say that ethics is our number one priority and safety is also our number one priority, you should take that to mean exactly what I said. Also quality. That's our number one priority as well. Don't look at me that way, you're in the corporate world now and this is how it works."
- TGRR, raising the bar at work.

The Good Reverend Roger

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Re: Redemption
« Reply #59 on: April 18, 2013, 06:56:41 pm »
This thread is now about whether Navkat can be redeemed in the eyes on the PD social community.

How meta.

This thread is pretty much toast. 
" It's just that Depeche Mode were a bunch of optimistic loveburgers."
- TGRR, shaming himself forever, 7/8/2017

 "Billy, when I say that ethics is our number one priority and safety is also our number one priority, you should take that to mean exactly what I said. Also quality. That's our number one priority as well. Don't look at me that way, you're in the corporate world now and this is how it works."
- TGRR, raising the bar at work.