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Turkish Protests

Started by Cain, June 03, 2013, 12:15:38 AM

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Cain

Meanwhile, I see things are getting interesting in Turkey.

Gezi Park is the focal point of the protests and is, in a sense, the straw that broke the camel's back.  This is quite good at explaining why:

QuoteThe demonstrations are already about a lot more than sympathy for condemned trees in a street-widening scheme at the Gezi Park, and have taken on a distinctly anti-government tone. Reasons for the protests I've heard from friends over the past 48 hours include: a reaction to the ruling party's focus on building shopping centers everywhere, even in Istanbul's last patches of green, like the future mall planned for Gezi Park; how the half of the population that didn't vote for the government resents what it sees as its increasingly high-handed, majoritarian, we-know-best style; among secularists, a sense that the ruling party revealed a Islamist agenda that could infringe its lifestyle with sudden new regulations this month on alcohol consumption (my blog on that here); among the 10 per cent Alevi minority, anger at this month's choice of Ottoman Sultan Selim the Grim's name for a third bridge over the Bosphorus, since he killed many Alevis; the general feeling that there is little transparency in what the government plans and does, and that the media is under great pressure not to discuss real events or who benefits financially from projects (one mainstream TV program during last night's was about radiation on Mars!); and above all, a sense of powerlessness, and frustration at the inadequacy of the main political opposition parties, which have left the bulk of secularists of Istanbul with a feeling that they've had no real political representation for years.

The Prime Minister, Recep Tayyip Erdogan, condemned the demonstrators as "extremists running wild".

According to the Guardian:

QuoteThe Turkish Doctors' Association said nearly 1,000 people had been injured in Istanbul on Friday, including six who lost eyes after being hit by gas canisters.

Ozturk Turkdogan, the head of the Turkish Human Rights Association, said hundreds of people in several cities had been injured in the police crackdown and a few hundred people had been arrested. The Dogan news agency said 81 demonstrators were detained in Istanbul.

Turkish police have previously been accused of excessive use of teargas and violence to stop demonstrations, including at this year's May Day rally.

Turkdogan said: "The use of gas at such proportions is unacceptable. It is a danger to public health and as such is a crime. Unfortunately, there isn't a prosecutor brave enough to stand up to police. The people are standing up against Erdogan who is trying to monopolise power and is meddling in all aspects of life."

And:

QuoteTurkey's prime minister, Recep Tayyip Erdogan, was facing the biggest challenge to his 10-year rule this weekend as parts of Istanbul turned into a war zone. Violent clashes took place between riot police and tens of thousands of demonstrators outraged at the heavy-handed response of authorities to an environmental protest on Friday.

The eruption of frustration with Erdogan's government spread to a dozen other Turkish cities overnight and supporters gathered worldwide in Boston, London, Barcelona and Amsterdam to voice solidarity with the protesters.

Police eventually withdrew from the city's central Taksim Square early on Saturday evening, bringing an end to the clashes. By late night thousands of people were celebrating there. "This is it, we won, Gezi Park is ours again", said Burcu Kurhan, 33, one protester who joined the crowds in the inner-city park where peaceful protests started on Monday. "But we hope that Tayyip will have to go!"

Several overturned police and municipal vehicles were covered in graffiti demanding the government resigns.

QuoteThe US has expressed concern over the way the Turkish government is handling the situation, and the British consulate in Istanbul took the unusual step of publicly rebuking the government for overreacting after a teargas canister landed in the consulate gardens.

"Our government actively supports the Syrian opposition, and they constantly call for more democratic rights in Syria. But look what they do to those who oppose their own ideas and policies – they try to shut us up with teargas and violence," said Nejla Gulten, a 32-year-old sociologist. "When the prime minister speaks about women, he never speaks about the problem of violence against women, but only about how many children we should have. He shapes every issue in Turkey to suit himself."

Cain

On the one hand, I can definitely understand not liking the ruling party in Turkey.  Erdogan has distinct authoritarian and personality cult tendencies, which, when mixed in with both Islam and Neoliberalism, create some highly disturbing vibes.

However, historically, secular forces within Turkey have been quite content with authoritarianism, in the name of protecting the state from Islamists and other loonies (usually covertly supported by said secular forces, to justify their rule).

As such, Erdogan has a lot of enemies, in the west and his own military, who would gladly see him crash and burn.  He's been on the UK and US shit list for a while, over Iraq and other things, which explains why both countries have rebuked his conduct and not, say, the Bahraini Monarchy.

I hope the protestors can score a victory here without being used by outside powers and then discarded the moment they no longer benefit said powers agendas...but it's not so often that happens.  At the very least, weakening Erdogan will undermine his chances at obtaining the Presidency, where he could do even more damage to the political institutions of the republic, so there is that.

Junkenstein

First thoughts go to the region at large. With Syria still fucking things up, I can see this as a nice excuse to get some friendly boots on the ground next door.Just in case.Will get into it tomorrow when fresh.
Nine naked Men just walking down the road will cause a heap of trouble for all concerned.

Cardinal Pizza Deliverance.

There was a thing on imgur, yesterday, about the media blackout of the protests and how everyone should Tweet and raise a ruckus and all that jazz to try and get the protesters some help. And then a few hours later it was all about how people were being killed and shit had gotten crazy.
Weevil-Infested Badfun Wrongsex Referee From The 9th Earth
Slick and Deranged Wombat of Manhood Questioning
Hulking Dormouse of Lust and DESPAIR™
Gatling Geyser of Rainbow AIDS

"The only way we can ever change anything is to look in the mirror and find no enemy." - Akala  'Find No Enemy'.

Golden Applesauce

The narrative I've been seeing on twitter is that the after the peaceful protest, the gov't announced it wouldn't destroy that particular park, and then sent in an army of cops to tear gas, beat and kill the protesters that it had publically agreed with. 48 hours later, people are still being gassed, beaten, and killed. Presumably, the protesters that are now outdoors and being beaten are there to protest the treatment of protesters + the government in general more than anything else.

(by "on twitter" I mean "tweets re-tweeted by Neil Gaiman.")
Q: How regularly do you hire 8th graders?
A: We have hired a number of FORMER 8th graders.

Bebek Sincap Ratatosk

Whoooo, Hail Eris, there are Golden Apples flying everywhere here!

I have some friends trapped in the Konak district of Izmir, police violence has continued to escalate here. Last night, police were shooting canisters of tear gas into people's homes, because they were giving refuge to the protesters. Fortunately, here in our village things are quiet and safe. We were drinking with the local cops Saturday night and asked them what they thought and they basically said that there's no way in hell that they would use tear gas, pepper spray or anything else on the locals. (Yes, us and the cops, drinking well past 10 PM... ah Turkey!)

The videos coming out of Izmir, Adana, Ankara, Istanbul and elsewhere are very graphic and there are very obvious examples of police brutality. Reports yesterday indicated that some in the military came out to help the protesters and came under attack by the police forces. In Izmir, the local military base and the military police were handing out gas masks to the protesters.

Cain's point about the secular Kemalists is correct. Both sides are authoritarian. Under the Kemalists, for example, women were forbidden from wearing a head scarf in public schools and universities or at any government job. On the other hand, Erdogan, pushes through capitalistic and conservative policies without any input from the public. However, thats how this particular republic works... people don't get a vote on issues, just a vote on representatives.

On the upside, once the police violence started, Kurds, Conservatives, Liberals, ultranationalists etc etc have all come together. For all its faults, Turks back each other up when the shit hits the fan. This will very likely hurt the AKP in the next election.

Ironically, my passport and new residence visa are at the Immigration Police office in Izmir waiting for me to pick them up... the whole area, though, is surrounded by protesters and cops and the roads are shut down.

Discord, Confusion, Strife... Eris is out in force here.
- I don't see race. I just see cars going around in a circle.

"Back in my day, crazy meant something. Now everyone is crazy" - Charlie Manson

Cain

I also understand that, while a lot of the people dealing with the social media for the protestors do tend to be liberal secularists, the Kemalists have a rather large presence in the background.  I see the MHP, jumped up fascists that they are, are taking advantage of the situation in Parliament.

For those unfamiliar with the Turkish political situation, Craig Murray is a solid starting point:

QuoteFor every secular liberal in Istanbul there are two secular ultra-nationalist militarists. To westerners they stress the secular bit and try to hide the rest, and this works on the uncurious (being uncurious is a required attribute to get employed by the mainstream media). Of course there are decent, liberal, environmentalist protestors and the media will have no difficulty, now they have finally noticed something is happening, in filling our screens with beautiful young women who fit that description, to interview. But that is not all of what is going on here.

There certainly was no more freedom in Turkey before the AKP came to power. Government for decades had been either by the Kemalist military in dictatorship or occasionally by civilian governments they tolerated and controlled. People suddenly have short memories if they think protest was generally tolerated pre-Erdogan, and policy towards the Kurds was massively more vicious.

The military elite dominated society and through corruption they dominated commerce and the economy. The interests of a protected and generally fascist urban upper middle class were the only interests that counted at all. The slightest threat to those interests brought a military coup – again, and again, and again. Religion was barely tolerated, and they allied closely with Israel and the United States.

When Erdogan first came to power it was the best thing that had happened to Turkey for decades. The forgotten people of the Anatolian villages, and the lower middle class of the cities, had a voice and a position in the state for the first time. In individual towns and villages, the military and their clients who had exercised absolute authority had their power suddenly diminished. I witnessed this and it was a new dawn, and it felt joyous.

Then of course Erdogan gradually got sucked in to power, to money, to NATO, to the corruption of his Black Sea mafia and to arrogance. It all went very wrong, as it always seems to. That is where we are now.

Yes of course I want those pretty, genuinely liberal environmentalist girls in the park to take power. But they won't. Look at the hard-eyed fascists behind them. Look at the western politicians licking their lips thinking about the chance to get a nice very right wing, anti-Muslim and pro-Israel government into power.

You can also look at one of my rants about the Turkish "deep state" done a few years back - that should fill you in nicely on what the Kemalists considered an acceptable political system. 

Bebek Sincap Ratatosk

#7
On the nose as usual, Cain.

It's really a battle between two hardline positions, while most of the citizens are much more moderate. The Anatolian middle class felt repressed when they couldn't wear head scarves and were discriminated against in job selection because of their overt Islamic dress (still 'moderate' by most ME Islamic standards). The kruds opression under the ultranationalists wasn't because they were Kurds, as much as it was because they wanted to retain their Kurdish culture, language, laws, beliefs etc. For Kurds that integrated with Turkish society, they had no problems. The Kemalists see "Turkish First" as the ONLY mantra to manage this society of many cultures. You join in with everyone else, or else.

Erdogan, when he came to power worked hard to broker deals and roll back the anti-religious laws. Over the past two years, though, he's ramped up the "moral legislation" and its been a heyday for the secularists to wave like a banner of 'fascism'. Often, he seems to make completely absurd statements, just to rouse support from his base while pissing off all of the moderates and secularists. He still had a lot of support though.

However, after this weekend, with youtube and twitter videos and pictures of obvious police brutality, everyone is very upset. The village I live in is one of the most conservative in the Aegean region (which isn't saying much actually). The villagers are very moderate, but cling to some conservative dress etc. Here, few were against Erdogan/AKP, and few were against the CHP/MHP. This weekend and today, though, everyone is very angry. Busloads of people left from the local town and went to join the protests in Izmir. Most of the people I've talked to aren't being pro-CHP/MHP they're just freaking out because, no matter what their political/religious views, they see the protesters are brothers and sisters and they can't believe the level of violence.

There are always protests in Turkey, often the police respond with a heavy hand. The difference, this time, was the wide visibility due to the Internet and social media. Additionally, while news agencies are not covering the mess... major actors, tv personalities etc are in the streets.

One of the most popular shows on tv here is a long running drama about Sultan Suleiman. There are photos all over turkish facebook of the lead actor (the guy that plays the Sultan) arm and arm with others in the streets. One of their most popular late night talk show hosts, Okan Bayulgen, a outspoken political philosopher has been ranting for days about whats happening. This has thrown a spotlight on stuff thats been ignored for the past couple years.

It may be that the MHP or CHP are manipulating the situation, but Erdogan is not helping matters. This weekend he accused all the protesters of being drunks. He said that no matter what "we have decided" what to do with the park and no protest will change that. He threatened "if they bring 100,000 protesters, we can call 500,000 supporters". He said that new direction had been given to the cops about how to handle the situation, yet some of the worst police brutality has happened since then.

In Istanbul, the police herded hundreds of protesters into a subway station, shut down the service, closed the doors then launched tear gas into the station. Yesterday, for the first time they used real bullets and some protesters are dead (not to mention the ones dead from direct hits with water canons, being shot in the head with tear gas canisters and run over by panzers). Today, he left the country for a four day trip to North Africa and basically said in an interview that the protesters should STFU, because nothing was going to change and that he wasn't a dictator and no violence was used against the protesters.

I was supposed to go to Izmir today to get my passport and visa back from the immigration police. The taxi driver apologized and said we can't get near the place and this morning a taxi cab had a tear gas canister shot into the vehicle.

So, I'm gonna stay here at the beach where everything is quiet.

ETA: And for some real humor:
Syria is advising its citizens to avoid visiting Turkey because its too dangerous. :horrormirth:
http://www.cnn.com/2013/06/03/world/meast/syria-turkey-travel-warning/index.html?hpt=hp_t2
- I don't see race. I just see cars going around in a circle.

"Back in my day, crazy meant something. Now everyone is crazy" - Charlie Manson

Cain

For such a big supporter of the "Arab Spring", Erdogan doesn't seem to realise it was the economic conditions created by the kind of policies he supports , that led to the initial unrest, and that heavy-handed police action was the catalyst for wider political disruption.

He's playing such a dangerous game here, and doesn't even seem to realise it.

Junkenstein

Quote from: Junkenstein on June 03, 2013, 12:34:43 AM
First thoughts go to the region at large. With Syria still fucking things up, I can see this as a nice excuse to get some friendly boots on the ground next door.Just in case.Will get into it tomorrow when fresh.

Just started to see what's up with this. Way off base with this I think.

Would this fall under the generic "Arab Spring" markers yet?

This:
QuoteThen of course Erdogan gradually got sucked in to power, to money, to NATO, to the corruption of his Black Sea mafia and to arrogance. It all went very wrong, as it always seems to. That is where we are now.

Yes of course I want those pretty, genuinely liberal environmentalist girls in the park to take power. But they won't. Look at the hard-eyed fascists behind them. Look at the western politicians licking their lips thinking about the chance to get a nice very right wing, anti-Muslim and pro-Israel government into power.

means I've got a lot more reading to do really.
Nine naked Men just walking down the road will cause a heap of trouble for all concerned.

Cain

It may be factoring in.  Turkey has taken a strong line against Assad's regime, but is it strong enough for the Neocons?  No, of course not, nothing ever is.

That said, you may want to check out the leaked State Department cables from Ankara.  They are, of course, from an American POV, so remember your pinch of salt, but they are nevertheless quite interesting.  Some refer to the corruption within the Turkish state, but I've not found those cables on a cursory search thus far.

Cain

Ah, here's a relevant one:

QuoteThe past six months have seen an increase in cases where the ruling Justice and Development Party (AKP) has used legal and extraordinary channels to intimidate, coerce or attack its political opponents or those who might present a check on its power.  Most of these cases highlighted by the media seem to be within the law or regulation, as the AKP is quick to assert.  However, Turkey's system of government has few checks and balances in place to prevent the abuse of government structures by the executive branch for political objectives, and the AKP is using this to its maximum advantage.  The problem in assessing the impact of all of this, as in the Ergenekon case, is that the "targets" of the AKP -- such as the TGS and the "deep state" themselves -- long exploited the system's authoritarian, weak checks-and-balances nature for their own advantage.  END SUMMARY.

Bebek Sincap Ratatosk

Erdogan believes he has majority support and majority support = democracy and whatever he says, as the democratically elected leader is right and just. I don't know if he's lost his mind, become corrupt with power or is really naive enough to believe what he's saying. Meanwhile President Gul is basically arguing that democracy means more than just elections and that the people should have a right to protest. Since he and Erdogan have been very close allies, this is an interesting development.

Realistically, life in Turkey is good, the economy is good, most people live very free lives (secular or conservative). Just a few months ago, Erdogan actually cut a deal with the PKK to end the violence and bring more freedom to the Kurds. The situation here is far more liberal than in Syria or Lebanon or life under Qaddafi. This would not have happened if the police had not acted so extremely in Istanbul. That extreme behavior is what drove the national response, and once the response started, it brought up everything people didn't like about Erdogan. His new laws on alcohol, his infrastructure projects (which boil down to "I'm gonna pave X and replace it with a shopping mall, new condos etc and you can STFU if you don't like it"), his conservative pro-religious comments... all of it. If the police had not become so violent, the protest would have been confined to a few hundred hippies trying to protect some trees in Istanbul.

Nice cable links also Cain, those definitely hit the nail on the head. On the Syria situation, a large number of the country want to see more action from Ankara to end the mess in Syria, another large group blame AKP for the recent Syrian attacks on the Turks (car bombs) in the east and believe he should NOT be supplying arms to the rebels. Only a very few of his core base has supported his current position on Syria.

Its just another explosive issue among many that Taksim square has been the fuse for.

I don't know if its cognitive dissonance on Erdogan's part, or if he really thinks he is in the right. Either way, I think this will have a long term impact on the AKP in the upcoming elections. For the first time, I have some doubts about him winning the election next year (his term as PM is up, but he's going to run for President).

The Kurds have been very supportive of the AKP, but in an interview with an elderly Kurdish lady in conservative dress today, they asked what she thought and she replied "I want to kill him, give me a bomb and I will shove it up his ass". I don't think this is going the way he thought it would.
- I don't see race. I just see cars going around in a circle.

"Back in my day, crazy meant something. Now everyone is crazy" - Charlie Manson

Bebek Sincap Ratatosk

The mayors of Antayla and Izmir have ordered that no water be given to the police to refill their water cannon vehicles. These are generally liberal/secular areas, but its quickly pitting the police against everyone.
- I don't see race. I just see cars going around in a circle.

"Back in my day, crazy meant something. Now everyone is crazy" - Charlie Manson

Cain

Imgur has a gallery of some of the crowd control weapons being used

http://imgur.com/gallery/1Xung