Prism and Verizon surveillance discussion thread

[The Good Reverend Roger]

I actually strongly suspect this will form a central component of the "Main Core" program, which the NSA and DHS are said to be rapidly updating with current technologies.

Should something major goes down in the USA, BOSS links up with the MAIN CORE database and bam! instant dissident roundup.  MAIN CORE is a meta-database designed to work across government agencies, and in tandem with the advanced predictive software which is no doubt fed by PRISM and UPSTREAM and geolocation tools in most modern phones, you could snag a large number of potentially "difficult" people very quickly.

Ah, the Upcoming Unpleasantness.

[The Good Reverend Roger]

I've been expecting more bombings in places like airport security queues since around the inception of the TSA. I surprised this hasn't happened more really but it seems inevitable to me.

Thing is, terrorists are kind of attention-whorey.  Blowing up shit in the lobby?  Not done, my good man.  SYMBOLIC TARGET OR GTFO.

[Cain]

Yup, in whatever form that may take.

If they can't detect your face, they'll use XKeyscore to try and see what you've been up to in the last few days.  If that doesn't work, they'll check your phone's location, possibly turning it on remotely.  If that doesn't work, they'll use predictive software to guess where you may be going, with information gathered via PRISM and UPSTREAM.

It's a turnkey totalitarian state.  All the tools are there.  It just requires someone to...turn them on.

[The Good Reverend Roger]

Yup, in whatever form that may take.

If they can't detect your face, they'll use XKeyscore to try and see what you've been up to in the last few days.  If that doesn't work, they'll check your phone's location, possibly turning it on remotely.  If that doesn't work, they'll use predictive software to guess where you may be going, with information gathered via PRISM and UPSTREAM.

It's a turnkey totalitarian state.  All the tools are there.  It just requires someone to...turn them on.

Pretty sure it won't be all cool, with jackboots at 2AM.  We're not that awesome.  Pretty sure it will be grinding and boring and therefore as miserable as is humanly possible.

You'll just be unloading groceries from the car, and a squad car will roll up.  They will say that there are questions concerning things you've written on the internet, and would you please come along?  Yes, you will come along, because it wasn't actually a request.

And then everything turns into a tragic series of misunderstandings, and your family never finds out what happened to you.  There will be SCOTUS cases, and all that shit, but already everyone knows that's just a dog & pony show.

[Cain]

Sure.  The only reason for the jackboots in the past is to intimidate and to give you the kind of broad, brute power that is otherwise provided by these systems.  They're unnecessary.  It's an automated dictatorship, no need for a massive (well, more massive) internal state apparatus.  When you know where everyone is or are going, and they're marked by CCTV, forced to either cut themselves off from modern communications or be instantly traceable...all you need are enough bodies to do the collection and throw them into whatever legal blackhole awaits them.  It allows state-wide totalitarian oppression to be carried out by the equivalent of a county sheriff's office.

[Junkenstein]

Yup, in whatever form that may take.

If they can't detect your face, they'll use XKeyscore to try and see what you've been up to in the last few days.  If that doesn't work, they'll check your phone's location, possibly turning it on remotely.  If that doesn't work, they'll use predictive software to guess where you may be going, with information gathered via PRISM and UPSTREAM.

It's a turnkey totalitarian state.  All the tools are there.  It just requires someone to...turn them on.

My logic was if you can't get the symbolic target, go for the big easy one. A single attack in a mass public area fucks shit up for countless more people as well and ties up substantial resources for considerable time. Half a dozen suicide bombers could probably ruin air transport in the UK for a long time striking at security queues in multiple airports over multiple days.

What I forgot was that I'm an idiot. As the bold states this is all there. The only thing telling us that it's off is, well, nothing.

And needless to say an incident like this would get mass public support for exactly this kind of system anyway.

[Mesozoic Mister Nigel]

I actually strongly suspect this will form a central component of the "Main Core" program, which the NSA and DHS are said to be rapidly updating with current technologies.

Should something major goes down in the USA, BOSS links up with the MAIN CORE database and bam! instant dissident roundup.  MAIN CORE is a meta-database designed to work across government agencies, and in tandem with the advanced predictive software which is no doubt fed by PRISM and UPSTREAM and geolocation tools in most modern phones, you could snag a large number of potentially "difficult" people very quickly.

Ah, the Upcoming Unpleasantness.

Of course, we are all just big Negative Nellies and the world is really MUCH nicer than we think it is.

[The Good Reverend Roger]

I actually strongly suspect this will form a central component of the "Main Core" program, which the NSA and DHS are said to be rapidly updating with current technologies.

Should something major goes down in the USA, BOSS links up with the MAIN CORE database and bam! instant dissident roundup.  MAIN CORE is a meta-database designed to work across government agencies, and in tandem with the advanced predictive software which is no doubt fed by PRISM and UPSTREAM and geolocation tools in most modern phones, you could snag a large number of potentially "difficult" people very quickly.

Ah, the Upcoming Unpleasantness.

Of course, we are all just big Negative Nellies and the world is really MUCH nicer than we think it is.

It's just your BAD ATTITUDE.

[P3nT4gR4m]

I'm so going to piss myself if this thing becomes self-aware. I've been praying for zombies, every night, before I lay me down to sleep, since I was about 12 but, fuck it, I'll settle for Terminator 

[Mesozoic Mister Nigel]

I actually strongly suspect this will form a central component of the "Main Core" program, which the NSA and DHS are said to be rapidly updating with current technologies.

Should something major goes down in the USA, BOSS links up with the MAIN CORE database and bam! instant dissident roundup.  MAIN CORE is a meta-database designed to work across government agencies, and in tandem with the advanced predictive software which is no doubt fed by PRISM and UPSTREAM and geolocation tools in most modern phones, you could snag a large number of potentially "difficult" people very quickly.

Ah, the Upcoming Unpleasantness.

Of course, we are all just big Negative Nellies and the world is really MUCH nicer than we think it is.

It's just your BAD ATTITUDE.

Everybody should just CHEER UP, it's not so bad!

http://www.kansascity.com/2013/08/20/4423749/source-of-americas-anger-is-economic.html
http://www.forbes.com/sites/hbsworkingknowledge/2013/08/19/how-income-inequality-affects-individual-behavior/
http://rt.com/usa/incarceration-african-black-prison-606/
http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-505145_162-57576665/foreclosure-rate-spikes-as-homes-come-to-market/
http://www.thenewamerican.com/usnews/constitution/item/14120-obama-signs-2013-ndaa-may-still-arrest-detain-citizens-without-charge

C'mon, everything's fine!

[tyrannosaurus vex]

Yup, in whatever form that may take.

If they can't detect your face, they'll use XKeyscore to try and see what you've been up to in the last few days.  If that doesn't work, they'll check your phone's location, possibly turning it on remotely.  If that doesn't work, they'll use predictive software to guess where you may be going, with information gathered via PRISM and UPSTREAM.

It's a turnkey totalitarian state.  All the tools are there.  It just requires someone to...turn them on.

So THAT'S why my phone's battery can't be removed?

I thought it was to make it "sleek" and "sexy," whatever those words mean in relation to a telephone.

[Cain]

I assume they have the capability, since there is a commercial application for such functions, and the FBI have made use of remotely activating parts of computers and mobiles (especially microphones) before now.

Of course, you can always just leave your phone behind, but I honestly suspect that won't occur to anyone who isn't already interested in information and personal security.

[Cain]

http://abcnews.go.com/blogs/politics/2013/08/white-house-picks-panel-to-review-nsa-programs/

So, to recap, the independent panel includes:

James Clapper - Director of National Intelligence
Mike Morrell - former Deputy Director of the CIA
Richard Clarke - former chief advisor on Homeland Security
Peter Swire - former Obama special assistant for economic policy, and
Cass Sunstein - former collegue of Obama at Chicago Law school, who has argued for rethinking the First Amendment and advocated "cognitive infiltration" of what he sees as conspiracy theorist groups.

Well, I'm sure this wide group of independent thinkers with no ideological, professional or personal stakes at hand will come to an informed conclusion about the extent of NSA illegality.

Edit: added links

[LMNO]

[McGrupp]

http://abcnews.go.com/blogs/politics/2013/08/white-house-picks-panel-to-review-nsa-programs/

So, to recap, the independent panel includes:

James Clapper - Director of National Intelligence
Mike Morrell - former Deputy Director of the CIA
Richard Clarke - former chief advisor on Homeland Security
Peter Swire - former Obama special assistant for economic policy, and
Cass Sunstein - former collegue of Obama at Chicago Law school, who has argued for rethinking the First Amendment and advocated "cognitive infiltration" of what he sees as conspiracy theorist groups.

Well, I'm sure this wide group of independent thinkers with no ideological, professional or personal stakes at hand will come to an informed conclusion about the extent of NSA illegality.

Edit: added links